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  • FIRST POST
    • slinga
    • By slinga 8th Sep 17, 10:47 AM
    • 1,082Posts
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    slinga
    0 WOW
    Dogs on planes
    • #1
    • 8th Sep 17, 10:47 AM
    0 WOW
    Dogs on planes 8th Sep 17 at 10:47 AM
    Have I missed something.
    Are dogs allowed in the passenger cabin these days?
    It's your money. Except if it's the governments.
Page 2
    • slinga
    • By slinga 8th Sep 17, 11:17 PM
    • 1,082 Posts
    • 223 Thanks
    slinga
    So having a dog at your feet, and the person sat next to you being unable to exit the plane in an emergency due to 'a dog in the way' and duly burning to death or similar, is a good idea?

    It makes a mockery of restrictions on hand luggage.

    At least that goes in an overhead locker.
    Originally posted by sidefx
    I agree.

    And what about smuggling drugs.
    Do dogs have to submit to a body search?
    It's your money. Except if it's the governments.
    • zagfles
    • By zagfles 9th Sep 17, 9:55 AM
    • 12,481 Posts
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    zagfles
    So having a dog at your feet, and the person sat next to you being unable to exit the plane in an emergency due to 'a dog in the way' and duly burning to death or similar, is a good idea?

    It makes a mockery of restrictions on hand luggage.

    At least that goes in an overhead locker.
    Originally posted by sidefx
    It could be far worse than hand luggage impeding exit. There's the question of how the dog would react in an emergency, smoke filled cabin, fire etc. And how its owner would react eg if the dog was petrified cowering under a seat. Knowing some dog owners they'd put the life of their precious mutt ahead of other passengers on the plane and wouldn't think twice about blocking the escape route while trying to get the dog out.
    • bigadaj
    • By bigadaj 9th Sep 17, 1:16 PM
    • 10,725 Posts
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    bigadaj
    It could be far worse than hand luggage impeding exit. There's the question of how the dog would react in an emergency, smoke filled cabin, fire etc. And how its owner would react eg if the dog was petrified cowering under a seat. Knowing some dog owners they'd put the life of their precious mutt ahead of other passengers on the plane and wouldn't think twice about blocking the escape route while trying to get the dog out.
    Originally posted by zagfles
    Not for long they wouldn't.
    • FBaby
    • By FBaby 9th Sep 17, 6:09 PM
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    FBaby
    How does a dog in a carrying box (the lady told me she couldn't take him out) on one's lap any different to a 2 year old on its parent's lap?

    As for allergies, that's an interesting one. I guess it would be declared and the person would be moved?
    • bigadaj
    • By bigadaj 9th Sep 17, 8:17 PM
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    bigadaj
    How does a dog in a carrying box (the lady told me she couldn't take him out) on one's lap any different to a 2 year old on its parent's lap?
    Originally posted by FBaby
    I don't think you're allowed to put small children in the hold unfortunately.
    • 814man
    • By 814man 9th Sep 17, 8:55 PM
    • 334 Posts
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    814man
    This isn't a new thing. Back in early 90's I did a contract job in Belfast and flew BA, Heathrow to Belfast, with my German Shepherd every other weekend. Back then they did have travel boxes which we booked in advance but was never an issue.
    • DigForVictory
    • By DigForVictory 9th Sep 17, 9:10 PM
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    DigForVictory
    I think I'd pay a premium to fly where all under 5s are in a special area in the hold.
    Mind, some days, I'd want to be in the special area, with the soft play stuff, ipads & icecreams.

    I quite like the idea of travelling with someone with a cat snoozing on their lap - takes your mind off statistics of plane accidents etc & diverts to can cats get airsick (in cars they can be travelsick) etc.

    A nice restful drowsy (ideally sedated) portable dog could be a lovely travelling companion for the intermediate hops, but the whole and where does it defecate, urinate etc issue takes a lot of the fun out.
    • IAmWales
    • By IAmWales 9th Sep 17, 9:34 PM
    • 1,680 Posts
    • 3,465 Thanks
    IAmWales
    It could be far worse than hand luggage impeding exit. There's the question of how the dog would react in an emergency, smoke filled cabin, fire etc. And how its owner would react eg if the dog was petrified cowering under a seat. Knowing some dog owners they'd put the life of their precious mutt ahead of other passengers on the plane and wouldn't think twice about blocking the escape route while trying to get the dog out.
    Originally posted by zagfles
    Dogs have been flying in the cabin for decades. I'm not aware of one case where a dog has impeded an emergency situation.
    • Gloomendoom
    • By Gloomendoom 9th Sep 17, 9:35 PM
    • 13,102 Posts
    • 17,318 Thanks
    Gloomendoom
    This isn't a new thing. Back in early 90's I did a contract job in Belfast and flew BA, Heathrow to Belfast, with my German Shepherd every other weekend. Back then they did have travel boxes which we booked in advance but was never an issue.
    Originally posted by 814man
    Shorts?






    ...............
    Advice; it rhymes with mice. Advise; it rhymes with wise.
    • Doshwaster
    • By Doshwaster 9th Sep 17, 10:32 PM
    • 4,754 Posts
    • 3,878 Thanks
    Doshwaster
    A nice restful drowsy (ideally sedated) portable dog could be a lovely travelling companion for the intermediate hops, but the whole and where does it defecate, urinate etc issue takes a lot of the fun out.
    Originally posted by DigForVictory
    Just a shame small children can't be sedated. At least adults have G&T to knock us out on a long flight.
    • bigadaj
    • By bigadaj 9th Sep 17, 10:48 PM
    • 10,725 Posts
    • 7,012 Thanks
    bigadaj
    Shorts?






    ...............
    Originally posted by Gloomendoom
    Lederhosen surely?
    • wondercollie
    • By wondercollie 10th Sep 17, 4:33 AM
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    wondercollie
    I know of someone who flew across the US with his full sized Lassie type Collie in the cabin. The airline screwed up the dog's prebooked hold space. The airline to make up for it then declared the dog a service dog and permitted it to fly in the cabin.

    I have seen in several US airports dog rest areas. Yes, dog toilets, complete with a fire hydrant, fake grass, hoses to wash down waste and poop bag dispensers.

    My dogs have flown in the hold and I must say for the price we paid for the crate fees, those animals should have had prime rib steaks for snack.

    And yes, my dogs are well behaved and quieter than most kids that I've had the misfortune to fly with. And yes, British family flying out of CDG to Malaga, I mean you. Five free range children screaming, playing in the aisles, seat kicking and a cabin crew that refused to deal with it.
    • zagfles
    • By zagfles 10th Sep 17, 10:20 AM
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    zagfles
    How does a dog in a carrying box (the lady told me she couldn't take him out) on one's lap any different to a 2 year old on its parent's lap?

    As for allergies, that's an interesting one. I guess it would be declared and the person would be moved?
    Originally posted by FBaby
    In a box isn't so bad, I though we were talking about loose dogs.
    • zagfles
    • By zagfles 10th Sep 17, 10:23 AM
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    zagfles
    Just a shame small children can't be sedated. At least adults have G&T to knock us out on a long flight.
    Originally posted by Doshwaster
    Hot milk and avoid tanking them up on sugar seemed to work quite well for ours.
    • zagfles
    • By zagfles 10th Sep 17, 10:47 AM
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    zagfles
    Dogs have been flying in the cabin for decades. I'm not aware of one case where a dog has impeded an emergency situation.
    Originally posted by IAmWales
    They've forced emergency landings...

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/pictured-truffles-dog-who-caused-3630390

    However badly behaved children are - they don't tend to !!!! in the ailse
    • uknick
    • By uknick 10th Sep 17, 11:07 AM
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    uknick
    Sorry for a long rant, but this is a big issue for us when we travel, both for flights and hotels. My other half is allergic to cats and dogs; they trigger her asthma by just being in the same area as her.

    We only fly airlines that let us change our non flexible tickets at no cost if an animal is booked on the flight after we book.

    We asked BA about this and they told us the dog always takes preference over the asthma sufferer. So, if a dog was booked on after us, we'd have to pay the normal change of flights costs. As you can imagine, BA does not get our business.

    Whilst UK departing/arriving flights tend to only allow "genuine" service dogs, in the USA they allow all sorts of dogs on the internal flights. This has led to the fraud dog issue; owners register their dog as a service animal, or more usually emotional support dog, to avoid the fees airlines charge for normal pets to fly in the cabin.

    Unfortunately this "fraud" dog issue has now spread to hotels. To avoid dogs we pay a premium to book hotels that only allow service animals. All have to allow service animals under the Americans with Disability Act (ADA). However, this act specifically states emotional support dogs are excluded from this part of the ADA.

    But, owners now register their dog as a service animal on the internet, pay about $200 for a pack which gives them a letter which says it is a service animal and book into hotels using this paperwork. Why do they do this? It saves them about $50 a stay, so the $200 is recovered pretty quickly.

    Over the last couple of years we've experienced non service dogs in about half the hotels we've stayed in. When we ask the hotel why they've let a pet say, they try to quote the ADA which says they can only ask if it is a service dog. If the owner says it is, the hotel can't do anything about it. The hotels are all wrong when they tell us this.

    The ADA allows the hotel to ask two questions; first is it a service dog and second what is it trained to do? What they can't ask is what the owner's disability is. By not asking the second question the hotel is in breach of their hotel's pet policy if there is some doubt as to the validity of the owners claim.

    As an example, last week we were staying in Cape Cod. A late middle age couple from New York checked in with a lapdog wearing a yellow tutu. During the time we were there we saw the couple a few times without the dog. To my mind this was a pet so we questioned it with the hotel. They said the owners had service dog paperwork for it, so the hotel had not bothered to ask what it was trained to do. The fact we saw the owners without the dog undermines the claim it was a service dog, which under the rules should be with the owner at all times.

    Mind you, this couple also had a disabled badge for their car despite them both showing no sign of a mobility issue. I saw this when they both took the luggage from their car and carried it into reception without asking for assistance. No doubt they had obtained it under the mental incapacity clause allowed under US rules. And before you think I was stalking them, I just happened to be sat in the reception area having a coffee when they arrived.

    Later on in the week another dog arrived, again a small lapdog. This one wore a jacket with "support animal" on it. Because it had the jacket on the hotel let it stay.

    What can we do about this? Not a lot as the dog lobby in the USA is very strong. Complaining to the hotels achieves nothing. In the future we're going to book short stays at hotels; a coupe of nights and then change hotel to another in the area. Hopefully, this'll reduce the stress my other half feels when she knows a pet is in the hotel. Not very convenient, but as the hotels have no intention of enforcing the ADA I can't see any other option.

    The irony of all this is that I love dogs, as a child we had them as pets, and would love to have one again. But, my partner's allergic issues negates this.

    And, before any on here tell me service animals are trained in many diverse functions, I'm aware of this. In the USA I've seen dogs trained to detect an impending insulin coma, to help when the owner has a seizure as well as the usual guide dog. It is obvious these are genuine service dogs by their behaviour. They're always with their owner and take an interest in nothing but than their owner. It's the fraud dogs I have the issue with, as do many of the genuine service dog owners.
    • Hermione Granger
    • By Hermione Granger 10th Sep 17, 11:15 AM
    • 784 Posts
    • 1,224 Thanks
    Hermione Granger
    They've forced emergency landings...

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/pictured-truffles-dog-who-caused-3630390

    However badly behaved children are - they don't tend to !!!! in the ailse
    Originally posted by zagfles

    One example from well over 3 years ago doesn't help prove a point.
    How many flights have been diverted because of people being drunk, abusive or fighting on an aircraft?
    • zagfles
    • By zagfles 10th Sep 17, 11:32 AM
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    zagfles
    One example from well over 3 years ago doesn't help prove a point.
    Originally posted by Hermione Granger
    Err.. the PP was not aware of "one case". OK it didn't impede an emergency situation - it caused one!
    How many flights have been diverted because of people being drunk, abusive or fighting on an aircraft?
    In proportion to flights taken by people and flights taken by dogs in the cabin? I don't know - why don't you google it if your that interested.
    • zagfles
    • By zagfles 10th Sep 17, 11:43 AM
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    zagfles
    What can we do about this?
    Originally posted by uknick
    Holiday in Korea instead Maybe wait till things calm down a bit though!
    Not a lot as the dog lobby in the USA is very strong.
    Like their gun lobby. I'm surprised there isn't an amendment covering it.
    • uknick
    • By uknick 10th Sep 17, 12:41 PM
    • 709 Posts
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    uknick
    One thing I did think about doing is to write to President Trump c/o The Whitehouse.

    I thought I'd ask him to ban fraud dogs with an executive order. And then go on to say it's something Obama failed to do in his 8 years. It does seem Trump wants to better Obama in everyway, so this might be a red flag to a bull
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