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  • FIRST POST
    • Difference of Opinion
    • By Difference of Opinion 25th Aug 17, 9:47 AM
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    Difference of Opinion
    100 WOW
    National Trust Loophole by joining Scotland using in England
    • #1
    • 25th Aug 17, 9:47 AM
    100 WOW
    National Trust Loophole by joining Scotland using in England 25th Aug 17 at 9:47 AM
    Can you still join the Scottish National Trust and use it at English properties. Does this loophole still exist, as it is significantly cheaper to join the Scottish National Trust then the English National Trust. Annually joint membership is £63 compared to £108
Page 2
    • Money maker
    • By Money maker 10th Sep 17, 1:36 PM
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    Money maker

    My understanding is that E&W National Trust are now rolling out a system where you will need to scan your card to get the free car park ticket (i.e. no longer sticker based).
    If Scottish NT do get free car parking, then presumably their cards will need to have the right scan code.
    Originally posted by keithdc
    This does appear to be the case and we saw quite a few of these machines on our recent hols. You scan your membership card and a ticket is issued for free. Can the other cards be scanned in the same way? If not, then it may be worth reconsidering as parking charges can be pretty high.
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    • Doc N
    • By Doc N 11th Sep 17, 9:54 AM
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    Doc N
    A great scam - if you happen to think that cheating the English National Trust out of crucially important income needed to preserve English heritage is a good idea.

    At least the ways things are now structured, though, you won't be able to cheat it out of the parking fees too.
    • roddydogs
    • By roddydogs 11th Sep 17, 9:59 AM
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    roddydogs
    Yes you will it has already been discussed on another thread that the Scots sticker will be enough!
    • Doc N
    • By Doc N 11th Sep 17, 10:40 AM
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    Doc N
    Yes you will it has already been discussed on another thread that the Scots sticker will be enough!
    Originally posted by roddydogs
    Great - so you can cheat the English National Trust out of all its admission fees.

    Legal, yes - but moral, certainly not. Rather like tax avoidance, except that it's an English charity you're cheating.
    • roddydogs
    • By roddydogs 11th Sep 17, 11:03 AM
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    roddydogs
    I've never used the loophole, but you do realise this is a MSE forum?
    • Doc N
    • By Doc N 11th Sep 17, 11:08 AM
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    Doc N
    I've never used the loophole, but you do realise this is a MSE forum?
    Originally posted by roddydogs
    And that means any morals go out of the window?
    • TomLikesSausages
    • By TomLikesSausages 11th Sep 17, 11:12 AM
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    TomLikesSausages
    Just to throw another scenari/option into the fire. You can join the Malta National Trust as an overseas resident and use the reciprocal agreement with the English National trust and many other including Scotland Individual membership cost 20 Euros and Joint membership is 30 Euros. It runs from December to December and you can only join/renew in that month to benefit from a full annual membership benefit. It does also clearly state parking is NOT included. For more information see .http://dinlarthelwa.org/membership/. It all perfectly legal and is a matter of conscience.
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 11th Sep 17, 2:01 PM
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    Quentin
    And that means any morals go out of the window?
    Originally posted by Doc N
    If you consider using perfectly legitimate membership benefits is immoral, then that is down to you, and nothing whatsoever to do with the money saving aspect of this issue!
    • Undervalued
    • By Undervalued 11th Sep 17, 4:46 PM
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    Undervalued
    And that means any morals go out of the window?
    Originally posted by Doc N
    I fail to see how it is immoral.

    If you choose to join an alternative body you are entitled to all their benefits including any reciprocal admission rights.

    What you don't get however are any voting privileges, magazines, handbooks etc that you would get as a NT member.

    You pay your money and take your choice. The NT still get any other spending you make as a visitor and if they feel that is uneconomic then it is their right (duty even) to change the rules.

    Also, they have not actually lost anything unless you would actually have paid the higher NT subscription, if that was the only option or bought a ticket at the gate. I suspect many people who go down this route wouldn't actually have done so.
    • beefturnmail
    • By beefturnmail 11th Sep 17, 4:50 PM
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    beefturnmail
    A great scam - if you happen to think that cheating the English National Trust out of crucially important income needed to preserve English heritage is a good idea.

    At least the ways things are now structured, though, you won't be able to cheat it out of the parking fees too.
    Originally posted by Doc N
    Nobody is cheating the National trust out of anything - it's a legitimate reciprocal arrangement which the NT are aware of.

    Yes, they are not getting as much income, but if it were that crucial to them I think they would either close the loophole(or lower general membership fees to make the loophole less attractive). Probably they realise that people who take advantage of this loophole are the sort of people who otherwise would not go (due to the expense) and by coming at all they still able to generate revenue form them by spending in the cafe/shop.

    At the same time anyone using this loophole is providing income to an overseas charity - which may be crucially important to that charity
    • Stan.In.Devon
    • By Stan.In.Devon 11th Sep 17, 10:52 PM
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    Stan.In.Devon
    The other current thread covering the same topic is here - or at least if my computer skills are right then that's where it is .... http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5681693
    • Stan.In.Devon
    • By Stan.In.Devon 11th Sep 17, 11:28 PM
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    Stan.In.Devon
    See also this similar thread http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=4026015 it was started in 2012 but was active until relatively recently.

    Doc N will know the thread as he and I have briefly corresponded there in the past and he'll empathize with another contributor there who shares the opinion that those who seek alternatives to the English National Trust pricing structure are merely shameless, unscrupulous, unprincipled reprobates intent of depriving the NT of funds. Never mind that their admission fees, annual membership fees, prices for sundry goods within their properties are beyond the reach of some who would otherwise like to attend but are prohibited by the high costs they apply.

    Never mind that this is a "moneysaving" site, let's just adopt a smug, condescending and dismissive position on the moral high ground eh?
    Last edited by Stan.In.Devon; 12-09-2017 at 10:00 AM.
    • 88Sarah
    • By 88Sarah 12th Sep 17, 10:24 AM
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    88Sarah
    As a Money Saving Forum I have found this post very useful. The National Trust are fully aware of this so called loophole. There was an article about it the Daily Mail a couple of years back. I actually joined the Scottish National trust which gave me free parking and a considerable saving. I was unaware of the Malta option and it might be worth considering in the future. If the English National Trust were really concerned they would close the reciprocal arrangement or a least do away with the free parking concession.
    • Wayne's Woes
    • By Wayne's Woes 12th Sep 17, 11:58 AM
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    Wayne's Woes
    I fully concur with the above post. This forum is about Money savings availability. If it is a loophole but fully legal then you can consider if you want to take one of the options. Everyone is entitled to air their opinion but surely it should be on a separate discussion forum. We also were interested to hear about the Malta reciprocal arrangement but will stick with the New Zealand option. Some sites will not charge you for parking but it does not cover purely the coastal car parks within a walking area. Personally we have no objection to paying for parking as it gives something back to English National Trust as well as buying tea, coffee etc so it not a case of all taking and not contributing.
    • beefturnmail
    • By beefturnmail 12th Sep 17, 12:37 PM
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    beefturnmail
    Incidentally, Heritage NZ membership does not allow admission to Wakehurst Place. Full list of benefits to members is here: http://www.heritage.org.nz/~/~/link.aspx?_id=A79E087FB9A44AA0A2566D2E70CC58CC&_z= z
    • Wayne's Woes
    • By Wayne's Woes 12th Sep 17, 5:50 PM
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    Wayne's Woes
    Is there a list somewhere of properties that you cannot use with your New Zealand card and presumably the same rule would apply to the Malta, Italian and Scottish members.Thank you anyone that can help.
    • Stan.In.Devon
    • By Stan.In.Devon 12th Sep 17, 6:42 PM
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    Stan.In.Devon
    Is there a list somewhere of properties that you cannot use with your New Zealand card and presumably the same rule would apply to the Malta, Italian and Scottish members.Thank you anyone that can help.
    Originally posted by Wayne's Woes
    To the best of my knowledge the NZ card is only specifically excluded from the Wakehurst/Kew place in London. And, as has been covered at length, the vast majority of English Heritage sites are included too.

    And equally well discussed is the parking situation for NZ card holders. i.e. no free parking at all is officially granted by the card. Up to recently parking wasn't much of an issue in many English NT sites but, (and again I say it's been covered before at length), that looks like it's changing due to the provision of parking ticket machines. The current unknown is more to do with the degree of enforcement at these places. I would guess that, in time, English NT will consider their options and start issuing parking charge notices (not fines, as they're in a different class of penalty). Therefore expect to see a swelling in the ranks of Scottish National Trust members.
    • 88Sarah
    • By 88Sarah 13th Sep 17, 2:53 PM
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    88Sarah
    To Summerise from various posts it would appear to get an annual joint membership of the National Trust the following costs will apply.

    English National Trust. £108 (includes Parking)
    Scottish National Trust £ 63 (includes Parking)
    New Zealand National Trust NZ$72 (approx £40) (Includes some parking)
    Malta National Trust 30 Euros (approx £29)( No Parking)

    There are 10 other Organisations/countries with reciprocal arrangements but I do not know if they are open to Overseas residents or what is the cost of membership.

    My opinion if you only going to make 3 or 4 visits then the Malta option is the best value
    If you going to make a significant amount of visit the the Scottish one would be the best deal
    New Zealand falls between the two..As it currently stands with the present rules all work out a lot cheaper than joining the English National Trust.
    Last edited by 88Sarah; 14-09-2017 at 10:58 AM.
    • Syman
    • By Syman 15th Sep 17, 7:26 PM
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    Syman
    To Summerise from various posts it would appear to get an annual joint membership of the National Trust the following costs will apply.

    English National Trust. £108 (includes Parking)
    Scottish National Trust £ 63 (includes Parking)
    New Zealand National Trust NZ$72 (approx £40) (Includes some parking)
    Malta National Trust 30 Euros (approx £29)( No Parking)
    .
    Originally posted by 88Sarah
    the joint membership for scot Nat Trust listed above is for joint senior (one over 60)
    English nat trust has no such age restraints.

    So for a couple both under 60, the savings only amount to about £8/year
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    • Stan.In.Devon
    • By Stan.In.Devon 17th Sep 17, 6:46 PM
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    Stan.In.Devon
    the joint membership for scot Nat Trust listed above is for joint senior (one over 60)
    English nat trust has no such age restraints.

    So for a couple both under 60, the savings only amount to about £8/year
    Originally posted by Syman
    Why do you say the English NT has no age restraints? Or am I misunderstanding you? If so I apologise.

    See here ..... To say a big thank you to our loyal members and to make sure everybody can continue to enjoy the places they love, we offer a 25 per cent senior discount. If you’re 60 or over and you’ve held an individual or joint membership for at least five of the last ten years, you’ll be eligible for the reduced fee.
    For 2017 you’ll pay £48.60 for an individual senior membership and if you hold a joint senior membership it’s £80.40.
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