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Results: Would you like to be able to opt out of Credit Reference Databases ?

YES

63.16% • 12 votes

no

36.84% • 7 votes

You may not vote on this poll

19 votes in total.

  • FIRST POST
    • Dataless
    • By Dataless 14th Sep 17, 1:36 PM
    • 7Posts
    • 7Thanks
    Dataless
    Equifax Scandal Has it gone too far?
    • #1
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:36 PM
    Equifax Scandal Has it gone too far? 14th Sep 17 at 1:36 PM
    You might have heard about the Equifax Data Giveaway scandal

    forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5710019

    However, there is something you might not have heard

    "Three Equifax Inc. senior executives sold shares worth almost $1.8 million in the days after the company discovered a security breach that may have compromised information on about 143 million U.S. consumers."

    They SAY they did not know, REALLY!

    Honestly, how far does it have to go before people realise that this system has gone way beyond the scope of credit checking or even address verification.

    You are forced to give your data (via voters roll) or else face threat of a visit and fine, you can opt out if you have "good reason" in which case your data is provided but with a flag.

    Your data is sold at around £40 per thousand records, so your data costs 4p, it is then matched with a plethora of other records, if you are a company director, that is "connected", if you own your home, that is "connected", soon the Land Registry data will be sold off and that will be connected.

    Some is already, go to Zoopla and they will connect your address with the last sale and how much your home sold for, which tells people how long you have lived at your current address.

    One aspect I have a real problem with is the way Equifax adds additional data it obtains from Company A and say Company B and how it then sells that data to other Equifax Customers.

    As a citizen, it seems you have no rights in this trading of your data

    You can't opt out, your consent is not explicitly provided and you have no control about the types of company getting the data or the purpose they are using it for.

    So it seems to me that the only way to opt out is to become a non-citizen and not provide data in the first place, but you can't avoid your data being shared by ISP's, Energy companies etc.

    In fact I heard that the Energy companies are creating a new database of customers and sharing data between them, you can opt out but only after you have given your data and of course it has been shared, so again you just get a flag, your data is still shared.

    I have no problem with a credit reference database, the purpose being if you take credit, say buy a mobile phone, of course the company might want to check your credit history before giving you credit.

    I do not see the need for TalkTalk to give Equifax data on its 8 million customers every month, when Sky can just verify your details by taking a £5 charge on sign up and crediting that to your account. Of course TalkTalk do this for their own benefit, they get free credit checking in return for giving your data away. There is no consent, no opt out at TalkTalk, no privacy no choice.

    I feel that we should have a choice, there is no credit risk to TalkTalk, if you do not pay you are cut off and a charge is made to your account. If they wanted to they could make you pay 3 months upfront, but no. Even if you prepay a year upfront, they share your data every month.

    I asked the ICO about this and the person I got through to said "well it is credit reference agencies, we do not go up against them, they tell the FCA to tell us to back off" they said "Well the credit reference data is already in the public domain isn't it" er NO, but they said "it might as well be"

    Now you may not think this is that bad but that is probably because you have never worked with a big relational database and do not know how easy it is to "connect data".

    Add a bit of social media tracking and the picture is complete, this is so easy you would be shocked.

    The Government has already tried to sell off your medical data, to 3rd parties, supposedly anonymously, but combining this data with data that is already out there.

    Soon after you will have companies knowing you had a dose of the clap (A74.9), that you are an alcoholic (305) and you have a history of cancer (C85.9). All done nicely by codes, and connecting the dots.

    Surely it is time to reign in what for me is the "wild west" in abuse of data, starting with a right to truly opt out of the whole credit reference system, accepting that this may mean some companies may decline to do business with you or impose additional conditions on your contract with them, e.g. a Guarantor, or a pre-payment.

    Again, I have no problem with a credit reference database being used for the intended purpose, i.e. to check your credit, IF YOU CONSENT, what I have a problem with is data being provided without your explicit consent, without option to opt out, with no control over this data or rights to have it deleted forever and audited to have been deleted.

    What I have a problem with is alerts being able to be put on your data so customers of Equifax can have a "big brother" view of you and for the data to be provided to these 3rd parties without knowledge of the citizen.

    I also object to a sign up process that refers to to war and peace terms and conditions which cannot realistically be read or understood or the reference to a web page that says "we take your data and share it, do not complain because it is for your own good and besides you can't stop us".



    I want to find an MP who might be interested in producing some legislation or amendment to privacy or data protection laws, can anyone suggest an MP who might be supportive?
Page 1
    • IAmWales
    • By IAmWales 14th Sep 17, 2:01 PM
    • 1,223 Posts
    • 2,586 Thanks
    IAmWales
    • #2
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:01 PM
    • #2
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:01 PM
    Lost the will to live after the first few paragraphs.

    If you want anybody to take you seriously you need to drastically edit your post.
    • joeypesci
    • By joeypesci 14th Sep 17, 2:02 PM
    • 379 Posts
    • 120 Thanks
    joeypesci
    • #3
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:02 PM
    • #3
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:02 PM
    Can't answer but data protection laws are changing this year I believe it is, anyway.
    • RG2015
    • By RG2015 14th Sep 17, 2:12 PM
    • 297 Posts
    • 106 Thanks
    RG2015
    • #4
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:12 PM
    • #4
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:12 PM
    Lost the will to live after the first few paragraphs.

    If you want anybody to take you seriously you need to drastically edit your post.
    Originally posted by IAmWales
    It is a very good post and if you are interested in how we are all being spied upon you should read it in full.

    If you are not interested then an edited post will not suddenly make you interested.
    • Ant.Evs
    • By Ant.Evs 14th Sep 17, 2:13 PM
    • 94 Posts
    • 58 Thanks
    Ant.Evs
    • #5
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:13 PM
    • #5
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:13 PM
    I fear this was written on a PC under the stairs with a tin foil hat on.
    There are so many innacuracies in this post it reads as absolute bonkers.
    If you dont want your information to be given to credit reference agencies then dont get credit or services which use them

    Granted i cant see your point on one or two things but seriously i couldnt give two hoots. I could be run over by a bus tomorrow and would be pretty peeved at the pearly gates or the tunnel to hell if i realised i spent all my time worrying stuff like this!

    Get out. Have fun and quit taking life so seriously.
    • Dataless
    • By Dataless 14th Sep 17, 3:06 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    Dataless
    • #6
    • 14th Sep 17, 3:06 PM
    • #6
    • 14th Sep 17, 3:06 PM
    I fear this was written on a PC under the stairs with a tin foil hat on.
    There are so many innacuracies in this post it reads as absolute bonkers.
    If you dont want your information to be given to credit reference agencies then dont get credit or services which use them

    Granted i cant see your point on one or two things but seriously i couldnt give two hoots. I could be run over by a bus tomorrow and would be pretty peeved at the pearly gates or the tunnel to hell if i realised i spent all my time worrying stuff like this!

    Get out. Have fun and quit taking life so seriously.
    Originally posted by Ant.Evs
    No tin foil hat, nothin inaccurate, just reality.

    You seem to miss my point, I have never taken credit nor do I want to, but I am unable to retain my privacy because some insider dealing corporate scum (as reported) make a fortune trading my data in an abusive way and I have no control of my data.

    My data is given to them without my consent by the local council for 4p and by talktalk and anybody else who pays Equifax.

    Now it does not bother you and that is fine, but there may come a time when it does or you discover that a decision was made about you that prevented you doing what you planned. One day soon your inurance may go up, or worse still you may be denied insurance, for no fault of your own, just because your Dad had Cancer or you used ot have a drink problem, these are just two of thousands of examples.

    Maybe it is because I work with data and see the cavaliar abuse of it that I am more sensitive than most, but I believe that the intention of the data protection act was that we could have a reasonable expectation of privacy and that I could control it.

    It seems that Credit Reference Databases have a white card to do anything they want.

    Anybody points it out is automatically tin foil brigade.
    • Dataless
    • By Dataless 14th Sep 17, 3:07 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    Dataless
    • #7
    • 14th Sep 17, 3:07 PM
    • #7
    • 14th Sep 17, 3:07 PM
    Can't answer but data protection laws are changing this year I believe it is, anyway.
    Originally posted by joeypesci
    Thanks I heard that, was thinking it would be good for MP to table an amendment.
    • badmemory
    • By badmemory 14th Sep 17, 3:10 PM
    • 681 Posts
    • 668 Thanks
    badmemory
    • #8
    • 14th Sep 17, 3:10 PM
    • #8
    • 14th Sep 17, 3:10 PM
    I fear this was written on a PC under the stairs with a tin foil hat on.
    There are so many innacuracies in this post it reads as absolute bonkers.
    If you dont want your information to be given to credit reference agencies then dont get credit or services which use them

    Granted i cant see your point on one or two things but seriously i couldnt give two hoots. I could be run over by a bus tomorrow and would be pretty peeved at the pearly gates or the tunnel to hell if i realised i spent all my time worrying stuff like this!

    Get out. Have fun and quit taking life so seriously.
    Originally posted by Ant.Evs
    Please share with us the inaccuracies, I would seriously like to know. You do know that some UK info has been breached too?
    • RG2015
    • By RG2015 14th Sep 17, 3:26 PM
    • 297 Posts
    • 106 Thanks
    RG2015
    • #9
    • 14th Sep 17, 3:26 PM
    • #9
    • 14th Sep 17, 3:26 PM
    I am unable to retain my privacy because some insider dealing corporate scum (as reported) make a fortune trading my data in an abusive way.

    One day soon your insurance may go up, or worse still you may be denied insurance, for no fault of your own, just because your Dad had Cancer.
    Originally posted by Dataless
    Your first post was good but you do nothing to enhance your case by using terms like corporate scum or bringing in emotive topics such as cancer.

    Also, whilst I applaud your first post I will not be losing any sleep over the whole issue.
    • badmemory
    • By badmemory 14th Sep 17, 6:25 PM
    • 681 Posts
    • 668 Thanks
    badmemory
    I would have thought that a senior executive that used his position & inside knowledge to save himself from losing money before it became public (insider trading) would be the perfect person to describe as corporate scum. I expect if you had shares in this company your language would be even stronger.
    • Dataless
    • By Dataless 14th Sep 17, 6:48 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    Dataless
    Well for me it is a scumbag thing to do, to not tell the public for 2 MONTHS but to sell shares (cashing in on share price before it crashes) 3 days after they discover breach.

    bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-09-07/three-equifax-executives-sold-stock-before-revealing-cyber-hack

    Cancer IS emotive, yet in the US it is already happening

    Cheap DNA Testing Is Giving Some Insurers Even More Ways To Deny Coverage

    techdirt.com/articles/20170522/17343837426/cheap-dna-testing-is-giving-some-insurers-even-more-ways-to-deny-coverage-updated.shtml

    If You Want Life Insurance, Think Twice Before Getting A Genetic Test

    fastcompany.com/3055710/if-you-want-life-insurance-think-twice-before-getting-genetic-testing

    Why Patients Are Getting Hit With Surprise Bills After Genetic Testing

    fastcompany.com/3059072/why-patients-are-getting-hit-with-surprise-bills-after-genetic-testing

    So I hear you saying well that will not happen here, well it was the insurance industry that was pressuring the Government to sell them the NHS data

    Now it is just data right, WRONG

    Go to ancestory.com, very nice you can create a lovely record of your family tree EXCEPT that website is not only selling your data but taking ownership of it!!

    "Like millions of others before you, you’re curious about your ancestral background. You’ve purchased a DNA testing kit from Ancestry.com or received one as a gift. Soon you’ll discover your country or countries of family origin – but did you read the fine print? If you didn’t, you’re not alone, but you may be surprised, and perhaps dismayed, to learn that in that agreement to AncestryDNA’s terms, Ancestry.com owns the rights to your DNA forever."

    Your DNA and Genetic Information May Be Used Against You Or a Blood Relative

    thedailyvoicenews.com/2017/05/26/the-unsettling-surprise-of-ancestry-dna-testing/

    We have got to get away from this drip drip of consent on the "I don't mind that" aspect only to find later it has all been used against youm usually after being combined with other data.

    The one thing we have to preserve is explicit consent, which much only be used for the purpose we authorise and only with the company we give it you, no sharing with 3rd parties for ANY reason without explicit consent on a per diem basis. The right to control our data and to be able to withhold and withdraw our data is and will become more critical.
    • cjmillsnun
    • By cjmillsnun 14th Sep 17, 7:51 PM
    • 178 Posts
    • 113 Thanks
    cjmillsnun
    And those rights (your rights) are about to be strengthened. under the new data protection laws from the EU which the government have confirmed the UK will adopt in full despite Brexit.
    Last edited by cjmillsnun; 14-09-2017 at 8:21 PM.
    • Dataless
    • By Dataless 14th Sep 17, 11:22 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    Dataless
    The most appealing aspect of new rules are that they can fine a company 5% of their worldwide turnover as a fine, however, as the ICO are not even using the paltry £500k now I am not that hopeful.

    The new changes will not give us the ability to stop credit reference databases from using our data without our consent and for purposes we do not approve.
    • d123
    • By d123 15th Sep 17, 8:44 PM
    • 6,573 Posts
    • 4,215 Thanks
    d123
    Lost the will to live after the first few paragraphs.

    If you want anybody to take you seriously you need to drastically edit your post.
    Originally posted by IAmWales
    You did well, I think I started losing the will after about 5 lines...

    It’s like

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