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    • himynameisaaron
    • By himynameisaaron 8th Sep 17, 4:21 PM
    • 190Posts
    • 61Thanks
    himynameisaaron
    Brother problems
    • #1
    • 8th Sep 17, 4:21 PM
    Brother problems 8th Sep 17 at 4:21 PM
    Hi

    Had a conversation with my brother today regarding him purchasing a car, he is currently at the dealership with my mum and started asking me questions like "Is it okay to put you down as a family member?", and about work income and how much I receive each month between my two jobs. I then started to be suspicious because he wanted to know my sort code and account number.

    Now, would this be for a regular Direct Debit whereby if he fails to make a payment then he will come to me or would it be just a quick credit check? I wish I never gave him all those details now because he never told me what he was doing with the bank details, so am not really happy.

    I don't want to ask him why he needs all those details without wanting a second opinion first.
    Last edited by himynameisaaron; 08-09-2017 at 4:26 PM.
Page 3
    • cjdavies
    • By cjdavies 9th Sep 17, 10:39 AM
    • 2,786 Posts
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    cjdavies
    Hi everyone

    To clear the situation and put it under the carpet, I contacted the dealership this morning to say why would they need my sort code and account number. It turns out he wanted to make me a financial guarantor, but this declined when running a credit search. Therefore, he would have to pay for his car independently since my credit check failed, as did my mum's.

    I think they do this before I need to sign a deceleration form. Anyway, good news is that nothing will be taken from my bank account.

    Thank you for all your help.
    Originally posted by himynameisaaron
    That's good news no money will be taken but I still have stern words about lying both brother and mum.
    • himynameisaaron
    • By himynameisaaron 9th Sep 17, 10:44 AM
    • 190 Posts
    • 61 Thanks
    himynameisaaron
    But the bad news is that your brother tried to take financial advantage of you.
    And it would appear that your Mum knew this.

    Perhaps you should be questioning whether your Mum is an appropriate appointee for you.
    Originally posted by Pollycat
    I agree that he was trying to take financial advantage of me, but put another member of the family into the equation like my mum and asked me to pay lodge of 25 each week, would you still class that as financial advantage because I'm going to be doing it off my own back?
    • cjdavies
    • By cjdavies 9th Sep 17, 10:46 AM
    • 2,786 Posts
    • 2,791 Thanks
    cjdavies
    I agree that he was trying to take financial advantage of me, but put another member of the family into the equation like my mum and asked me to pay lodge of 25 each week, would you still class that as financial advantage because I'm going to be doing it off my own back?
    Originally posted by himynameisaaron
    No because you have a choice and a heads up.
    • elsien
    • By elsien 9th Sep 17, 10:49 AM
    • 15,293 Posts
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    elsien
    I wouldn't call you paying money for your keep taking advantage of you. I paid keep when I lived at home. How much you pay is between you and your mum, and what it covers in proportion to your income.
    If it's paying for your share of the bills and food, it seems reasonable to me - you wouldn't get it for that anywhere else.
    I do find trying to use you as guarantor without fully discussing the implications with you, and getting informed consent, completely out of order. That would worry me a lot, because it is very much taking advantage of you.
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
    • Pollycat
    • By Pollycat 9th Sep 17, 10:58 AM
    • 18,319 Posts
    • 46,893 Thanks
    Pollycat
    I agree that he was trying to take financial advantage of me, but put another member of the family into the equation like my mum and asked me to pay lodge of 25 each week, would you still class that as financial advantage because I'm going to be doing it off my own back?
    Originally posted by himynameisaaron
    No, of course it's not taking financial advantage of you if the sum you pay is an appropriate amount agreed between you.

    Just to remind you what you yourself said about your Mother:

    My mum is a right ***** and also have a feeling she's putting ideas inside his head: "Why don't you ask Aaron, because he doesn't pay me lodge".
    Originally posted by himynameisaaron
    Hi Boris,

    Thank for your kind words. She is not alright in the head, and hasn't got my disability down to a T when describing me during an assessment for PIP.

    We received a form before going down to an assessment as I was previously on DLA asking if I wanted to move to PIP, I repeatedly told my nmother 'No, I can get around fine; cook meals; iron my own clothes; pay bills; bath myself etc' Yet insisted on filling and sending away the form because "it's more money in my pocket" according to her. Completely overshadowing what I said about not wanting to claim PIP because I feel fine.

    Upon invitation to the assessment many weeks later she found the cheek to self-diagnose me with anxieties which I don't even suffer from. You either get assessed and diagnosed by your GP, otherwise you don't have it. Then began kicking me gently with her foot when I said the wrong thing than what she wanted me to say just she can pull the wool over the assessors eyes.

    She would have said things like:
    "Aaron needs constant supervision when pouring a cup of coffee in case he burned his hand" or "He struggles to understand how to read cooking instructions". Fair enough I have autism but she takes things too far sometimes.

    I have been destined to write this post for a long time, but wasn't too sure how to word it properly until now. She's a fraudulent liar.
    Originally posted by himynameisaaron
    • himynameisaaron
    • By himynameisaaron 9th Sep 17, 11:14 AM
    • 190 Posts
    • 61 Thanks
    himynameisaaron
    Meanwhile, this situation has been resolved so thank you for all your help in trying to get to the bottom of all this.
    • Nicki
    • By Nicki 9th Sep 17, 11:18 AM
    • 7,538 Posts
    • 26,351 Thanks
    Nicki
    It hasn't really been resolved Aaron because your brother is now in possession of your financial information and could use it without your knowledge at any point. Just because you failed a credit check for an expensive purchase like a car doesn't mean he can't be setting up smaller direct debits or payments from your account whenever he feels like it.

    You need to speak to your bank at the very minimum to see what they advise.
    • himynameisaaron
    • By himynameisaaron 9th Sep 17, 11:25 AM
    • 190 Posts
    • 61 Thanks
    himynameisaaron
    It hasn't really been resolved Aaron because your brother is now in possession of your financial information and could use it without your knowledge at any point. Just because you failed a credit check for an expensive purchase like a car doesn't mean he can't be setting up smaller direct debits or payments from your account whenever he feels like it.

    You need to speak to your bank at the very minimum to see what they advise.
    Originally posted by Nicki
    I agree, he can't. I can cancel the Direct Debits I don't recognise, but can see your point whereby I shouldn't have to do that.
    • maman
    • By maman 9th Sep 17, 11:32 AM
    • 16,985 Posts
    • 101,579 Thanks
    maman
    Hi everyone

    To clear the situation and put it under the carpet, I contacted the dealership this morning to say why would they need my sort code and account number. It turns out he wanted to make me a financial guarantor, but this declined when running a credit search. Therefore, he would have to pay for his car independently since my credit check failed, as did my mum's.

    I think they do this before I need to sign a deceleration form. Anyway, good news is that nothing will be taken from my bank account.

    Thank you for all your help.
    Originally posted by himynameisaaron
    I do find trying to use you as guarantor without fully discussing the implications with you, and getting informed consent, completely out of order. That would worry me a lot, because it is very much taking advantage of you.
    Originally posted by elsien

    I agree it's good that you haven't been set up as a guarantor. I assumed you couldn't be without signing anything but it's good to know.


    It's definitely not good news that your brother (possibly aided/encouraged by your mum) tried to do it without even asking you though.


    I'm sorry if this sounds harsh but you have been incredibly nave in giving him your financial details and even now you don't seem to have realised that it's not 'normal' for someone to ask for your work and credit history without an ulterior motive. You really need to take more care.


    I think in your position I'd go into the bank and tell them what's happened. You could set up a new account (with a new account number) or even switch to a different bank. Then keep this new one completely private.
    • Pollycat
    • By Pollycat 9th Sep 17, 11:35 AM
    • 18,319 Posts
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    Pollycat
    The shocking thing (at least to me) is that your brother - possibly with the collusion of your Mum - intended to take advantage of you financially.

    I think this puts you in a very vulnerable position.
    • himynameisaaron
    • By himynameisaaron 9th Sep 17, 11:43 AM
    • 190 Posts
    • 61 Thanks
    himynameisaaron
    I agree it's good that you haven't been set up as a guarantor. I assumed you couldn't be without signing anything but it's good to know.


    It's definitely not good news that your brother (possibly aided/encouraged by your mum) tried to do it without even asking you though.


    I'm sorry if this sounds harsh but you have been incredibly nave in giving him your financial details and even now you don't seem to have realised that it's not 'normal' for someone to ask for your work and credit history without an ulterior motive. You really need to take more care.


    I think in your position I'd go into the bank and tell them what's happened. You could set up a new account (with a new account number) or even switch to a different bank. Then keep this new one completely private.
    Originally posted by maman
    Sometimes things are left best said than unsaid, therefore your sentiments on me being incredibly naive on giving my bank and work details, I do have a habit of doing things before thinking of the implications that would be involved and for that, I'm truly an idiot and will make myself more self-aware in the future.
    • elsien
    • By elsien 9th Sep 17, 11:43 AM
    • 15,293 Posts
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    elsien
    As I said before, if all Aaron has given is his sort code and account number, that in itself is not enough to set up a direct debit. Otherwise anyone I have ever given a cheque to could have cleared my account. I do think there's an element of scaremongering going on here which isn't particularly helpful.
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
    • Pollycat
    • By Pollycat 9th Sep 17, 11:47 AM
    • 18,319 Posts
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    Pollycat
    As I said before, if all Aaron has given is his sort code and account number, that in itself is not enough to set up a direct debit. Otherwise anyone I have ever given a cheque to could have cleared my account. I do think there's an element of scaremongering going on here which isn't particularly helpful.
    Originally posted by elsien
    I think it's the intent behind Aaron's brother asking for bank details that is most of concern rather than the fact that he has Aaron's bank account number and sort code.
    • elsien
    • By elsien 9th Sep 17, 11:50 AM
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    elsien
    Yes, I can see that. What I don't see is the logic behind telling him to close his account and never tell anyone the details again, as has been suggested.
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
    • himynameisaaron
    • By himynameisaaron 9th Sep 17, 11:52 AM
    • 190 Posts
    • 61 Thanks
    himynameisaaron
    I have clearly outlined that my brother asked me for the following:

    Sort code and account number
    Three years work history including monthly income

    Where's the scaremongering?
    • thorsoak
    • By thorsoak 9th Sep 17, 11:59 AM
    • 5,478 Posts
    • 24,877 Thanks
    thorsoak
    Aaron - have you got a social worker? If so, you should talk this through with him/her.

    From what you have written, I would suspect that your brother has put the whole financing of this car in your name, and may have fraudulently signed as you, as you have not been asked to sign anything. Your brother has now got your bank account number and sort code - getting a new card will not change the account number and sort code.

    You do need to talk to your bank about this. It looks as if your brother wishes to take over your bank id.
    • maman
    • By maman 9th Sep 17, 12:06 PM
    • 16,985 Posts
    • 101,579 Thanks
    maman
    Sometimes things are left best said than unsaid, therefore your sentiments on me being incredibly naive on giving my bank and work details, I do have a habit of doing things before thinking of the implications that would be involved and for that, I'm truly an idiot and will make myself more self-aware in the future.
    Originally posted by himynameisaaron

    You asked for opinions/advice and I thought it best to point out that it's not 'normal' for someone to ask for those sort of details and not explain why. As you've said you gave the information without thinking it strange.

    As I said before, if all Aaron has given is his sort code and account number, that in itself is not enough to set up a direct debit. Otherwise anyone I have ever given a cheque to could have cleared my account. I do think there's an element of scaremongering going on here which isn't particularly helpful.
    Originally posted by elsien

    If it was simply the a/c details then I'd still want to know why. As you said, it's becoming increasingly common to give details for BACS transfer and it can be read off any cheque. However, in this case it was more than that. Aaron's brother has also been given his work history and income information and it's already been used (thankfully unsuccessfully) for a credit check which was leading to being used as a guarantor. His family don't sound trustworthy and I could imagine them using this information again for financial gain. I don't believe it's scaremongering to alert OP to the pitfalls of not being careful with his financial details.
    • Pollycat
    • By Pollycat 9th Sep 17, 12:24 PM
    • 18,319 Posts
    • 46,893 Thanks
    Pollycat
    Yes, I can see that. What I don't see is the logic behind telling him to close his account and never tell anyone the details again, as has been suggested.
    Originally posted by elsien
    I may be wrong but I've not read that any poster has told him to close his account.

    This poster suggests setting up a new account but not to close his existing one:
    I think in your position I'd go into the bank and tell them what's happened. You could set up a new account (with a new account number) or even switch to a different bank. Then keep this new one completely private.
    Originally posted by maman
    I think not giving his brother (or anyone else who doesn't need to know) details of any new account he might set up is pretty good advice.
    • Ames
    • By Ames 9th Sep 17, 12:45 PM
    • 16,468 Posts
    • 28,851 Thanks
    Ames
    Aaron, do you realise what your brother was trying to do? What being a guarantor means? He could buy the car, not make a single payment, and you'd have to pay the whole lot. You'd have had to prove that you didn't agree to do it, and without you mum helping you that would have been very difficult. So either your family were trying to land you with a big bill, or they were committing fraud. That's not what a loving, supportive family do.

    I've been in a similar position with my family taking advantage of me and I know how hard it is to get out of that situation. I've had a look at some of your past threads and I think you need to get someone on your side who's completely neutral and can see things as they are. Do you think you could see your GP and tell them what your family are doing? They'll know the best place to get help, and can refer you for a social worker or other support worker.
    Unless I say otherwise 'you' means the general you not you specifically.

    Reading the alphabet in 2017. 21/100
    ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ
    • gettingtheresometime
    • By gettingtheresometime 9th Sep 17, 12:50 PM
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    gettingtheresometime
    I agree, he can't. I can cancel the Direct Debits I don't recognise, but can see your point whereby I shouldn't have to do that.
    Originally posted by himynameisaaron
    But armed with that info I could apply for a credit card in your name, intercept the card/pin & rack up debts for you
    Lloyds OD / Natwest OD / PO CC / Wescott / Argos Card cleared thanks to the 1 debt v 100 day challenge


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