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    • LostMeWay
    • By LostMeWay 18th Sep 17, 9:40 PM
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    LostMeWay
    Statute barred and going to court...
    • #1
    • 18th Sep 17, 9:40 PM
    Statute barred and going to court... 18th Sep 17 at 9:40 PM
    Evening all, hope this is in the correct place.

    I'll try and keep it simple.

    Got myself into about £20K of debt about 10 years ago. Have worked my !!! off and have more or less paid the most of it off.

    However, I had a loan from Welcome Finance from about Feb 2008 (according to recent court papers I received) which has recently surfaced. Think the loan was originally for £6K but according to the recent court papers the outstanding amount is/was now £2047.65

    Once I defaulted on the loan from Welcome it was passed to a few collection agencies. I remember making regular payments to one of them but then for one reason or another I ceased payments. Not big or clever I know.

    My first question is, is the statute barred 6 year time frame from when I made the last payment to Welcome Finance, when I defaulted with Welcome Finance or when I made the last payment to whatever debt collection company Welcome sold it to? Think I know the answer hence my second question.

    Received court papers from Shoosmith solicitors working on behalf of PRA Group who I assume have bought the Welcome debt from somewhere or someone.

    I have 28 days to respond to either dispute, counter claim or accept liability.

    The court papers are saying the amount they INTEND to apply to the small claims court is £2675.

    £2047 plus £517 interest and £110 court fees. So a total of £2675

    If the debt is not statute barred which I don't think it will be, is my best plan of action to get in contact via writing to Shoosmiths or the PRA Group and try and negotiate a reduced full and final settlement figure BEFORE sending back 'acceptance of liability' to the court. Or should I accept the debt to the court then try and negotiate a reduced full and final settlement.

    Any help or advice much appreciated. Thanks for reading.
Page 2
    • fatbelly
    • By fatbelly 16th Oct 17, 2:23 PM
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    fatbelly
    I had a case recently that had been stayed for 6 years I think. Then the creditor woke up, went back to court, got a ccj and we bunged it in a DRO with all the client's other debts!
    • LostMeWay
    • By LostMeWay 17th Oct 17, 10:23 PM
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    LostMeWay
    So my case has been listed at the local court for early next year....

    Is that it then? Do I have to wait until this date to find out if it's statute barred or is there communication between myself and the DCA in the meantime?

    Thanks in advance....
    • fatbelly
    • By fatbelly 17th Oct 17, 10:57 PM
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    fatbelly
    So my case has been listed at the local court for early next year....

    Is that it then? Do I have to wait until this date to find out if it's statute barred or is there communication between myself and the DCA in the meantime?

    Thanks in advance....
    Originally posted by LostMeWay
    Yes, the court will make a decision on it in the hearing.

    The other side should send you a copy of their evidence ahead of that date.
    • LostMeWay
    • By LostMeWay 18th Oct 17, 7:16 AM
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    LostMeWay
    So between now and the date of the court hearing, I could receive evidence to prove the debt is legally enforceable. If this does happen, then try and negotiate a settlement directly out of court? Would prefer to avoid any appearance at the court.

    If I didn't receive any evidence I'm assuming this would be a good thing?

    Also if there was evidence, how soon could I expect to receive it?

    Thanks for all your help fatbelly and everyone else. Really do appreciate it.
    • StopIt
    • By StopIt 18th Oct 17, 7:37 AM
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    StopIt
    So between now and the date of the court hearing, I could receive evidence to prove the debt is legally enforceable. If this does happen, then try and negotiate a settlement directly out of court? Would prefer to avoid any appearance at the court.

    If I didn't receive any evidence I'm assuming this would be a good thing?

    Also if there was evidence, how soon could I expect to receive it?

    Thanks for all your help fatbelly and everyone else. Really do appreciate it.
    Originally posted by LostMeWay

    You're hoping that you don't receive evidence, as that means the court would accept your defence.


    If you do, yes, you'll have the ability to contact the DCA and arrange something out of court, but remember at this point they have leverage, so may want a higher settlement than you may want it to be.


    As for timescales? It depends on how proactive the DCA wants to be. You may get evidence in a few weeks, otherwise expect nothing until the last minute.
    • fatbelly
    • By fatbelly 18th Oct 17, 8:02 AM
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    fatbelly
    I think it's supposed to come a minimum of 14 days before the hearing, but that's me just working from memory.
    • LostMeWay
    • By LostMeWay 18th Oct 17, 9:08 AM
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    LostMeWay
    Honestly would be lost without the help and advice on here. So thank you.

    Last question...

    If I receive evidence they can enforce the debt and as you've already said this gives them more leverage over receiving a higher final settlement figure.

    Can I still work out a payment plan with them outside of court action or anything short of a full and final settlement they would proceed with court action.

    i.e Could I offer them if need be £1K up front then x amount over y months outside court?
    • StopIt
    • By StopIt 18th Oct 17, 9:14 AM
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    StopIt
    Honestly would be lost without the help and advice on here. So thank you.

    Last question...

    If I receive evidence they can enforce the debt and as you've already said this gives them more leverage over receiving a higher final settlement figure.

    Can I still work out a payment plan with them outside of court action or anything short of a full and final settlement they would proceed with court action.

    i.e Could I offer them if need be £1K up front then x amount over y months outside court?
    Originally posted by LostMeWay

    That really depends on the DCA, and I don't think anyone here can realistically anticipate what they would accept to settle this out of court.


    The only thing you can do in that circumstance is offer what you can, and see what they say.
    • LostMeWay
    • By LostMeWay 18th Oct 17, 6:21 PM
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    LostMeWay
    If it's settled outside of court which satisfies the DCA, will it affect my credit score/file in any way?

    I've read about settled and partially settled accounts been recorded on some credit reports.

    Is this a good or bad thing considering there's absolutely no mention of the debt currently on my credit report....
    • fatbelly
    • By fatbelly 18th Oct 17, 6:58 PM
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    fatbelly
    If it's settled outside of court which satisfies the DCA, will it affect my credit score/file in any way?

    I've read about settled and partially settled accounts been recorded on some credit reports.

    Is this a good or bad thing considering there's absolutely no mention of the debt currently on my credit report....
    Originally posted by LostMeWay
    In that scenario, the claimant lets the court know that the matter is settled and so there is no ccj.

    The entry dropped off your credit file after 6 years so it won't reappear.

    I was right about the 14-day rule:

    standard directions’ means –

    (i) a direction that each party shall, at least 14 days before the date fixed for the final hearing, file and serve on every other party copies of all documents (including any expert’s report) on which he intends to rely at the hearing;
    so you'll have at least 14days to see if they can produce valid evidence and if necessary try to settle pre-hearing
    • LostMeWay
    • By LostMeWay 23rd Oct 17, 8:40 PM
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    LostMeWay
    What actual documents/evidence does the DCA have to provide me with to prove that the debt is indeed legally enforceable?

    Original credit agreement? Default notice? Proof that it's not statute barred?

    Do they send any evidence direct to me or to the court and then the court forwards it to me?
    • fatbelly
    • By fatbelly 23rd Oct 17, 9:00 PM
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    fatbelly
    The phrase is 'fie and serve'

    file = send to the court
    serve = send to you

    You have defended the claim on the ground that it is statute barred. They need to prove that you acknowledged the debt in the 6 years before the claim. Or that the 'cause of action' was less than 6 years before the claim
    • LostMeWay
    • By LostMeWay 23rd Oct 17, 9:12 PM
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    LostMeWay
    So all they have to provide to legally enforce the debt is evidence that in the last 6 years I've acknowledged the debt in writing or made a payment? Nothing else.
    • fatbelly
    • By fatbelly 23rd Oct 17, 11:04 PM
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    fatbelly
    6 Oct - ' I've disputed the debt on the grounds that it's statute barred.'

    So they need to convince a judge that it isn't
    • LostMeWay
    • By LostMeWay 9th Nov 17, 9:37 AM
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    LostMeWay
    Morning.

    My case is listed for the 8th of January 2018.

    Think it was fatbelly that said any evidence has to be produced to the court and myself 14 days before the hearing.

    So I emailed the court asking what the last date evidence could be produced taking the Christmas break into consideration.

    This was the reply I got-

    Good Morning

    As this case has been listed for a dispute at court any evidence can be used on the morning of court. If there is any additional evidence sent to the court before the hearing this should be sent to yourself as well


    Is this correct that they have right up until the hearing to produce any evidence and I wouldn't have any prior warning? I'm in Northern Ireland so I don't know if that makes any difference or not.

    Thanks in advance.
    • LostMeWay
    • By LostMeWay 13th Nov 17, 2:29 PM
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    LostMeWay
    Bump...Bump
    • StopIt
    • By StopIt 13th Nov 17, 2:36 PM
    • 1,449 Posts
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    StopIt
    Morning.

    My case is listed for the 8th of January 2018.

    Think it was fatbelly that said any evidence has to be produced to the court and myself 14 days before the hearing.

    So I emailed the court asking what the last date evidence could be produced taking the Christmas break into consideration.

    This was the reply I got-

    Good Morning

    As this case has been listed for a dispute at court any evidence can be used on the morning of court. If there is any additional evidence sent to the court before the hearing this should be sent to yourself as well


    Is this correct that they have right up until the hearing to produce any evidence and I wouldn't have any prior warning? I'm in Northern Ireland so I don't know if that makes any difference or not.

    Thanks in advance.
    Originally posted by LostMeWay

    I think the reply was a little confused.


    I think the refer to the current evidence as the court filing that the judge will review, and you've been sent as part of the court filing and serving procedure.


    Further evidence, would be the response to your defence and they would need to send that to you 14 days before the court date. I think with Xmas in the way you can potentially add 2 days for the bank holidays, but don't quote me.
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    • LostMeWay
    • By LostMeWay 1st Dec 17, 9:36 PM
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    LostMeWay
    Evening. So it seems that the debt is legally enforceable as I've received paperwork showing/proving I've made a payment about 5.5 years ago.

    So any help and advice on how I now approach the situation and what to say with regards to hopefully getting this settled outside court is very much appreciated.

    If it did go to court, how and when is the actual CCJ served? Is it only served if I failed to pay what I agreed with the court I would pay or is it served once it has been proved to the court it's legally enforceable regardless what I pay or don't pay?

    They are claiming for £2047.65 (original debt amount) £517.44 in interest and £110.00 court fee. So a grand total of £2675.09

    So is £2675.09 the number I'm trying to bargain and negotiate from or is the interest and court fee they added just the DCA trying their luck?

    Thank you in advance.
    • Karonher
    • By Karonher 1st Dec 17, 11:04 PM
    • 439 Posts
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    Karonher
    And yes, if they produce evidence that the debt isn't statute barred, you'll be given the right to reply. By that point it's likely that they'll push a CCJ through and you'll have 30 days to pay to avoid it going on your credit files for 6 years.[/QUOTE]

    This is a previous comment from fatbelly regarding paying and whether or not you will get a CCJ
    Getting ready for Christmas 2017

    Aiming to make £4,500 online in 2017.
    • fatbelly
    • By fatbelly 2nd Dec 17, 7:54 AM
    • 11,638 Posts
    • 8,774 Thanks
    fatbelly
    And yes, if they produce evidence that the debt isn't statute barred, you'll be given the right to reply. By that point it's likely that they'll push a CCJ through and you'll have 30 days to pay to avoid it going on your credit files for 6 years.

    This is a previous comment from fatbelly regarding paying and whether or not you will get a CCJ
    Originally posted by Karonher
    Doesn't sound like me. I wouldn't normally talk about 'pushing a ccj through'

    OP - the first thing is do you accept that you made that payment? Creditors have been known to invent payments, and to pass off internal transactions as a payment by you.

    If you do, and the statute barred angle was your only defence, then you should probably engage now to reach agreement on paying this off with a lump sum, or by instalments.

    If you want an instalment arrangement, but also want to avoid a ccj, then a Tomlin Order may be the way forward. The creditor may agree to provide the paperwork for this or I have seen help given with Tomlin Orders over on

    http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/forumdisplay.php?105-Received-a-Court-Claim

    8% statutory interest and legitimate costs are allowable.

    I'm sorry it has worked out like this.

    Edit: the quote was StopIt's from post#20. Me and StopIt are actually two different people, despite the rumours.
    Last edited by fatbelly; 02-12-2017 at 2:09 PM. Reason: found quote
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