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    • iammumtoone
    • By iammumtoone 6th Sep 17, 6:31 PM
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    iammumtoone
    parents full time working
    • #1
    • 6th Sep 17, 6:31 PM
    parents full time working 6th Sep 17 at 6:31 PM
    It looks like I may be taking a full time job currently I work 20 hours within school times.

    I have some questions how people manage. I am a single parent but I don't think that is necessarily relevant in this situation it can't be that much different to two parents working full time.

    How do you do homework? I will not get home until 6.30 then will have to sort tea straight away with everything else bath etc not sure where the time comes in for this?

    What about dentists/doctors for child? I am not allowed time off for this (only my medical needs) so how do I arrange this, my son needs medical appointments/assessments for his ADHD and upcoming ASD assessment so not just talking about if he gets ill. Do you take holiday for this? this will mean cutting the amount of holiday available to do fun things with him.

    Time for yourself to relax - How do you find it. My son does not sleep he is never asleep before 12pm. Do you just manage on the occasional 10 minutes here and there when everything is quiet?

    House work - where does this fit in when you are either at work or looking after your child(ren).

    Shopping - how do you manage to get things that are needed (my son will not go shopping it stresses him) Food shopping I can order online but what about everything else? Do you order everything online?

    Clubs - this is probably irrelevant in my case as my son dispite me trying to persuade him will not attend clubs but I am hoping this will change in the future. How do you get your child there most start at I guess at 7 do you rush everything to get them ready in time. I am afraid my son does not do rushing

    Child is in year 6. My other worry is secondary school when there is no childcare available but my son is not safe to be left alone in the house. What do others do in this situation?

    Anything else I need to consider?

    I am dreading it my son is hard work (you may have seen some of my other threads but this isn't about that its about how full time working parents manage).

    I have the opportunity of a well paid full time job meaning I will come off benefits completely not sure if my conscious will allow me to turn it down, isn't that what everyone should be aiming for? However on the other side not sure if my MH will cope with the stress of not the job but looking after a child as well or if indeed it will damage my child health by taking it. (he is certainly going to be a nightmare at first but I hope he will get used to it)

    Its so hard, in some ways I wish the opportunity didn't come up.

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    Last edited by MSE Andrea; 13-09-2017 at 9:14 AM.
    Sealed pot challenge ~ 11 #017 - Open 1st Nov


Page 3
    • Spendless
    • By Spendless 7th Sep 17, 8:12 PM
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    Spendless
    Really? thanks I will definitely check that. I always thought if you left a job you weren't entitled to anything.

    Do you know how I would have to prove that? The reason wouldn't be I had childcare issues - there is childcare available it would be that it wasn't right/suitable for my son, then I am back to square one I can't prove that it isn't right for him as I don't claim/won't get DLA.

    That would be my ideal to try it for 2-3 months and then make a decision based on how it was not how I think it is going to be, but I can't afford to do this if I can't claim JSA after. I also can't afford to take the risk of finding another job whilst working there, just doing the job will be hard enough to job search on top and wait until I get part time job (which are rare) will not be feasible.
    Originally posted by iammumtoone
    Gingerbread mentions problems with childcare as a reason for not being sanctioned on their fact sheets. It also mentions rules about single parents looking for work. I think to contact an organisation like them and put your scenario past them for some advice might be worth doing.

    https://gingerbread.org.uk/factsheet/32/Single-parents-and-Jobseeker%E2%80%99s-Allowance-%E2%80%93-special-rules
    • iammumtoone
    • By iammumtoone 8th Sep 17, 4:35 PM
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    iammumtoone
    UPDATE:

    I spoke to gingerbread (so many thanks to spendless)

    I now have more urgent concerns after speaking to gingerbread and explaining my situation it seems I have done wrong and in am the brown stuff

    Apparently if I am offered the job and refuse it I will not be able to claim JSA as I will have turned down a job, this is not allowed (I knew this but didn't think it applied here as thought it only applied to jobs you have applied for when on JSA, I am still working my notice)

    I need to contact the company and withdraw my application. I have no choice I have not finalised my childcare arrangements or made a final decision on whether this is right. I can not risk them officially offering me the job, my original thinking was I could turn it down at any point up to my leaving date buying me time to sort/trial childcare and make the right decision.

    I am absolutely gutted and thoroughly disappointed I have just turned down a potential 15K payrise.

    I need to work but more than that I need a back up plan of JSA I can't survive without either and I cannot risk losing the chance of JSA whatever the carrot of the job. My son has to come first I needed more time to make sure this happens (I was working towards that) but it seems in this situation I am not permitted time. I am so so mad at how our benefits system works, those who what to try, seem to be prevented from doing so.

    The very worse thing about this is if I am out of work for 13 weeks and then decide to try full time work I would be allowed to apply to have a trial period but this does not count in my situation as I am not out of work! I will not find a job that pays this again this it was a unique opportunity. It stinks I feel so despondent.

    For the original question would I have been able to give the job up if I started it the answer is in theory yes but in practice very difficult. There are allowed reasons but all have to be proved (which can be difficult as you are relying on the DM to accept the proof and your reasons). A risk I feel I could not take they did say if I claimed DLA then this would have helped in supporting this situation.
    Sealed pot challenge ~ 11 #017 - Open 1st Nov


    • FBaby
    • By FBaby 8th Sep 17, 6:01 PM
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    FBaby
    What a difficult decision to make. My view is that you should take the job, just because say you end up on JSA, can't find another part-time job, end up pressured to take any job by the job centre, you could end up in a position you hate, hardly making any money, looking back and thinking that you could be so much better off.


    The reality is that it will most likely be difficult for both you and your son to start with. You will both have to adjust to the change and the tiredness that come with it, but you also need to look at it longer term. As you say, he will be in secondary school next year, and the things that he is not able to manage currently, maybe he'll be able to learn to manage by then. Think about the next few months, but also the next few years.


    As for not getting JSA if you quit, all I ever read is that they look at individual circumstances, so what I would recommand is that you keep a record of everything so that if you have to give it up, you can explain the reasons for it. I believe they are much more flexible with single parents and after all, you'll be able to show that you made that decision to take the job in the first place, so it's not like you don't want to work.


    They are many 'tricks' you learn along the way and speaking with other parents in a similar situation. One thing I've learned is that services never offer last appointments, however, if you explained nicely that you work FT and it is difficult for you to make the time, and look/sound very apologetic, it's amazing the slots that suddenly become available! I had this with the physio department when DD needed weekly appointments, same with orthodontist, dentist, and even tradespeople!


    Whatever you do, good luck!
    • Kaye1
    • By Kaye1 8th Sep 17, 7:46 PM
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    Kaye1
    You are making lots of assumptions about what your new employer would and wouldn't allow.

    If you are hard-working, respectful and diligent employee, on the whole businesses may be willing to cut you a little slack.

    Have you actually spoken to your boss and asked them? For example, if you took off 4 hours for an appointment, they may just allow you to put it as unpaid leave.

    There are 'the rules' of the business and then there is always what actually happens. If you are they type of employee they want to keep, they may be happy to help you out a little.
    • iammumtoone
    • By iammumtoone 8th Sep 17, 8:54 PM
    • 5,256 Posts
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    iammumtoone
    You are making lots of assumptions about what your new employer would and wouldn't allow.

    If you are hard-working, respectful and diligent employee, on the whole businesses may be willing to cut you a little slack.

    Have you actually spoken to your boss and asked them? For example, if you took off 4 hours for an appointment, they may just allow you to put it as unpaid leave.

    There are 'the rules' of the business and then there is always what actually happens. If you are they type of employee they want to keep, they may be happy to help you out a little.
    Originally posted by Kaye1
    I was not making assumptions about what my employer would accept I was going by the worse case scenario. Yes I could ask them, they could tell me what ever they liked but unless they put it in my contract they could go back on their word at any time and I would only have employee rights to fall back on, any thing more than that is a bonus and not to be relied upon. Plus when you are applying for a job its not generally good practice to start asking what additional time off you are allowed.

    I don't think I ever started that my employer wouldn't cut me slack I was asking what others did in this situation - of which I got some very useful answers.
    Sealed pot challenge ~ 11 #017 - Open 1st Nov


    • iammumtoone
    • By iammumtoone 8th Sep 17, 9:04 PM
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    iammumtoone
    I have decided that at this time this is not right for me or my son. We have had three whole days with no tantrums lasting more than half hour. This is the longest we have gone without one for at least 10 weeks. I do not want to disrupt that by upsetting him, his well-being comes first.

    However after this thread I am no longer as worried about full time work as I was when I first started it. I am going to find my son a childminder he is happy with (this might take some time) and keep him going to them at least once a week even if I am not working, then if the next job I get is full time it will not disrupt him so much to just increase those times he will already know and be familiar with them. I regret I could/should have done that before now but I did not expect this situation - you live and learn.
    • tooldle
    • By tooldle 8th Sep 17, 9:06 PM
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    tooldle
    I do understand where you are coming from, but a decision on, ifs, buts any maybes is never going to be an informed decision. If you have been offered the role, there is no harm in asking questions before making your Decision.
    Perhaps i have misunderstood. Have you been offered the role, or is this just a hyperthetical scenario?
    • iammumtoone
    • By iammumtoone 8th Sep 17, 9:13 PM
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    iammumtoone
    I do understand where you are coming from, but a decision on, ifs, buts any maybes is never going to be an informed decision. If you have been offered the role, there is no harm in asking questions before making your Decision.
    Perhaps i have misunderstood. Have you been offered the role, or is this just a hyperthetical scenario?
    Originally posted by tooldle
    I do not want to go into too much detail. I have not been officially offered the job but due to the circumstances and amount of people that have applied a job has to offered to me. There are x amount of jobs with the same amount of applicants (others who were entitled to apply haven't for various reasons) Unless I am totally unsuitable, which I am not, I will be chosen.

    Please do not quote the above as I will delete.

    I did ask so many questions about working times before we got to this stage so many in fact they had to tell me in no uncertain terms that the jobs are full time no negotiation that is what they need and that is what it will be to be fair they are right the job is very involved it will be full on full time.
    Last edited by iammumtoone; 08-09-2017 at 9:17 PM.
    • KxMx
    • By KxMx 8th Sep 17, 9:18 PM
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    KxMx
    What's stopping you claiming DLA? From your posts your son has care needs above his peers.

    The right award would entitle you to Carers Allowance and you could have a pt job on top.

    There really is nothing to lose by applying.
    • iammumtoone
    • By iammumtoone 8th Sep 17, 9:26 PM
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    iammumtoone
    What's stopping you claiming DLA? From your posts your son has care needs above his peers.

    The right award would entitle you to Carers Allowance and you could have a pt job on top.

    There really is nothing to lose by applying.
    Originally posted by KxMx
    He won't get DLA as he shows no issues/problems at school.

    I had a thread regarding this you can still read it but I asked for it to be closed. I was not in a good place at that time mainly as I was really struggling to cope. As said above this is the third day no massive tantrums (we have only had mini ones less than 30 minutes) things are looking up, I hope and pray it will continue.
    Sealed pot challenge ~ 11 #017 - Open 1st Nov


    • KxMx
    • By KxMx 8th Sep 17, 9:32 PM
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    KxMx
    He does have enhanced care needs at home.

    You also said recently he was unable to communicate his toilet needs at school. That is a problem at school.

    You've also said he is undergoing more assessments? That's all evidence for DLA purposes.

    If the claim is failed you can take it to an appeal tribunal, where you can clearly explain why he still needs it despite no problems at school. Although I'd argue as he was unable to communicate toilet needs at school, he is not problem free there.

    I know you feel he won't get it, but why not try anyway? Again, nothing to lose by trying.
    • FBaby
    • By FBaby 9th Sep 17, 7:14 AM
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    FBaby
    Ultimately, it's your decision and it looks like your mind was made up yesterday. All I can say is that I hope you didn't just consider the pros and cons of the situation in the short term, but also the longer term. I think it is easy to just consider the next months because it feels more real and ignore the next years, yet those years come and then many people feel that they have no control of their situation then, when in fact they did before, but opted out. What I would have considered more than anything is how you and your son would feel about the prospect of being on the same salary/benefits for the next 10 years, ie. if that's enough for you to feel you can offer your son a good life and you don't need more, than fair enough, and if not, what would be your chances of such a job again in the next year or so. If good, then it is worth taking the chance and seeing this as just delaying the situation. If however this is a real opportunity that is unlikely to come again, then I think it would be mad to not give a chance just because there is a chance you might not get JSA if you give it up.
    • Spendless
    • By Spendless 9th Sep 17, 7:17 AM
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    Spendless
    Oh gosh, well I don't know whether to be thankful I told you to contact Gingerbread or wish I'd not said anything. I can understand why you'd be reluctant to let the offer go, but I've read your posts concerning your son and see the difficulty.

    Regardless of what decision you make, I hope you continue to get your child assessed and will re-consider claiming for DLA. Or at least make a claim at a later stage.
    • Spendless
    • By Spendless 9th Sep 17, 7:53 AM
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    Spendless
    Ultimately, it's your decision and it looks like your mind was made up yesterday. All I can say is that I hope you didn't just consider the pros and cons of the situation in the short term, but also the longer term. I think it is easy to just consider the next months because it feels more real and ignore the next years, yet those years come and then many people feel that they have no control of their situation then, when in fact they did before, but opted out. What I would have considered more than anything is how you and your son would feel about the prospect of being on the same salary/benefits for the next 10 years, ie. if that's enough for you to feel you can offer your son a good life and you don't need more, than fair enough, and if not, what would be your chances of such a job again in the next year or so. If good, then it is worth taking the chance and seeing this as just delaying the situation. If however this is a real opportunity that is unlikely to come again, then I think it would be mad to not give a chance just because there is a chance you might not get JSA if you give it up.
    Originally posted by FBaby
    This is very true, it happened to me. Someone wanted to see me about a job not long after I'd returned to the workforce. As the job wasn't advertised it was highly likely it would be mine for the taking, but in those days I only wanted to work part-time. My son was 10 then, so when I found out, I said I wasn't interested in an interview. What happened next was the 2 day a job I had found, then increased to almost f-time hours, followed by them closing down. After six months out of work, I took an ad-hoc job for the next 3.5 years, where I worked f-time days when I did work. When that job finished at the beginning of last year I had another horrible six months out of work before finding the f-time job where I've been for over a year. What I've never had in all this time is a job that hasn't been short term contract, agency or casual but there years ago was a f-time permanent job that was pretty much mine for the taking and I didn't do it based on my family circs at the time. Family circs that started evolving within a few months and that we would have managed.
    • iammumtoone
    • By iammumtoone 9th Sep 17, 9:27 AM
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    iammumtoone
    Fbaby - Yes I am capable of working at a job at that level/pay grade before I had a child I had a career. I gave it all up which I have never regretted for a moment, long term plan was to get back into it one day. However I am aware that to get a job like that now will be difficult as I will be fighting with others at interview with more relevant experience than me. This job opportunity has landed in my lap (its not what I did career wise but you can't have everything!).

    You make some valid points I know that at some point I need to work f-time I do not want to be in the situation many find themselves in, child leaves school they lose benefits so find it hard - I have never understood why people don't realise this is coming and they need to do something about it years before hand.
    • annandale
    • By annandale 9th Sep 17, 12:00 PM
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    annandale
    If you are in a universal credit area you won't be able to claim tax credits to top up your wages and most areas are being moved over to uc over the next couple of years.

    And you would be expected to look for a full time job if you were on uc due to the age of your child as far as I'm aware, even if you were in part time work.

    You may be able to stay on tax credits for a couple of years but universal credit is replacing WTC and its vastly different to working and being on tax credits.

    Its an in work benefit and you are expected to look for full time work even if you have part time.

    There are different rules re job search if you are a carer I believe so its something you might want to check out.
    • iammumtoone
    • By iammumtoone 9th Sep 17, 12:18 PM
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    iammumtoone
    I am aware of those rules that is not quite correct you are not expected to work full time hours but a achieve a full time wage as if you were earning NMW. (personally I don't agree with that - it penalises those who are unable to earn more than min wage, that is not the individuals fault - however that is a discussion for another thread)

    Whilst tax credit will stop to top up wages there will be some top up in UC to what extend and it might not be the same I do not know. I do want to point this out for others reading - you may just have worried an awful lot of people!

    I worked it out a while back can't remember the exact figures but on my current wage I would need to work around 24 hours to achieve equivalent of full time @ NMW.

    I appreciate I am no longer in the same situation and it is possible next job may be min wage job but if that does happen I will continue my job search until I find one of the level I am at now.
    • annandale
    • By annandale 9th Sep 17, 12:59 PM
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    annandale
    You are right, its 35 hours x NMW. i didnt actually say above that there would be no top up. My point was about being expected to job search on UC and not on WTC even if you have young children.

    Its not a top up, its a basic allowance. For a single person its 317. If you have kids you get an in work allowance of 192 which you keep and after that for every penny you earn 63p is deducted from your UC. If you have no kids you get no in work allowance and for every penny you earn 63p comes off your UC allowance.

    You also get more of an in work allowance if you dont claim housing element. Theres also a child element as well which replaces CTC

    Really not sure why my post would have worried people. Previous posters were talking about JSA and WTC and I was merely pointing out that in some areas if you make a claim for WTC, you are put on UC instead. And that the conditions for getting UC are different to that of WTC and JSA. Im actually slightly better off on UC but I have to do more to get the benefit than I did on WTC. Really not sure why anything I said above implied that people on UC dont get an income. Its an in work benefit and I made that clear.

    Anyway if I had read up I would have seen you had made your decision and I'll post nothing else on this thread.

    Try to be helpful and you get chinned in response, pointless.
    • iammumtoone
    • By iammumtoone 9th Sep 17, 1:11 PM
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    iammumtoone
    Try to be helpful and you get chinned in response, pointless.
    Originally posted by annandale
    Sorry I didn't mean to offend, you are right to point out that there are differences in UC as that does currently apply to others (my area is not due to move over until next year)

    Maybe I read/interpreted your post wrong where you said you will not be able to claim tax credit to 'top up' I read that as there are no 'top ups' as these come via WTC which will no longer be available. If someone else reads like that it could be a concern to them.

    I agree UC is an in work benefit the same as WTC is. I believe the main difference is what we both said after the child is a certain age you are expected to work/look for work at 35 x NMW.
    • annandale
    • By annandale 9th Sep 17, 1:24 PM
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    annandale
    No worries. Just going to say also that Gingerbread have given you poor advice. No way would you get refused UC or JSA, if you turned down a job prior to going on benefit. You would only face a sanction if you refused a job while on benefit or got sacked or resigned. Even then there are allowances made, for example I gave up a zero hours job to focus on getting a full time one as by the time I paid travel costs and deductions were made I was working for pennies and travelling hundreds of miles to do so.

    Im surprised that theyve given you duff advice but it is duff. At no point during my claim for UC was I asked if I had recently been offered a job and turned it down.
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