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    • Aaron3195
    • By Aaron3195 30th Sep 17, 12:36 PM
    • 28Posts
    • 18Thanks
    Aaron3195
    Calculator to add up total price?
    • #1
    • 30th Sep 17, 12:36 PM
    Calculator to add up total price? 30th Sep 17 at 12:36 PM
    I've not had any luck finding the right calculator via google to add up certain things so I know my energy supplier is billing me correctly. I recently moved to Sainsburys Energy and it's a fixed monthly DD of £67 even though I know I'm using less than that in consumption, I'm not sure when they will credit back what I'm owed. My previous supplier (FU) billed based on my monthly meter readings so I'm not used to this different method of a fixed DD.

    Anyway, is there a calculator where I can input my starting read and current read, as well as input the kWh price of electric and gas. I can do this myself but I'm never sure whether to add 5% VAT on top or not, so the numbers get skewed. I can then compare it to what Sainsburys are billing me in future (and credit I get back) for reference. Thanks!
Page 1
    • molerat
    • By molerat 30th Sep 17, 12:54 PM
    • 17,084 Posts
    • 11,239 Thanks
    molerat
    • #2
    • 30th Sep 17, 12:54 PM
    • #2
    • 30th Sep 17, 12:54 PM
    I use my own spreadsheet. The problem you will have with any on line calculator is the gas cv as it varies daily and by region. I download it from the ng web site and work out the average myself. My calculations always come out within 1p of the billed amount.
    www.helpforheroes.org.uk/donations.html
    • Hengus
    • By Hengus 30th Sep 17, 1:31 PM
    • 4,373 Posts
    • 2,566 Thanks
    Hengus
    • #3
    • 30th Sep 17, 1:31 PM
    • #3
    • 30th Sep 17, 1:31 PM
    Meters is a 99p IOS app that I use to monitor my usage and cost. All it requires is the owner to input tariff details and then enter meter readings as and when. It shows the total cost since the last bill and the cost between bills. Once a year’s data has been inputted, the app also compares usage week by week; month by month and year by year.
    • polymaff
    • By polymaff 30th Sep 17, 3:14 PM
    • 1,731 Posts
    • 745 Thanks
    polymaff
    • #4
    • 30th Sep 17, 3:14 PM
    • #4
    • 30th Sep 17, 3:14 PM
    I've not had any luck finding the right calculator via google to add up certain things so I know my energy supplier is billing me correctly. I recently moved to Sainsburys Energy and it's a fixed monthly DD of £67 even though I know I'm using less than that in consumption, I'm not sure when they will credit back what I'm owed. My previous supplier (FU) billed based on my monthly meter readings so I'm not used to this different method of a fixed DD.

    Anyway, is there a calculator where I can input my starting read and current read, as well as input the kWh price of electric and gas. I can do this myself but I'm never sure whether to add 5% VAT on top or not, so the numbers get skewed. I can then compare it to what Sainsburys are billing me in future (and credit I get back) for reference. Thanks!
    Originally posted by Aaron3195
    I think that you don't understand tariffs paid by DD. The amount of the monthly DD does not reflect how much you've used between any two dates. It is one twelfth of what they estimate you will spend in a year.

    The amount isn't fixed, by the way. Sainsbury's - and the others - do monitor and will change your DD as their estimates are recalculated. By coincidence, I received such a notification from Sainsbury's this morning
    • JJ Egan
    • By JJ Egan 30th Sep 17, 5:27 PM
    • 9,742 Posts
    • 4,001 Thanks
    JJ Egan
    • #5
    • 30th Sep 17, 5:27 PM
    • #5
    • 30th Sep 17, 5:27 PM
    < It is one twelfth of what they estimate you will spend in a year.>

    Thats the key ESTIMATE .
    My initial DD was set at £60 pm based upon my estimated amount of usage .If my usage was significantly different ,or i had underestimated my projected usage it would have been raised .As my use is lower than expected it has just dropped to £47 pm .
    The only figures i need are standing charge and unit cost when purchasing a new plan .
    • polymaff
    • By polymaff 30th Sep 17, 6:13 PM
    • 1,731 Posts
    • 745 Thanks
    polymaff
    • #6
    • 30th Sep 17, 6:13 PM
    • #6
    • 30th Sep 17, 6:13 PM
    < It is one twelfth of what they estimate you will spend in a year.>

    Thats the key ESTIMATE
    Originally posted by JJ Egan
    So good I used it twice!

    That dates me

    Incidentally, Sainsbury's put my DD up by 85%, presumably because today is my last day on their kamikaze tariff (gas at 1.61p per kWh! ) and they think I'm the sort of sap who will roll over onto Standard Rate.

    But, Lo! there was a second email from them:

    "Sorry you're leaving us
    Hello Polymaff

    We'll close your account on 18th October 2017, and your new supplier will automatically take over your supply at the same time – so you won't be left without any gas. If things change, we'll let you know."

    Heh, Heh!
    • jack_pott
    • By jack_pott 30th Sep 17, 6:39 PM
    • 4,187 Posts
    • 5,322 Thanks
    jack_pott
    • #7
    • 30th Sep 17, 6:39 PM
    • #7
    • 30th Sep 17, 6:39 PM
    I used to pay by quarterly cheque up until I needed some DDs to open a Santander 123 account, so I've only just discovered what a PITA DDs are.
    I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.
    Friedrich Nietzsche
    • Raxiel
    • By Raxiel 1st Oct 17, 1:05 AM
    • 370 Posts
    • 183 Thanks
    Raxiel
    • #8
    • 1st Oct 17, 1:05 AM
    • #8
    • 1st Oct 17, 1:05 AM
    I created one in google docs when I wasn't convinced my supplier would bill me correctly.

    I put a cleaned up version next to my tariff comparison spreadsheet here:
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1LsLIrx-lkdJ0FOrg3tSn2RB6a8k9_WUKYfXFExVWjIA/pub?output=xlsx

    It should let you drag copy the date lines down to create one for each bill. Fill in the starting reading, and the subsequent readings and their dates, fill in the unit and daily rates (including the 5% VAT) and it should tell you how much each bill should have been. You can also enter what you've paid in on the electricity tab, and it will calculate what your credit/debit balance should be (assuming you started at 0 and your supplier doesn't pay credit interest)

    If you have gas and you want it to be accurate to the penny, you need to fetch the calorific values from national grid for each billing period and get the average, but if you don't need it that accurate you can just put 40 (or an annual average, up to you)

    If you find any mistakes let me know.
    • footyguy
    • By footyguy 1st Oct 17, 11:27 AM
    • 3,683 Posts
    • 1,463 Thanks
    footyguy
    • #9
    • 1st Oct 17, 11:27 AM
    • #9
    • 1st Oct 17, 11:27 AM
    < It is one twelfth of what they estimate you will spend in a year.>

    Thats the key ESTIMATE .
    My initial DD was set at £60 pm based upon my estimated amount of usage .If my usage was significantly different ,or i had underestimated my projected usage it would have been raised .As my use is lower than expected it has just dropped to £47 pm .
    The only figures i need are standing charge and unit cost when purchasing a new plan .
    Originally posted by JJ Egan
    As you clearly over-estimated your consumption when you switched to this supplier, it's worth doing another new comparison now with the more accurate estimate of your anticipated annual consumption.

    Such changes in your anticipated annual consumption can affect what is the best supplier/tariff your you.
    Beware of any possible early exit fees that may apply to to cancelling the agreement early, but these may be almost totally negated by the possible cashack that may be available ty switching anyway
    • JJ Egan
    • By JJ Egan 1st Oct 17, 11:53 AM
    • 9,742 Posts
    • 4,001 Thanks
    JJ Egan
    <As you clearly over-estimated your consumption >
    YES
    <worth doing another new comparison now with the more accurate estimate of your anticipated annual consumption.>

    Why ?my estimated consumption makes no difference . Its the cost of the units and standing charges that make a difference .
    Thats all i look at the actual cost not an estimate of anything .Thats what i have done on multiple transfers since day one .Look at the cheapest cost not the cheapest estimate .
    • footyguy
    • By footyguy 1st Oct 17, 12:01 PM
    • 3,683 Posts
    • 1,463 Thanks
    footyguy
    ...
    <worth doing another new comparison now with the more accurate estimate of your anticipated annual consumption.>

    Why ?my estimated consumption makes no difference . Its the cost of the units and standing charges that make a difference .
    Thats all i look at the actual cost not an estimate of anything .Thats what i have done on multiple transfers since day one .Look at the cheapest cost not the cheapest estimate .
    Originally posted by JJ Egan
    But your 'actual' annual cost is based on an incorrect estimate of your anticipated annual consumption, hence the need to amend that estimate.

    Consult a comparison site to find the best deal for you
    http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/utilities/you-switch-gas-electricity
    • polymaff
    • By polymaff 1st Oct 17, 1:52 PM
    • 1,731 Posts
    • 745 Thanks
    polymaff
    <worth doing another new comparison now with the more accurate estimate of your anticipated annual consumption.>

    my estimated consumption makes no difference
    Originally posted by JJ Egan
    Suppose supplier A offers a really low cost per kWh for gas, but a pretty high cost per kWh for electricity - and supplier B offers the opposite.

    How are you going to decide which is the better supplier without estimated consumption figures?
    • molerat
    • By molerat 1st Oct 17, 2:47 PM
    • 17,084 Posts
    • 11,239 Thanks
    molerat
    <As you clearly over-estimated your consumption >
    YES
    <worth doing another new comparison now with the more accurate estimate of your anticipated annual consumption.>

    Why ?my estimated consumption makes no difference . Its the cost of the units and standing charges that make a difference .
    Thats all i look at the actual cost not an estimate of anything .Thats what i have done on multiple transfers since day one .Look at the cheapest cost not the cheapest estimate .
    Originally posted by JJ Egan
    There are 3 essential components to your annual cost
    1) unit price
    2) daily charge
    3) annual consumption
    All 3 need taking into account when deciding on a supplier. It is also worth doing a high and low usage figure comparison to show how each will affect your overall cost.
    www.helpforheroes.org.uk/donations.html
    • JJ Egan
    • By JJ Egan 2nd Oct 17, 1:33 PM
    • 9,742 Posts
    • 4,001 Thanks
    JJ Egan
    Where does the discount come for annual consumption .
    You seem to be saying that a difference in consumption will make a difference to the unit costs and standing charges .
    If i buy at .03p and pay SC of 20p on a fixed contract how is that going to change if i use more or less . Its not unless their is a discount the more i use .

    <<Suppose supplier A offers a really low cost per kWh for gas, but a pretty high cost per kWh for electricity - and supplier B offers the opposite.

    How are you going to decide which is the better supplier without estimated consumption figures?>>

    Why consumption figures they give you the unit costs and its not tied in to consumption is it .
    In the above scene i would buy gas from A and Electric from B .

    My actual annual cost is only based upon usage + actual standing charge + unit rate .
    The only difference re estimated usage is to the direct debit .

    From what has been posted users are almost saying if i put in a truer estimated annual usage i would get a lower rate . That is a wrong assumption and give or take new suppliers not entering in to the calculation i have always been ahead .

    gas .02.664 S/C 14.312
    elec 12.597 S/C 20.297

    Significantly cheaper with me entering a more accurate estimate ???
    Last edited by JJ Egan; 02-10-2017 at 1:49 PM.
    • polymaff
    • By polymaff 2nd Oct 17, 2:01 PM
    • 1,731 Posts
    • 745 Thanks
    polymaff
    Suppose supplier A offers a really low cost per kWh for gas, but a pretty high cost per kWh for electricity - and supplier B offers the opposite.

    How are you going to decide which is the better supplier without estimated consumption figures?
    Originally posted by polymaff
    Why consumption figures they give you the unit costs and its not tied in to consumption is it .
    In the above scene i would buy gas from A and Electric from B .
    Originally posted by JJ Egan
    Address the actual question - How are you going to decide which is the better supplier.

    And learn how to use the Forum's Quote / Multi-Quote feature.
    Last edited by polymaff; 02-10-2017 at 2:12 PM.
    • Raxiel
    • By Raxiel 2nd Oct 17, 2:29 PM
    • 370 Posts
    • 183 Thanks
    Raxiel
    Estimating consumption will mean that the total price for a given tariff wont match what you end up paying of course.

    But in my experience, the difference between estimated and actual consumption has to differ significantly for the order of cheapest to most expensive to change. I.e. 1/3 or 3x difference.
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