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  • FIRST POST
    • Clobbah81
    • By Clobbah81 12th Sep 17, 6:10 PM
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    Clobbah81
    P45 and HMRC panic at new job HELP!
    • #1
    • 12th Sep 17, 6:10 PM
    P45 and HMRC panic at new job HELP! 12th Sep 17 at 6:10 PM
    Hi,

    Have just started a new job. However I lied about my salary at the job interview and I have to know if I'll get found out.

    However, there is a twist.

    I said I earnt 28k + bonus instead of the 40k per anum I've actually earnt since April. I UNDERSOLD MY SALARY. I was feeling really stupid and nervous.

    I am not too concerned about the P45 stating my total earnings since then as that just states accumulative earnings and I can pass the extra off as BONUS,

    However, is there ANYWAY either online or through HMRC that my new employer can see the entire annual figure as it appears on my contract (i.e. 40k) that I was on in my last job? When I login to my personal tax account on HMRC I can see the total figure as it appears on my contract but also the total I had paid in that tax tear, I have to know if my new employer can logon and find out. The p45 on the other hand just notes the total I have been paid this tax year. I need to know if there is anyway HMRC will give my new employer the figure as it appears on my contract.

    To reiterate, if it's just the total I've been paid for the five months since I got the pay rise I'll be okay. It's the black and white 40k figure that is going to get me booted out the door.

    Please help; out of my mind with panic. I need to know if I should cut my losses and run.
Page 1
    • TELLIT01
    • By TELLIT01 12th Sep 17, 6:29 PM
    • 3,874 Posts
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    TELLIT01
    • #2
    • 12th Sep 17, 6:29 PM
    • #2
    • 12th Sep 17, 6:29 PM
    If you gave your new employer your P45 it will show total earnings for the year. HMRC won't have seen your contract of employment from the previous employer so can't give that type of detail. I don't know if your new employer will be able to see you pay history but I suppose it's a possibility with the new on-line system.
    I don't understand why you should be concerned that you told the new employer you were earning less than you really were. I can't see why that would be of concern to them.
    • ReadingTim
    • By ReadingTim 12th Sep 17, 6:45 PM
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    ReadingTim
    • #3
    • 12th Sep 17, 6:45 PM
    • #3
    • 12th Sep 17, 6:45 PM
    Your P45 will show your new employer what you were paid by your last employer in the current tax year. However, it is purely factual - what has been paid. From that info someone could probably extrapolate forward what your annual salary was, but even if they could be bothered, there'd probably be a margin or error, plus distortions by things like salary sacrifice which would make that figure fairly unreliable.

    Obviously, they could also get an idea of income from your tax code, but only very broadly, plus who's to say you don't have other sources of income such as a buy to let flat you're renting out?

    On a more practical level, the part of HR which deals with payroll is usually a different part to the one which sits in on interviews, so it's unlikely the person who deals with your P45 knows what you said in the interview, and your new boss sure as anything won't do payroll - I'd be surprised if you were actually found out.

    Finally, people usually lie about previous salary by inflating it, to get higher pay in the new role. If you undersold yourself, ie said you were paid less than you actually were, that's a far less serious 'crime' - in fact, the new company probably thinks they're getting you for a bargain price!
    • SuzieSue
    • By SuzieSue 12th Sep 17, 9:12 PM
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    SuzieSue
    • #4
    • 12th Sep 17, 9:12 PM
    • #4
    • 12th Sep 17, 9:12 PM
    As others have said, they won't be able to tell from your P45 or anything else that HMRC sends your new employer.

    However, if they ask for a reference from your previous employer then they will probably ask for your leaving salary.
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 12th Sep 17, 9:29 PM
    • 3,716 Posts
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    sangie595
    • #5
    • 12th Sep 17, 9:29 PM
    • #5
    • 12th Sep 17, 9:29 PM
    Setting aside possibilities - why did you undersell yourself? Cos really, people who get caught do it the other way! So there must be a great reason for doing something so entirely illogical. Tell us what that is, and even if it is a problem, it should be something that can be recovered.
    • Clobbah81
    • By Clobbah81 12th Sep 17, 10:43 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Clobbah81
    • #6
    • 12th Sep 17, 10:43 PM
    • #6
    • 12th Sep 17, 10:43 PM
    I really wanted the job. My old company was dodgy. They never gave me a contract saying I earnt 40k - only 28k. I assumed naively this would be asked for during the interview. I also thought the last place was going under.

    Tbh, being this dishonest has ripped me apart.
    • Clobbah81
    • By Clobbah81 12th Sep 17, 10:44 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Clobbah81
    • #7
    • 12th Sep 17, 10:44 PM
    • #7
    • 12th Sep 17, 10:44 PM
    That's already been covered the references said 28
    • Clobbah81
    • By Clobbah81 12th Sep 17, 10:44 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Clobbah81
    • #8
    • 12th Sep 17, 10:44 PM
    • #8
    • 12th Sep 17, 10:44 PM
    Thanks for your reply. Hope your right.
    • Manxman in exile
    • By Manxman in exile 12th Sep 17, 11:25 PM
    • 820 Posts
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    Manxman in exile
    • #9
    • 12th Sep 17, 11:25 PM
    • #9
    • 12th Sep 17, 11:25 PM
    Just playing devil's Advocate here...


    You "lied" at interview and understated your salary by £12k pa.


    I've read threads on here which I have understood to say (I may be mistaken) that if you lie at interview it may not be a good thing, even after two years employment.


    My Devil's Advocate question is: if you lied by deliberately understating at interview your previous salary (for whatever reason) can your employer sack you for lying to them at interview?


    EDIT: Not intending to worry you OP because like most posters here I don't see how your new employer would find out and apparently your contract says 28k. Just an "academic" question.
    Last edited by Manxman in exile; 12-09-2017 at 11:49 PM. Reason: Review
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 13th Sep 17, 7:55 AM
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    sangie595
    Provided that is the only lie that was told, you are fine. The employer isn't at all likely to dismiss a good employee just because they said their salary was lower than it was; and it is very unlikely that a tribunal would find that a fair reason the dismiss. The other way around, yes, that would potentially be more of a problem.
    • t0rt0ise
    • By t0rt0ise 13th Sep 17, 11:28 AM
    • 2,906 Posts
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    t0rt0ise
    I wouldn't even give the P45. I never get them in time myself so just fill in the form that simply asks if this is your only job etc. The new employer then knows nothing and gets told what tax code to use.
    • jobbingmusician
    • By jobbingmusician 13th Sep 17, 7:58 PM
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    jobbingmusician
    I don't think you DID lie (if I have understood what you have written). Your contract says £28k, so this is what you told them. End of.
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    • Clobbah81
    • By Clobbah81 14th Sep 17, 6:20 AM
    • 10 Posts
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    Clobbah81
    I think it will be okay.

    If ANYBODY can tell me the following though:

    When an employer registers a new employee on PAYE/HMRC gateway account online what PREVIOUS pay information is visible for them?

    When I login to my personal HMRC account I can see both gross pay for the year AND what my old employer registered as my annual salary.

    Will my new employer be able to see this info also? I don't care about the gross, just the annual salary.

    If somebody can please answer this i would really be appreciative i
    • Clobbah81
    • By Clobbah81 14th Sep 17, 6:22 AM
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    Clobbah81
    I've looked on the website but the information is elusive
    • Dazed and confused
    • By Dazed and confused 14th Sep 17, 7:46 PM
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    Dazed and confused
    I didn't know employers could see details like that online.

    I know HMRC might send a new employer a tax code notice which can include previous pay details but that is only in place of a P45 so no different really and doesn't disclose anything additional to what a P45 would.
    • General Grant
    • By General Grant 14th Sep 17, 8:42 PM
    • 641 Posts
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    General Grant
    I think it will be okay.

    If ANYBODY can tell me the following though:

    When an employer registers a new employee on PAYE/HMRC gateway account online what PREVIOUS pay information is visible for them?

    When I login to my personal HMRC account I can see both gross pay for the year AND what my old employer registered as my annual salary.

    Will my new employer be able to see this info also? I don't care about the gross, just the annual salary.

    If somebody can please answer this i would really be appreciative i
    Originally posted by Clobbah81
    Are you sure your employer reported on your annual salary (ie as on your contract) for the current year when we are only part of the way through the year?

    I must say I haven't checked my account of late but am surprised that that is recorded.

    I thought they reported what they had actually paid, not what they were contractually obliged to pay (eg without bonus or overtime). It doesn't make sense to report what you expect to pay someone in a year when they may get a pay rise 9 months into the year.
    Last edited by General Grant; 14-09-2017 at 8:44 PM.
    • DCFC79
    • By DCFC79 14th Sep 17, 9:13 PM
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    DCFC79
    Whoever interviewed you may not even see the p45, the p45 will go to HR to sort out and they wont know what was said in the interview regarding pay.

    Obviously if a person from HR was in the room when your interview took place then you might have an issue but you undersold yourself so maybe you wont have an issue.
    Can people stop loaning money/being a guarator to family/friends, it rarely ends well and you lose out as your money is gone or you get shafted with being a guarantor.
    • Savvy_Sue
    • By Savvy_Sue 15th Sep 17, 1:46 AM
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    Savvy_Sue
    You're assuming that someone in HR will be dealing with the P45. If they run their own payroll, then someone within the company will be doing so, yes, but it may be a function of accounts / payroll, and all HR does is pass the information on. Or payroll may be outsourced, in which case someone somewhere the company may be entering the data from the P45 into the payroll company's systems, or they may be scanning and sending it off.

    But where I work, and we're small enough not to have a dedicated HR department, whoever's handling your P45 will not have seen your application form, so will be none the wiser.
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    • Clobbah81
    • By Clobbah81 15th Sep 17, 5:21 AM
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    Clobbah81
    I have no problem with them seeing the p45. However the payroll isn't outsourced, it's done by one of the people that did my interview.

    It's this odd thing HMRC does on the online portal. I just am desperate to know what information my new employer can see about me online via the portal.

    Gross pay is fine - don't care about that. It's just if they can see my previous registered annual salary.
    • Clobbah81
    • By Clobbah81 15th Sep 17, 7:26 AM
    • 10 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Clobbah81
    Ok have finally worked it out so my last questions are this:

    1: does your employer (or anyone else for that matter) have access to detailed records that show your gross pay on a month by month basis? Or do they just get to see the total for each tax year

    2: who has access to your historical tax records kept online? (Is 2015) Can these also be accessed by your employer?


    Thanks to all that answered on this thread
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