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  • FIRST POST
    • 50Twuncle
    • By 50Twuncle 29th Sep 17, 12:02 PM
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    50Twuncle
    Metacam
    • #1
    • 29th Sep 17, 12:02 PM
    Metacam 29th Sep 17 at 12:02 PM
    We have just had our 13 year old cat - at the vets for dental work (cleaning teeth and removing 3 teeth !)
    He was done, yesterday and today - he has been started on a course of Metacam pain killers
    He doesn't appear to be in any discomfort at the moment.
    We have experience of the side effects of Metacam from another cat - who was put on the same drug by the same vet - he was extremely sick and we stopped the drug !
    Why do vets insist on using the same drug without looking in to history of patients owners ?
    There must be an alternative drug that we can use ?
    Any advice welcome
Page 1
    • annandale
    • By annandale 29th Sep 17, 1:09 PM
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    annandale
    • #2
    • 29th Sep 17, 1:09 PM
    • #2
    • 29th Sep 17, 1:09 PM
    Why would one cat have a reaction to this because another did?
    • elsien
    • By elsien 29th Sep 17, 1:16 PM
    • 15,451 Posts
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    elsien
    • #3
    • 29th Sep 17, 1:16 PM
    • #3
    • 29th Sep 17, 1:16 PM
    I would agree - your other cat having issues isn't relevant to the options for this one. However if you have concerns about the metacam, what did your vet say when you asked about alternative pain killers?
    I know metacam can cause issues for some animals but that isn't always the case - my last dog took it for years with no ill effects.
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
    • Fosterdog
    • By Fosterdog 29th Sep 17, 4:07 PM
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    Fosterdog
    • #4
    • 29th Sep 17, 4:07 PM
    • #4
    • 29th Sep 17, 4:07 PM
    My last but one dog was on metacam for several years with no ill effects, my last dog couldn’t even get through a week on it without projectile vomiting and diarrhoea. Why would the vet even consider the owners history with a drug? It’s the actual animal that needs to be considered and there are hundreds of thousands of animals taking metacam every year with no issues so they would hardly assume that just because it didn’t work for one of your animals it should never be given to your others.
    • Kathy535
    • By Kathy535 29th Sep 17, 9:41 PM
    • 410 Posts
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    Kathy535
    • #5
    • 29th Sep 17, 9:41 PM
    • #5
    • 29th Sep 17, 9:41 PM
    My vet insisted on a liver (?) test before putting my cat on Metacam. He's had no problems, if anything it's given him a new lease of life - he's old and arthritic, within 1 week of metacam he was bringing us mice and rats again. So nice.
    • Fosterdog
    • By Fosterdog 30th Sep 17, 2:02 PM
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    Fosterdog
    • #6
    • 30th Sep 17, 2:02 PM
    • #6
    • 30th Sep 17, 2:02 PM
    My vet insisted on a liver (?) test before putting my cat on Metacam. He's had no problems, if anything it's given him a new lease of life - he's old and arthritic, within 1 week of metacam he was bringing us mice and rats again. So nice.
    Originally posted by Kathy535
    Itís common for them to run tests if it is going to be long term use but for short term use it would be pointless.
    • 50Twuncle
    • By 50Twuncle 30th Sep 17, 3:10 PM
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    50Twuncle
    • #7
    • 30th Sep 17, 3:10 PM
    • #7
    • 30th Sep 17, 3:10 PM
    its only 3 days worth and so far - so good - no reaction at all !!
    • gettingtheresometime
    • By gettingtheresometime 30th Sep 17, 10:43 PM
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    gettingtheresometime
    • #8
    • 30th Sep 17, 10:43 PM
    • #8
    • 30th Sep 17, 10:43 PM
    Metacalm knocks my mutt out for six.

    As he's a beagle I'm torn between the fact he has needed it for pain relief & the quiet life it's given me
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    • 50Twuncle
    • By 50Twuncle 1st Oct 17, 9:05 AM
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    50Twuncle
    • #9
    • 1st Oct 17, 9:05 AM
    • #9
    • 1st Oct 17, 9:05 AM
    Doesn't it see strange that according to the drug manufacturers - it only causes minor side effects on extremely rare occasions ?
    • Merlin's Beard
    • By Merlin's Beard 2nd Oct 17, 10:34 PM
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    Merlin's Beard
    Not really - when it's a drug that gets used in every operation and every sore leg and every elderly arthritic pet in the country near enough, then even if only 1% of animals have side effects then that's still a lot of animals! And the 1% where something went wrong are going to be more vocal about it than the 99% who had no problems and barely remember what it was called.

    Also bear in mind that the words like "common" or "uncommon" are specifically tied into percentages of side effects by regulation from the European Medicines Agency when on a datasheet - the company doesn't really get a choice.
    Grocery Challenge June 17 onward; aim: £100/month; leftovers to date: £8.79
    • 50Twuncle
    • By 50Twuncle 3rd Oct 17, 9:09 AM
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    50Twuncle
    Not really - when it's a drug that gets used in every operation and every sore leg and every elderly arthritic pet in the country near enough, then even if only 1% of animals have side effects then that's still a lot of animals! And the 1% where something went wrong are going to be more vocal about it than the 99% who had no problems and barely remember what it was called.

    Also bear in mind that the words like "common" or "uncommon" are specifically tied into percentages of side effects by regulation from the European Medicines Agency when on a datasheet - the company doesn't really get a choice.
    Originally posted by Merlin's Beard
    Just google "Metacam problems cats" and tell me that this is an uncommon problem ?
    From a US report http://www.optimumchoices.com/images/MetacamRisksInCats.pdf
    Metacam Oral,
    which summarize drug side effects reported by veterinarians.
    Of 842 reports for dogs, 19 cases of kidney failure and no
    deaths were reported. However in 320 cats, 105 cases of
    kidney failure, 48 deaths and 35 cases resulting in euthanasia
    have been reported. This clearly indicates that Metacam poses
    a much greater risk in cats than in dogs

    This is far FAR higher than 1%
    Last edited by 50Twuncle; 03-10-2017 at 9:14 AM.
    • elsien
    • By elsien 3rd Oct 17, 9:56 AM
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    elsien
    Yes, but when I was googling I also found that many issues arose where the cat was given metacam designed for dogs because the feline version wasn't available. That isn't an issue in this country where there is a specific cat version on the market.
    It may also be that with cats the difference between a safe dose and a toxic one is quite small, certainly less so than in dogs so if someone gets it wrong or goes down the cheap online from a less than reputable site route then it is more likely that problems will occur.
    Have you ever googled human medication on US sites? It's enough to put you off taking anything ever again, and they can't all be that unsafe.
    Last edited by elsien; 03-10-2017 at 10:06 AM.
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
    • johannalf88
    • By johannalf88 3rd Oct 17, 1:25 PM
    • 2,787 Posts
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    johannalf88
    It also depends how they take it. My dog has a reaction when taking it orally (couldn't keep anything in either ends!) but he has had it since through an injection (I did discuss my concerns with the vet) and that was fine.

    The vet said is was unlikely to cause problems to his stomach if injected - which makes a lot of sense!
    • ElusiveLucy
    • By ElusiveLucy 3rd Oct 17, 1:31 PM
    • 611 Posts
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    ElusiveLucy
    My cat has been on Metacam for years with no major side effects. She does have to have 6-monthly blood tests though to check her kidney function
    What goes around comes around.....I hope!
    • Shoshannah
    • By Shoshannah 5th Oct 17, 8:10 PM
    • 632 Posts
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    Shoshannah
    You cannot compare the situation with Metacam and cats in the States with that here - different situations.
    • 50Twuncle
    • By 50Twuncle 6th Oct 17, 9:09 AM
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    50Twuncle
    You cannot compare the situation with Metacam and cats in the States with that here - different situations.
    Originally posted by Shoshannah
    Why not ?
    Metacam is metacam
    And Cats are cats all over the world.....?
    • Shoshannah
    • By Shoshannah 6th Oct 17, 5:26 PM
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    • 624 Thanks
    Shoshannah
    No cat formulation is available in the States, and as licensing is limited for cats there are few official dosage recommendations. The dog version has to be used.

    In the UK, we have a licensed cat version of Metacam - lower concentration and easier to dose accurately - with clinically tested dosage guidelines.

    Far more horror stories about its use come out of the States than the UK.
    • Merlin's Beard
    • By Merlin's Beard 6th Oct 17, 8:48 PM
    • 179 Posts
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    Merlin's Beard
    Just google "Metacam problems cats" and tell me that this is an uncommon problem ?
    From a US report http://www.optimumchoices.com/images/MetacamRisksInCats.pdf
    Metacam Oral,
    which summarize drug side effects reported by veterinarians.
    Of 842 reports for dogs, 19 cases of kidney failure and no
    deaths were reported. However in 320 cats, 105 cases of
    kidney failure, 48 deaths and 35 cases resulting in euthanasia
    have been reported. This clearly indicates that Metacam poses
    a much greater risk in cats than in dogs

    This is far FAR higher than 1%
    Originally posted by 50Twuncle
    320 is the number of side effects in cats reported to the FDA, not the total number of cats in the USA on Metacam! So one third (approx) of side effects serious enough to be reported (I don't know what the criteria for reporting is in the US) were renal problems.

    Probably each veterinary practice will see more than 320 cats that receive metacam each year, especially once you include any one-off injections to deal with high temperatures, or for castrates/spays.

    But the FDA probably won't have data on how many animals were on Metacam at the time, as they would have no need for or interest in that data. So they have no real way of working out what percentage of animals taking the drug will experience side effects.
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    • GwylimT
    • By GwylimT 7th Oct 17, 7:43 AM
    • 5,912 Posts
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    GwylimT
    Just google "Metacam problems cats" and tell me that this is an uncommon problem ?
    From a US report http://www.optimumchoices.com/images/MetacamRisksInCats.pdf
    Metacam Oral,
    which summarize drug side effects reported by veterinarians.
    Of 842 reports for dogs, 19 cases of kidney failure and no
    deaths were reported. However in 320 cats, 105 cases of
    kidney failure, 48 deaths and 35 cases resulting in euthanasia
    have been reported. This clearly indicates that Metacam poses
    a much greater risk in cats than in dogs

    This is far FAR higher than 1%
    Originally posted by 50Twuncle
    If you actually read that you will see those cats are being given dog specific metacam.
    • Merlin's Beard
    • By Merlin's Beard 7th Oct 17, 9:03 PM
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    Merlin's Beard
    If you actually read that you will see those cats are being given dog specific metacam.
    Originally posted by GwylimT
    You didn't say anything about the fact that the product was licenced for dogs only, so I didn't feel it needed addressing. It is licenced for cats in the UK, which is why the company can market it as "Metacam for cats" (if the product wasn't licenced for the species then they can't market it at the species - which is why there's no specific Metacam for rabbits or tortoises despite it being the most popular pain relief in those species!)

    When dispensing out of species, a lot of the time the dose will be worked out in ml and the Metacam will be dispensed into a separate bottle and handed out with a normal syringe to avoid confusion - to pre-empt the next question, a 3kg rabbit, a 3kg dog, a 3kg tortoise and a 3kg cat will all need different amounts of Metacam and being able to work out the four different doses is essentially just basic maths, whether the drug on offer is in cat oral concentration, dog oral concentration, or injection concentration. The other way to do is to say "your cat/rabbit/tortoise weighs Xkg, you need to give it the Ykg dose of dog metacam, NOT the Xkg dose" - but that can lead to confusion if you're not careful.
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