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    • the_midnight_Wolfboy
    • By the_midnight_Wolfboy 14th Sep 17, 1:27 PM
    • 14Posts
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    the_midnight_Wolfboy
    Recently moved into house, dropped kerb application refused. What can I do?
    • #1
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:27 PM
    Recently moved into house, dropped kerb application refused. What can I do? 14th Sep 17 at 1:27 PM
    Hi all,

    Sorry I wasn't sure if this topic should go in here or in motoring

    I recently bought a house in Southall, needs quite a lot of work (as most houses do here), and I thought getting a dropped kerb in front of my house would be a "quick win"

    My application was refused and has today been denied on appeal by Ealing council because my driveway depth is 4.11m, which falls below the 4.20m requirement.

    What frustrates me is identical houses with identical driveways either side of my house have dropped kerbs, in fact the majority of the houses on the street have dropped kerbs with the same driveways.

    They say that there was a recent policy change so the other houses don't set precedent - but surely this defeats the purpose of setting precedent in the first place?

    They cite the reason as a safety concern because of potential protruding vehicles, I can understand their opinion but I do feel that the decision is slightly unfair? Or am I being unrealistic here?
Page 1
    • PasturesNew
    • By PasturesNew 14th Sep 17, 1:32 PM
    • 60,688 Posts
    • 354,784 Thanks
    PasturesNew
    • #2
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:32 PM
    • #2
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:32 PM
    I think you're being unrealistic. Yes, people did it in the past. Now they have a strict criteria and you fall short of it by a small amount - but rules are rules.

    The rule was created as they believed there was a need, therefore the rule needs to be followed from the date it was started. They can't go back and make the neighbours remove their kerbs because when they did it it was allowed.

    A precedent is not something in law ... just a clue/indicator as to whether you MIGHT be able to also do something - but, the current rules at the time you try to do something will be taken into account, not the old rules that were in place when others did it.

    Who measured the gap? Is it 100% correct? Can you find/squeeze the 0.1m required?
    • spadoosh
    • By spadoosh 14th Sep 17, 1:36 PM
    • 4,547 Posts
    • 5,978 Thanks
    spadoosh
    • #3
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:36 PM
    • #3
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:36 PM
    Can you not just drive up the kerb? All be it a bit slower than you would a dropped kerb.
    Don't be angry!
    • the_midnight_Wolfboy
    • By the_midnight_Wolfboy 14th Sep 17, 1:39 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    the_midnight_Wolfboy
    • #4
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:39 PM
    • #4
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:39 PM
    Unfortunately I can't drive up the kerb as that is an offense punishable by fine in the Borough of Ealing, also cars could then park infront of my drive and block me in.

    My options are:
    1) Stop complaining
    2) Speak to a local councilor
    3) Appeal to planning inspectorate
    4) Find driveways approved recently with a shorter depth and use those as leverage
    5) Drop the kerb myself and hope it doesn't get noticed / reported for 4 years
    • PField
    • By PField 14th Sep 17, 1:53 PM
    • 88 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    PField
    • #5
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:53 PM
    • #5
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:53 PM
    Don't think 5) is a good idea and I don't think 4 years will save you either as it not alteration to your property.
    • davidmcn
    • By davidmcn 14th Sep 17, 1:54 PM
    • 6,086 Posts
    • 5,834 Thanks
    davidmcn
    • #6
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:54 PM
    • #6
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:54 PM
    My options are:
    1) Stop complaining
    2) Speak to a local councilor
    3) Appeal to planning inspectorate
    4) Find driveways approved recently with a shorter depth and use those as leverage
    5) Drop the kerb myself and hope it doesn't get noticed / reported for 4 years
    Originally posted by the_midnight_Wolfboy
    6) Move the house further away from the kerb.
    • sheff6107
    • By sheff6107 14th Sep 17, 1:55 PM
    • 442 Posts
    • 293 Thanks
    sheff6107
    • #7
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:55 PM
    • #7
    • 14th Sep 17, 1:55 PM
    Buy a metal ramp!
    • the_midnight_Wolfboy
    • By the_midnight_Wolfboy 14th Sep 17, 2:03 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    the_midnight_Wolfboy
    • #8
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:03 PM
    • #8
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:03 PM
    Option 6 seems semi feasible, I could tarmac my driveway 9cm further out, or based on Pythagoras theory if I build enough of a slope I could fit in 4.20m ..I think I would need a slope that goes 1.05m high...
    • teddysmum
    • By teddysmum 14th Sep 17, 2:05 PM
    • 8,514 Posts
    • 5,044 Thanks
    teddysmum
    • #9
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:05 PM
    • #9
    • 14th Sep 17, 2:05 PM
    Buy a metal ramp!
    Originally posted by sheff6107
    That would not grant right of way across the pavement.
    • rentmekid
    • By rentmekid 14th Sep 17, 2:16 PM
    • 74 Posts
    • 29 Thanks
    rentmekid
    every problem has a solution.


    can you send a picture of your driveway
    • bouicca21
    • By bouicca21 14th Sep 17, 2:21 PM
    • 3,237 Posts
    • 4,013 Thanks
    bouicca21
    When I was looking at a house a few years ago I investigated the likelihood of getting a dropped kerb. The council had a similar policy. There were also other considerations about street furniture and visibility. Yes older drives were not compliant but new ones had to be. I think you're stuffed.
    • eddddy
    • By eddddy 14th Sep 17, 2:23 PM
    • 5,416 Posts
    • 5,081 Thanks
    eddddy
    Can you not just drive up the kerb? All be it a bit slower than you would a dropped kerb.
    Originally posted by spadoosh
    Some councils can get very stressy about this...

    Hillingdon encourages people to photograph and report people doing that:
    https://www.hillingdon.gov.uk/drivingacrosspavements

    Southend sends out camera cars to capture evidence and fine people £600 (presumably after a complaint/tip-off) :
    http://home.bt.com/lifestyle/motoring/motoring-news/man-fined-600-for-parking-on-his-own-driveway-11363996285863


    And some councils take even more drastic action by putting up bollards to stop people driving across pavements:







    • theartfullodger
    • By theartfullodger 14th Sep 17, 2:27 PM
    • 9,045 Posts
    • 11,965 Thanks
    theartfullodger
    What can you do? Park somewhere else.

    There is no general rght to park on your property or outside your house.

    And SUMO!
    • G_M
    • By G_M 14th Sep 17, 2:31 PM
    • 41,916 Posts
    • 48,508 Thanks
    G_M
    It's no different to Building Regulations.

    These now specify where and how flues from boilers can exit the building and a host of other things.

    When you intall a new boiler (or whatever) you have to comply with the current rules, but your neighbours who installed their boilers before the current rules were introduced can continue using their boilers without altering the flu.

    You can choose to break the law (metal ramp which will eventually get spotted) or whatever, or you can move. Or park on the road. I don't see how you can appeal since you are unable to comply with the current rules.
    • the_midnight_Wolfboy
    • By the_midnight_Wolfboy 14th Sep 17, 2:49 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    the_midnight_Wolfboy
    Yes I agree "rules are rules" so it makes it difficult to appeal the decision, but in the Borough there are other driveways approved that have broken rules e.g. not being over 10m from a junction or being less than 4.2m. For example if you google "MZA planning Crossover appeal" you can see a case study of a driveway approved recently which is clearly under 4.2m depth

    I am just trying to be imaginative here and see if there is anything I can do. My user privileges do not allow me to link to websites or images so I can't show pics on here of my drive but I can try and private message them

    Great images of the bollards , definitely something I want to avoid unless I want my own article in the Daily Mail
    • lincroft1710
    • By lincroft1710 14th Sep 17, 3:18 PM
    • 9,909 Posts
    • 7,977 Thanks
    lincroft1710
    Have you approached MZA about submitting an appeal on your behalf as they clearly have had some success.
    • Out, Vile Jelly
    • By Out, Vile Jelly 14th Sep 17, 3:21 PM
    • 3,677 Posts
    • 12,246 Thanks
    Out, Vile Jelly
    If parking is such a major factor in your life, you should have bought a house with offstreet parking, or done some preliminary research into the council's rules on dropped kerbs.
    They are an EYESORES!!!!
    • PasturesNew
    • By PasturesNew 14th Sep 17, 3:28 PM
    • 60,688 Posts
    • 354,784 Thanks
    PasturesNew
    7] Employ a 3D artist to paint the current kerb so it is an illusion and looks like a dropped kerb .... so most people will stay away, leaving you that spot to park in when you come home.

    Ever seen those 3D pavement artists?
    http://lh6.ggpht.com/_9F9_RUESS2E/SoqOrkS1eQI/AAAAAAAAApU/nNTliok0Tz4/s800/Amazing-3D-Sidewalk-Art-arctic-whale.jpg
    • the_midnight_Wolfboy
    • By the_midnight_Wolfboy 14th Sep 17, 3:46 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    the_midnight_Wolfboy
    If parking is such a major factor in your life, you should have bought a house with offstreet parking, or done some preliminary research into the council's rules on dropped kerbs.
    My question is what can I do, not please give me condescending retrospective drivel

    This is just a discussion what could be done , I will potentially try and speak to a local councilor, ideally one approaching re-election , alternatively after this I may try MZA or a metal ramp coupled with a 3D painting of a dropped kerb.
    • ProDave
    • By ProDave 14th Sep 17, 3:54 PM
    • 413 Posts
    • 487 Thanks
    ProDave
    Who measured the 4.1 metre dimension? Was it you that measured it and put it on your plans? Or did the planners come around and measure it?

    If you re submitted plans showing a 4.2 metre space because [cough] your tape measure is a bit wonky, would anyone actually come and measure it?
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