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  • FIRST POST
    • trinidadone
    • By trinidadone 12th Sep 17, 12:39 AM
    • 2,940Posts
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    trinidadone
    white zig - zag lines either side of a zebra crossing, but in the middle of the road.
    • #1
    • 12th Sep 17, 12:39 AM
    white zig - zag lines either side of a zebra crossing, but in the middle of the road. 12th Sep 17 at 12:39 AM
    Hello all, found this unusual zebra crossing today. the crossing has additional paving on both sizes, which is the width of a car.

    The white zig zag lines are not painted on each of the four sides of the crossing, but are the same distance as the paving, so almost in the middle of the road.

    The distance almost allows cars to park, on the side of the road, without touching the zig zag lines. Is this legally parked, or should receive a instant ticket??
    Trinidad - The hottest place to go
Page 2
    • HogMan
    • By HogMan 12th Sep 17, 2:51 PM
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    HogMan
    Looks like the OPs example is not unique. Take a look at junction of Collingham Place / Knaresborough Place, Kennsington London. There are clearly marked parking bays, which would indicate that parking outside the zig zags is allowed.
    • Aylesbury Duck
    • By Aylesbury Duck 12th Sep 17, 3:27 PM
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    Aylesbury Duck
    Looks like the OPs example is not unique. Take a look at junction of Collingham Place / Knaresborough Place, Kennsington London. There are clearly marked parking bays, which would indicate that parking outside the zig zags is allowed.
    Originally posted by HogMan
    But the OP's example is different because there aren't marked parking bays. My reading of that would be as Car 54 said in post #4, that "the zig-zag lines, wherever they are, define the 'controlled area' of the crossing, which extends to the full width of the road." In the original case, the full width of the road goes to the kerb. In the latter example, the road width extends only as far as the edge of the marked parking bays.

    Whatever the correct technical interpretation is, I'd feel very happy parking in the bays in the second example but wouldn't leave my car in the area adjacent to the zig-zags in the first location.
    • Norman Castle
    • By Norman Castle 12th Sep 17, 5:12 PM
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    Norman Castle
    My reading of that would be as Car 54 said in post #4, that "the zig-zag lines, wherever they are, define the 'controlled area' of the crossing, which extends to the full width of the road." In the original case, the full width of the road goes to the kerb. In the latter example, the road width extends only as far as the edge of the marked parking bays.
    Originally posted by Aylesbury Duck
    I view it as the zig zag lines border the controlled area. The OPs crossing has areas outside it for parking. These are defined by the intruding kerbs and are not intended to be driven along. The bus stop marking is also outside the parking area.

    In the Collingham place example the zig zag lines follow the kerb on the other side of the junction. There is no reason this wasn't done on the OPs crossing other than there is no need to include it in the controlled area.
    Last edited by Norman Castle; 12-09-2017 at 5:23 PM.
    Don't harass a hippie. You'll get bad karma.
    • peter_the_piper
    • By peter_the_piper 12th Sep 17, 5:37 PM
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    peter_the_piper
    https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/London+Rd,+Hastings,+Saint+Leonards-on-sea/@50.8621342,0.557273,48m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x47df1aaf5690ef23:0x60e33 2cab5ffbcb1!8m2!3d50.8594034!4d0.5571738?dcr=0
    Good example of being able to park where there are zig zag lines but not on them or between them. You are allowed to park between a zig zag line and the kerb if enough space is given.
    I'd rather be an Optimist and be proved wrong than a Pessimist and be proved right.
    • Warwick Hunt
    • By Warwick Hunt 12th Sep 17, 6:38 PM
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    Warwick Hunt
    But the OP's example is different because there aren't marked parking bays. My reading of that would be as Car 54 said in post #4, that "the zig-zag lines, wherever they are, define the 'controlled area' of the crossing, which extends to the full width of the road." In the original case, the full width of the road goes to the kerb. In the latter example, the road width extends only as far as the edge of the marked parking bays.

    Whatever the correct technical interpretation is, I'd feel very happy parking in the bays in the second example but wouldn't leave my car in the area adjacent to the zig-zags in the first location.
    Originally posted by Aylesbury Duck
    But the "road" runs from building line to building line and would include footpaths and verges.
    • peter_the_piper
    • By peter_the_piper 12th Sep 17, 7:10 PM
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    peter_the_piper
    As per my example, zig zags define the outer limits of the restriction, on the outside of them normal rules apply.
    I'd rather be an Optimist and be proved wrong than a Pessimist and be proved right.
    • trinidadone
    • By trinidadone 12th Sep 17, 10:56 PM
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    trinidadone
    https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/London+Rd,+Hastings,+Saint+Leonards-on-sea/@50.8621342,0.557273,48m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x47df1aaf5690ef23:0x60e33 2cab5ffbcb1!8m2!3d50.8594034!4d0.5571738?dcr=0
    Good example of being able to park where there are zig zag lines but not on them or between them. You are allowed to park between a zig zag line and the kerb if enough space is given.
    Originally posted by peter_the_piper
    Hello Peter, the link for goggle maps did not show very well, can you print an exact address so i can take a look please?
    Trinidad - The hottest place to go
    • Norman Castle
    • By Norman Castle 13th Sep 17, 7:55 AM
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    Norman Castle
    Hello Peter, the link for goggle maps did not show very well, can you print an exact address so i can take a look please?
    Originally posted by trinidadone
    2/10 for effort. Look for a white transit outside MV Hardware.
    Don't harass a hippie. You'll get bad karma.
    • wgl2014
    • By wgl2014 13th Sep 17, 8:38 AM
    • 363 Posts
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    wgl2014
    As per my example, zig zags define the outer limits of the restriction, on the outside of them normal rules apply.
    Originally posted by peter_the_piper
    Do you have a reference to back that up?

    AIUI the zig zags apply across the carriageway rather than defining the outer limits of the restrictions.
    • NBLondon
    • By NBLondon 13th Sep 17, 8:56 AM
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    • 7,170 Thanks
    NBLondon
    I'm inclined to agree with Mr (or Ms or indeed Mx) Duck... Where there is a distinct parking/loading bay marked as in Mr Piper's example it should be OK and there might even be a sign on a post. Where it isn't - I wouldn't personally risk it without local knowledge.

    Rule 191 of the Highway Code says
    You MUST NOT park on a crossing or in the area covered by the zig-zag lines
    which would fit with Mr Castle's point. The supposed parking bay is outside the area covered by the zig-zags.
    This Be the Verse - Philip Larkin. The first line that everyone knows.
    • trinidadone
    • By trinidadone 13th Sep 17, 11:08 AM
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    trinidadone
    I'm inclined to agree with Mr (or Ms or indeed Mx) Duck... Where there is a distinct parking/loading bay marked as in Mr Piper's example it should be OK and there might even be a sign on a post. Where it isn't - I wouldn't personally risk it without local knowledge.

    Rule 191 of the Highway Code says which would fit with Mr Castle's point. The supposed parking bay is outside the area covered by the zig-zags.
    Originally posted by NBLondon
    You seem to be one of the few posters on here whom have posted a very unbiased opinion. It is very confusing, and like you, while I acknowledge there is a rule 191 of not stopping or parking on a crossing or in the area covered by the zigzag lines, there is parking available on one side of the crossing which is signaled by the zig zag lines away from the curb. I guess the suggestion is what constitutes the "area covered" . is it between the two zigzags from one side of the road to another, or is it between the zigzag white line and the curb (covering the designated parking spaces).

    as someone suggested previously, i am sure its best not to park anywhere near the crossing. I acknowledge the white zigzags are there for safety reasons.
    Trinidad - The hottest place to go
    • Aylesbury Duck
    • By Aylesbury Duck 13th Sep 17, 11:39 AM
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    Aylesbury Duck
    You seem to be one of the few posters on here whom have posted a very unbiased opinion.
    Originally posted by trinidadone
    Eh? You're reading things that simply aren't there. Which of the preceding posts is biased in any way, or do you simply view any opinion which differs from your own as biased?

    As I see it, none of us whom have posted an opinion have any particular vested interest in the answer, just curiosity, so why would anyone come here with any bias?
    • Norman Castle
    • By Norman Castle 13th Sep 17, 1:22 PM
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    Norman Castle
    Eh? You're reading things that simply aren't there. Which of the preceding posts is biased in any way, or do you simply view any opinion which differs from your own as biased?
    Originally posted by Aylesbury Duck
    What opinion? They ask questions, ignore 90% of the responses then make abstract comments.

    At least their Goggle is still working.
    Don't harass a hippie. You'll get bad karma.
    • Manxman in exile
    • By Manxman in exile 13th Sep 17, 1:34 PM
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    Manxman in exile
    As per my example, zig zags define the outer limits of the restriction, on the outside of them normal rules apply.
    Originally posted by peter_the_piper

    I may be mistaken but I think this question came up on Pepipoo a few months ago, and I think they agreed with this view. But perhaps I'm wrong.
    • Car 54
    • By Car 54 13th Sep 17, 1:38 PM
    • 2,407 Posts
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    Car 54
    Eh? You're reading things that simply aren't there. Which of the preceding posts is biased in any way, or do you simply view any opinion which differs from your own as biased?
    Originally posted by Aylesbury Duck
    Possibly paranoia induced by Trinidad's favourite pastime?
    • peter_the_piper
    • By peter_the_piper 13th Sep 17, 5:44 PM
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    peter_the_piper
    Do you have a reference to back that up?

    AIUI the zig zags apply across the carriageway rather than defining the outer limits of the restrictions.
    Originally posted by wgl2014
    No, but the fact that Hastings council does this would lead me to assume, on the balance of probabilities, that they checked the laws referring to this. The parking has been there for about 20 years and I'm sure it would have been queried by now.
    I'd rather be an Optimist and be proved wrong than a Pessimist and be proved right.
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