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  • FIRST POST
    • alibat
    • By alibat 12th Sep 17, 4:39 PM
    • 41Posts
    • 14Thanks
    alibat
    Need to tell Husband about running up secret debt again 8 years after the first time.
    • #1
    • 12th Sep 17, 4:39 PM
    Need to tell Husband about running up secret debt again 8 years after the first time. 12th Sep 17 at 4:39 PM
    Back in November, I made the following post on another thread:

    Been fighting depression and debt since I first left home to go to uni, with only a few brief spells of solvency in between (I'm now 46). I've never handled stress or bad times well as long as I can remember. Not sure what triggered it. Eight years ago I came on here, nearly 50K in debt due to using spending to overcome depression and keeping the debt secret from my husband. I came clean, felt a huge wave of relief and he supported me. The house was remorgaged (now paid off) and I was briefly doing ok.

    Seven years down the line, I'm back in the same situation. After being ill and eventually being diagnosed with a chronic illness, depression struck as I was bullied out of my job as a result. My husband at first didn't seem to understand, and kept commenting about leaving a job with a good salary. If I hadn't, I would have most likely had a breakdown and not been able to work in the sector again. While still in the job, I started spending again but was too ashamed to own up to my husband. The work I got to replace it was casual, always being worried if I would have enough work. I usually did (although I always had no work in the summer, over Easter and Christmas), but recently things have changed due to changes beyond my control and I'm really struggling. I had one day of work last week, three days so far this week (but two below my usual pay).

    I have just about managed my payments upto now, but I am really going to have to tell my husband again, and again I'm petrified. Even more so now, as I've let him down yet again and I'm scared he will leave me. I think the world of him and cannot believe I am in this situation again and been so stupid. I don't know where to start (last time I gave him a letter but I feel I should do it face to face this time). My debt stands at £28,700 over 5 cards. How do I start? What can I say? I'm making myself really ill over this and can't stop worrying. Even having suicidal thoughts. Tried to see my doctor but can't get an appointment. Any advice would be very welcome.


    Well, nothing much changed in the meantime (although the suicidal thoughts have passed for now, thankfully, but still very depressed). The debt is the same size. Some work came in, enough to keep me going until now but now the work has dried up until the end of the month and I've had no income since mid July (I work as a supply teacher, two offers of work fell through at the last moment). I didn't tell my husband, I chickened out but now I have about a week before I completely run out of money. Things have not been made easier by needing essential repairs to the house, costing about 8K (which my husband is paying for). As a result, he keeps saying we can't afford things.



    It is virtually 8 years to the day that I told him about my then near 50K debt, swearing it would never happen again, but it has. Don't feel that I should use the same tactic as last time and write a letter, but I'm struggling to start the conversation so maybe I will. Really scared that this time it will be it, as I am clearly a liability to him. Currently making a list of stuff to sell, will even offer to sell my beloved motorbike if it proves to him that I regret being so stupid. He still works for a bank (although under constant threat of redundancy), is still fantastic with money and I can't believe I've done it again and put my marriage at risk.


    A few things are different from last time. On the bad side, then I had a regular, good income unlike now. On the positive side, I hope to get the money to cover all these debts in the next 6 months (as my elderly mum has moved to sheltered accomodation and is selling the family home, a third of the sale after deductions will come to me). I had originally hoped I could manage until then but then the work dried up. I am now in the situation of having to ask for my husbands help to make my payments until then.


    Two things I know for certain however. I cannot be trusted with a credit card, ever. I must never have one again. I kept one last time for emergencies, but it just snowballed and I took on more for balance transfers until I had 5 maxed out cards. Secondly, I must get treatment for my depression.


    Sorry for the long post, any advice about how to break the news to my husband much appreciated.
Page 1
    • Bewildered Banshee
    • By Bewildered Banshee 12th Sep 17, 4:51 PM
    • 31 Posts
    • 23 Thanks
    Bewildered Banshee
    • #2
    • 12th Sep 17, 4:51 PM
    • #2
    • 12th Sep 17, 4:51 PM
    I was in a very similar position. 12 years ago my husband baled me out then after some really bad depression I started spending to cheer me up.
    On the last day of our holiday in August I came clean - he was fantastic.
    I've just started a dmp with Step change which will screw me ever getting credit for which I am grateful. Husband will fund treats and the money will be paid back over a very long time.
    You need to talk to him, face to face and explain what has happened. then at least you can find a solution.
    I felt nothing but relief that I wasn't lying awake wondering if I could draw cash from mbna to cover Barclaycard.
    Good luck
    • zippygeorgeandben
    • By zippygeorgeandben 12th Sep 17, 7:36 PM
    • 661 Posts
    • 754 Thanks
    zippygeorgeandben
    • #3
    • 12th Sep 17, 7:36 PM
    • #3
    • 12th Sep 17, 7:36 PM
    I think you have to take full responsibility for these debts and not use depression as an excuse for all these purchases. This doesn't mean that I want replies saying I don't understand depression, I'm just voicing an opinion. Hate to say it but the beloved motorbike isn't actually yours because you haven't paid for it. You've just borrowed money. You were even unwilling to tell him the extent of your troubles even with the positive news of your mum moving into a home and using that money to keep it a secret.
    You'll have to come clean but it would be unfair to judge the husband and what his reaction might be. You've misled him once and now twice.
    Sit down, tell him face to face but prepare for every eventuality. Good luck with it all.
    End Sep 2016 End August 2017
    £8236.57 £4876.49
    (Tesco 4.8%) £222.61pcm
    £6185.75 £851.34 (Zopa 4.0%) £48.99pcm

    £5344.50
    £2890.04 (Sainsburys 0% until 06/19) £140pcm
    £2000.00 £1333.35 (Sister 0%) £133.33pcm

    Total debt
    £19.766.82 £11499.70 Original DFD May 2019.
    • alibat
    • By alibat 12th Sep 17, 8:04 PM
    • 41 Posts
    • 14 Thanks
    alibat
    • #4
    • 12th Sep 17, 8:04 PM
    • #4
    • 12th Sep 17, 8:04 PM
    [QUOTE=zippygeorgeandben;73116486]I think you have to take full responsibility for these debts and not use depression as an excuse for all these purchases. This doesn't mean that I want replies saying I don't understand depression, I'm just voicing an opinion. Hate to say it but the beloved motorbike isn't actually yours because you haven't paid for it. You've just borrowed money. You were even unwilling to tell him the extent of your troubles even with the positive news of your mum moving into a home and using that money to keep it a secret.
    You'll have to come clean but it would be unfair to judge the husband and what his reaction might be. You've misled him once and now twice.

    A few responses to some of the points you made. Firstly, it was never my intention to hide the fact that I was going to get the money from my mum's house. I was going to be a case of, I'm getting this money but unfortunately most of it is already spoken for. I only found out about this in the last few weeks. A major problem I have telling him is that he frequently works late and by the time he gets home and eaten (I have to make sure he eats as a type 1 diabetic) it's too late to start a major conversation and most weekends recently have been spent helping my mum move.
    Secondly, regarding the bike. I know what you mean, but I've had the same bike nearly 20 years. Due to my medical condition (I'm not talking about the depression here) I have at most 2-3 years left
    before I will no longer be physically be unable to ride. I'd always hoped to carry on until I could no longer ride

    Quite a bit of the debt has been spent either directly or indirectly as a result of my illness, either on treatments, classes, or equipment to help me, or on retraining courses for work that I will be able to do. I've lived in constant pain of varying degrees for nearly 30 years (but it took 20 years for a diagnosis) and at the time, anything that offers some respite has got my interest and led to more spending unfortunately.

    But yes, ultimately, I do have to take responsibility. I just don't like discussing my own medical issues too much I'm afraid.
    Last edited by alibat; 12-09-2017 at 8:08 PM. Reason: typos
    • zippygeorgeandben
    • By zippygeorgeandben 12th Sep 17, 9:47 PM
    • 661 Posts
    • 754 Thanks
    zippygeorgeandben
    • #5
    • 12th Sep 17, 9:47 PM
    • #5
    • 12th Sep 17, 9:47 PM
    You never need to be afraid, i was just passing on my thoughts without judgement.
    End Sep 2016 End August 2017
    £8236.57 £4876.49
    (Tesco 4.8%) £222.61pcm
    £6185.75 £851.34 (Zopa 4.0%) £48.99pcm

    £5344.50
    £2890.04 (Sainsburys 0% until 06/19) £140pcm
    £2000.00 £1333.35 (Sister 0%) £133.33pcm

    Total debt
    £19.766.82 £11499.70 Original DFD May 2019.
    • MallyGirl
    • By MallyGirl 13th Sep 17, 12:05 PM
    • 1,897 Posts
    • 6,339 Thanks
    MallyGirl
    • #6
    • 13th Sep 17, 12:05 PM
    • #6
    • 13th Sep 17, 12:05 PM
    A few things are different from last time. On the bad side, then I had a regular, good income unlike now. On the positive side, I hope to get the money to cover all these debts in the next 6 months (as my elderly mum has moved to sheltered accomodation and is selling the family home, a third of the sale after deductions will come to me). I had originally hoped I could manage until then but then the work dried up. I am now in the situation of having to ask for my husbands help to make my payments until then.
    Originally posted by alibat
    Have a read about deprivation of assets before spending this money as it can affect benefit funding in the future if your mother needs to go into care and hasn't got sufficient funds to pay for it
    • EssexHebridean
    • By EssexHebridean 13th Sep 17, 1:09 PM
    • 7,774 Posts
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    EssexHebridean
    • #7
    • 13th Sep 17, 1:09 PM
    • #7
    • 13th Sep 17, 1:09 PM
    Sell the bike and put the proceeds against the debt - and THEN tell your husband. You're right - it needs to be face to face, no question - the letter option has been used and in my view you only get one bite at not having to fully face his reaction. Get the bike on the market right now though - price it to sell without underpricing too far.

    Where are the credit cards now? And I mean right now - when you read this? If the answer is anything other than "Cut up into little pieces" then put that right immediately - you're right, you must not give yourself routes to credit in the future - at least until your mental health issues are under control. And I mean FULLY under control.

    Lastly - make a solid mental note of how terrified you feel right now. Next time you feel the urge to spend something that's not 100% necessary - remind yourself of this feeling.
    MORTGAGE FREE 30/09/2016
    Sainsbugs 0% card: 22/12/16 £1229.00/£504.92 (29/08/17)
    • ruperts
    • By ruperts 13th Sep 17, 1:39 PM
    • 591 Posts
    • 938 Thanks
    ruperts
    • #8
    • 13th Sep 17, 1:39 PM
    • #8
    • 13th Sep 17, 1:39 PM
    It might help if you could demonstrate you'd taken some steps towards recovery yourself and aren't just going to him for a handout. You say you haven't been treated for your depression because you couldn't get am appointment with a doctor? Try again, and then again until you do. Maybe you could set out on paper how you are going to use the money from your mum to pay your husband back in X months time.

    Lastly, and this is my personal opinion as somebody who does not suffer from depression, I wouldn't lean on that too heavily as an excuse. Depression might have been a influencing factor, but all your choices have been your own, and they've included significant amounts of dishonesty. Blaming it on depression would, for me, just come across as even more dishonesty.

    Good luck.
    • EssexHebridean
    • By EssexHebridean 13th Sep 17, 2:44 PM
    • 7,774 Posts
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    EssexHebridean
    • #9
    • 13th Sep 17, 2:44 PM
    • #9
    • 13th Sep 17, 2:44 PM
    It might help if you could demonstrate you'd taken some steps towards recovery yourself and aren't just going to him for a handout. You say you haven't been treated for your depression because you couldn't get am appointment with a doctor? Try again, and then again until you do. Maybe you could set out on paper how you are going to use the money from your mum to pay your husband back in X months time.

    Lastly, and this is my personal opinion as somebody who does not suffer from depression, I wouldn't lean on that too heavily as an excuse. Depression might have been a influencing factor, but all your choices have been your own, and they've included significant amounts of dishonesty. Blaming it on depression would, for me, just come across as even more dishonesty.

    Good luck.
    Originally posted by ruperts
    Not necessarily made in a "sound mind" condition though...and this can be the problem. I do however agree that pointing to that as the sole cause in a sort of "it wasn't my fault" kind of way might not sit too well with the OP's Husband.

    Definitely agree about going to the Doctor about the depression though OP if it's been going on in a life-affecting way for that long. I can get away without ongoing medical intervention because I've now learned the coping strategies - but without those my life would be a very different shape. The GP can point you in the direction of support networks and also go through your different options with you.
    MORTGAGE FREE 30/09/2016
    Sainsbugs 0% card: 22/12/16 £1229.00/£504.92 (29/08/17)
    • alibat
    • By alibat 13th Sep 17, 7:25 PM
    • 41 Posts
    • 14 Thanks
    alibat
    Have a read about deprivation of assets before spending this money as it can affect benefit funding in the future if your mother needs to go into care and hasn't got sufficient funds to pay for it
    Originally posted by MallyGirl

    After my dad died 15 years ago, my mum put the house jointly in her, my brothers and my names. I'm sure after so many years we are ok. My mum is in a almshouse where wardens call in everyday, but she still has her independence. Hoping she won't need a home, She's made it to almost 93 with all her faculties intact!
    • alibat
    • By alibat 13th Sep 17, 7:49 PM
    • 41 Posts
    • 14 Thanks
    alibat
    Ok, a few points here. I do take responsibility and I'm sorry if it came across that I didn't, it's not what I intended. I do feel totally ashamed that I've let this happen again. Regarding the bike, it needs an mot before I do anything, not expecting it to fail but putting off having it tested as I can't afford repairs if it does. This is why I can't sell the bike first. A bike with only a couple of weeks left on it's mot is seriously going to drop the price.
    I have been with my husband 21 years, and never had a joint account or sat down and worked through joint finances. Several times, when we first moved in together (we are in the same house which was his before we met), when I changed jobs, when we got married to name a few, I brought this up, wanting to be fully involved but he wouldn't have it. After the first time, 8 years ago, I again said I wanted to sit down regularly to go through finances and for him to help me get more financially sound, but it never happened. I do think this would have been a big help, and this time (providing he doesn't throw me out) I will insist. I only know roughly what he earns, and I do know he has significant savings and investments, but he has never divulged how much to me. He has paid most bills, where I have paid for shopping, car costs and window cleaner etc.

    He is away tonight on a trip from work, cycling . Before he went I laid some groundwork. We talked about my work, physical disability, that I own a third of my mum's house and should be getting some funds from that, and that I'll soon run out of money if work doesn't pick up soon. I told him I needed to go through some money stuff. He didn't ask anything about possible debt, I didn't want to start that conversation when he had to leave in less than an hour. I actually felt that if we'd had more time, I could have opened up to him tonight. He also has a leaving do at work tomorrow evening which, depending what time he gets home, might mean that tomorrow isn't possible either.

    And yes, the cards have been cut up for quite a while, I kept them to show my husband, but I can't find where I put them!
    Last edited by alibat; 13-09-2017 at 7:51 PM. Reason: typos
    • Mnd
    • By Mnd 13th Sep 17, 7:55 PM
    • 121 Posts
    • 133 Thanks
    Mnd
    I would have thought that for your peace of mind, this discussion is more important than a leaving do
    • enthusiasticsaver
    • By enthusiasticsaver 14th Sep 17, 2:33 AM
    • 4,241 Posts
    • 7,655 Thanks
    enthusiasticsaver
    I think you need to set out a plan to show your husband how you intend to repay the debt. The money you will get from your mums house, the sale of the bike and monthly payments from your wages. Are any of the cards on 0% as this will help bring the balances down quicker?

    I don't mean to be harsh but yes in your case unfortunately credit is something you find difficult to control so it is best you don't have loans/cards and deal mainly in cash.

    Unfortunately remortgaging to repay the last lot of debt means you never really got to grips with budgeting and managing money. I strongly urge you not to let him do th at this time. For your future financial solvency you must learn coping strategies for yourself so you do not choose to spend when you are depressed.
    Countdown to early retirement on 21.12.17 3 months to go.
    • copperclock
    • By copperclock 14th Sep 17, 9:55 AM
    • 177 Posts
    • 194 Thanks
    copperclock
    I'm not sure what my advice is, but I am feeling uncomfortable with the idea that, as a married couple, you know so little about each other's finances. Aside from your secret debt, it particularly worries me that he has secret savings and also that you don't know how much he earns. Does he earn quite a bit more than you, do you think? This kind of situation is ideal for creating a power imbalance.

    Other things to think about:

    If (hopefully not) you got divorced, how easily would he be able to hide assets from the court?

    If he passed away would you be able to access money in the short term, and would you be able to take over the ongoing finances on a practical level? Does he have life insurance?

    Does HE have secret debt?

    Is HE spending money on something you don't know about?

    Feel free to ignore me. I have probably been watching too many TV dramas, but it seems like your financial set-up as a couple isn't really working for you.
    • Filo25
    • By Filo25 14th Sep 17, 10:27 AM
    • 1,000 Posts
    • 1,553 Thanks
    Filo25
    I'm not sure what my advice is, but I am feeling uncomfortable with the idea that, as a married couple, you know so little about each other's finances. Aside from your secret debt, it particularly worries me that he has secret savings and also that you don't know how much he earns. Does he earn quite a bit more than you, do you think? This kind of situation is ideal for creating a power imbalance.

    Other things to think about:

    If (hopefully not) you got divorced, how easily would he be able to hide assets from the court?

    If he passed away would you be able to access money in the short term, and would you be able to take over the ongoing finances on a practical level? Does he have life insurance?

    Does HE have secret debt?

    Is HE spending money on something you don't know about?

    Feel free to ignore me. I have probably been watching too many TV dramas, but it seems like your financial set-up as a couple isn't really working for you.
    Originally posted by copperclock
    Me and my wife are relatively similar, in that we do have pretty much separate finances, we each pay certain bills and know as much or as little about each other's finances as we want to, she can spend her "spare" money on whatever she wants to and likewise I spend mine.

    I've only gotten more involved in her finances recently as she wanted some help on sorting out her pensions (she's a private limited company contractor), but as long as she's working and earning good money then its her money to do with as she wants as far as I'm concerned!

    Obviously if one of us lost our job, or was no longer financially self sufficient for some reason or another we would consolidate things and manage it as one joint budget.

    I totally understand that looks odd to a lot of married couples though!
    • EssexHebridean
    • By EssexHebridean 14th Sep 17, 10:51 AM
    • 7,774 Posts
    • 40,229 Thanks
    EssexHebridean
    I can see both sides on this but, I wonder whether what has set alarm bells ringing on the OP's posts is the fact that she has previously asked for more information and it's not been volunteered. Every couple manages things slightly differently with finances, and that's fine, as long as it is an agreed way of doing things, and not "keeping secrets".
    MORTGAGE FREE 30/09/2016
    Sainsbugs 0% card: 22/12/16 £1229.00/£504.92 (29/08/17)
    • Filo25
    • By Filo25 14th Sep 17, 11:11 AM
    • 1,000 Posts
    • 1,553 Thanks
    Filo25
    I can see both sides on this but, I wonder whether what has set alarm bells ringing on the OP's posts is the fact that she has previously asked for more information and it's not been volunteered. Every couple manages things slightly differently with finances, and that's fine, as long as it is an agreed way of doing things, and not "keeping secrets".
    Originally posted by EssexHebridean
    A very fair point!

    In regards to the original issue, I would only echo the advice given by others to the OP (which they appear to be following), come clean as soon as you can and offer up a solution to both how the money gets repaid and also how you both stop this from happening again.
    • copperclock
    • By copperclock 14th Sep 17, 11:17 AM
    • 177 Posts
    • 194 Thanks
    copperclock
    I can see both sides on this but, I wonder whether what has set alarm bells ringing on the OP's posts is the fact that she has previously asked for more information and it's not been volunteered. Every couple manages things slightly differently with finances, and that's fine, as long as it is an agreed way of doing things, and not "keeping secrets".
    Originally posted by EssexHebridean
    Yes, exactly this. There is one thing having separate finances as a choice, but another thing having secret finances, and a further thing having requests for information denied.
    • alibat
    • By alibat 14th Sep 17, 2:19 PM
    • 41 Posts
    • 14 Thanks
    alibat
    I'm not sure what my advice is, but I am feeling uncomfortable with the idea that, as a married couple, you know so little about each other's finances. Aside from your secret debt, it particularly worries me that he has secret savings and also that you don't know how much he earns. Does he earn quite a bit more than you, do you think? This kind of situation is ideal for creating a power imbalance.

    Other things to think about:

    If (hopefully not) you got divorced, how easily would he be able to hide assets from the court?

    If he passed away would you be able to access money in the short term, and would you be able to take over the ongoing finances on a practical level? Does he have life insurance?

    Does HE have secret debt?

    Is HE spending money on something you don't know about?

    Feel free to ignore me. I have probably been watching too many TV dramas, but it seems like your financial set-up as a couple isn't really working for you.
    Originally posted by copperclock

    Yes, exactly. I've always wanted to be fully involved, I do believe it would have helped. I don't feel a full partner, and I want to be. My husband has always earned more than me, and in the last few years significantly so. When we first met, I was a postgraduate student (very skint, especially since my studies had been delayed due to a bike accident) and he was working. I have had a quick look at his paperwork to get an idea of his finances earlier.. He earns about 45K where I am on about 19k (was about 33K when cc's were taken out). He has no debt, pays his cards off every month. What came as a real shock to me this morning while having a nosey round was the amount he had tied up in investments. It is a considerable sum, I'd guessed he might have around 100K in savings and such, but if I said it is well over double that you will understand my shock. His main personal spends are on his bicycle. He is clearly very good with money, yet I just wish some of that would rub off on me and he would help me organise my finances. He is not tight however, and can be very generous, but always watches the pennies, a bit like my mum and dad were really.

    He does have life insurance, and I do know most of his estate would be left to me, as we have joint wills (I also have life insurance, so he would be left with money and not debt if anything happened to me).

    But one thing that does worry me, especially considering he's a cyclist (and diabetic), is if the worst happened to him, with stuff like electricity and gas coming out of his account, would I have access and could I manage in the immediate aftermath? Not something I like to think about. Could I even access his money to pay for a funeral? It was brought home to me this summer when he was run off the road by a car and injured.

    Found some valuable records to sell I've had years (which is almost as big a wrench as my bike), and some other bits and bats to put on ebay. Rubbish selling stuff though, I always underestimate postage costs. Also started to get information together to write to banks / lenders about PPI

    Found another job to apply for this morning, which if I got it, would be a more reliable income, even if not much more over the year. Also arranged to see an adult careers advisor too. I know I have the skills and qualifications to earn much more than I am, but I need some guidance,especially considering my medical issues.

    Ok, I'll come clean. I have ankylosing spondylitis (inflammatory arthritis of the spine which also affects my hips, knees, shoulders, wrists and fingers), iritis and Crohn's disease. All as under control as they can be. And yes, several friends have pointed out to me I should have taken on my last employer on the grounds of disability discrimination, but it would have taken two years and I would have been unable to work in the meantime.

    Planning on getting this over with tonight. My only issue is the time he will arrive home, as he will go from work directly to his leaving do. This needs a few hours set aside, not rushing at the end of the evening.
    • EssexHebridean
    • By EssexHebridean 14th Sep 17, 3:30 PM
    • 7,774 Posts
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    EssexHebridean
    Are you still within time to challenge your previous employer over Constructive Dismissal?

    Bluntly - in answer to would you have access to his money should he - for example, end up seriously ill or injured in hospital - no, you very likely wouldn't. As for things like paying for a funeral in the worst case scenario - this is paid for from the estate and would be dealt with once the estate had been settled - funeral directors are well used to waiting a long time for bills to be paid due to this.

    Keep going with the selling stuff - being able to show that you are willing to make sacrifices to sort the situation out will definitely help. Also be very careful to treat the whole "wanting to know more about the finances" thing separate - else it could come across as though you're trying to say he has some of the blame for your debt. Personally I wouldn't even broach that in the same conversation.
    MORTGAGE FREE 30/09/2016
    Sainsbugs 0% card: 22/12/16 £1229.00/£504.92 (29/08/17)
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