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  • FIRST POST
    • 360ollie
    • By 360ollie 12th Aug 17, 6:21 PM
    • 23Posts
    • 8Thanks
    360ollie
    Parking Tickets clarification, I have read the newbie form
    • #1
    • 12th Aug 17, 6:21 PM
    Parking Tickets clarification, I have read the newbie form 12th Aug 17 at 6:21 PM
    Good evening everyone,

    I have read the Newbie thread, but before taking any steps (step 1 (the appeal- BPA registered) and step 4 (regarding solicitors and formal demands- 'Notice of Impending legal action')

    Firstly I want to say thank you for taking the time to read this, just a heads up it may be a long read.

    So basically the issue I have is that I have Parking charge notices from 'Total Parking Solutions' (TPS).
    The question I'm putting forward is that 2/3 or the charges provide photo's however they are close ups of the registration/ number plates and the actual ticket on the windscreen.
    How could they provide evidence that it was on their property if all you can see from the photos is the vehicle? -
    So the question is could I provide a wider angled photo of the car parked at another car park which is unrelated to the company and provide that as evidence? I mean if there is no evidence of the surroundings which would suggest that it was on their property then what grounds do they have?

    The last Parking Notice is a bit different, basically its an educational organisation that employs TPS, to enter the ground you must go through a barrier which is operated by (presumed an employee of the company/ campus security). I needed to move my belongings out of campus and told the barrier operator that I wasn't going to be long (I had two witnesses in my car (helpers to move out)). On several occasions before they had given me a temporary notice to display in my car which entitles me to park for one hour. This time he didn't and he continued to let me through knowing I was moving out.

    Upon parking I saw 2 parking enforcers out doing their rounds, before parking I spoke to one of them, I asked "will you book me if I park here, I just need to load my car up" in which his reply was "No, but you should of been given a temporary parking notice though" I replied I hadn't and he went on to say some defamatory language towards the barrier operator/ college.

    He said he wouldn't book me if I wasn't long, I drove round to find a space which resulted in me parking behind the campus (still on their land) I went to pack and on return found that I had been issued a parking charge notice (presumed by the other warden on patrol).

    So my question to you for this parking fine is, because I had verbal consent from a warden himself and the barrier operator does that alter the contract terms for the parking clause? Surely if I was told I could park there and provide to witness statements then that would make this charge voidable?

    I have recently recieved 'Notice of Impending legal action' from 'I.E Legal Solicitors'
    Saying that I can still dispute (presumed to be limited to the 15th august 2017- which is the time they have given me to pay £110, from a £60 parking fine).

    Should I use step 1 to appeal to the solicitor firm (use the appeal provided in the newbie thread, or actually give my own account of what happened) or continue straight to step 4? And provide a larger photo as evidence to show that the surroundings were not of campus but indeed another car park or housing estate etc.. I want to stop it before It reaches the stage where I have to draft up a defence.

    Many thanks for your help and sorry for the long read! :beer:
    Last edited by 360ollie; 12-08-2017 at 6:29 PM.
Page 3
    • 360ollie
    • By 360ollie 16th Sep 17, 10:38 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    360ollie
    Here Is the pre court notice
    https://www.flickr.com/photos/151560534@N06/?
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 17th Sep 17, 12:07 AM
    • 50,098 Posts
    • 63,477 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Okay, so leave it with just "regards", no signature included?
    Originally posted by 360ollie
    I have left all names out of the replies, only finishing the letters off with just "regards"
    NO. That's why they are ignoring the emails. They will say they are from an unknown person, with no name and no postal address.

    So the KEEPER signs a letter attaching all the emails and says - in more formal language - oi, why are you ignoring me, and please now put this case 'on hold' and send me a copy of all photos taken, and all letters your clients purport to have sent to me. And a breakdown of how your clients contend that an already hugely-inflated parking charge (which the Supreme Court Judges in ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis held already included a significant sum in profit for the parking firm) has doubled and more, this despite the POFA 2012 Schedule 4 disallowing double recovery and setting a ceiling on the sum that can be recovered from a registered keeper like me.

    Ask if the client contends they have complied with the POFA, because it is a fact that the keeper was not the driver. Give the Solicitors 21 days to supply the information in the interests of open communication and the overriding objective in pre-Court communication in any consumer dispute, and finally, ask them to explain why they ignored the emails and have provided no evidence whatsoever thus far.

    Add that the driver had a verbal contract which was overheard by others, and the PPC's own employee agreed that the driver would not the ticketed under these circumstances. And state that the keeper is aware of the persuasive appeal case in Jopson v Home Guard at Oxford last year, and is confident that this has application here, and the Beavis case can be fully distinguished. Thus, any claim would be misconceived and bound to fail. Use that language.

    Show us your planned letter and please get the keeper to sign and date it. Set it out as a formal letter, address top right, heading, quote their ref, VRN, PCN number etc., use the formal: ''Dear Sirs/Yours faithfully'' style.

    This has not been handled properly by emailing anonymously, and the keeper is sleepwalking into a court claim right now and needs to fight back robustly and get it past 1st October if possible, to make the claim harder for the Solicitors.

    And complain to your MP about them as well, and ask the MP to support the Bill going through Parliament in 2018:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=73128070#post73128070

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=73048725#post73048725

    Try to engage them in some letters/emails first to head them off this month, to delay the claim until after 1st October:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=73134545#post73134545

    After that date they'll find their robo-claims much harder.

    So engage them this month, in requests for photos and evidence, all sorts, reply to everything they send, asking something else. Ask for copies of all letters sent, and photos of the signs. Keep the Solicitors busy. Keep proof of posting every letter, a receipt from the Post Office 'certificate of posting' (it is free) and staple it to a printed copy of the letter each time, for your file, so the 'certs of posting' are kept safely in case in the end this needs a defence at a hearing.

    And tell the keeper to trust you, and us. This is winnable (no CCJ as long as no-one hangs about and sits on a court claim, waiting for you to see it). A claim will need action, and we know what to do. This will be something to talk about as a family!
    Last edited by Coupon-mad; 17-09-2017 at 12:14 AM.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • 360ollie
    • By 360ollie 17th Sep 17, 8:44 AM
    • 23 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    360ollie
    The reply

    Dear Sirs,
    I am writing to you regarding my dispute, which has been sent to you numerous times through E-mail, both to your debt collection department and other departments within your firm (asking the receiver to forward the emails onto the correct department). All Emails have been sent within the allotted time frame given, which is stated on the bottom of all letters that I have received from you. However I have not received any replies and you have continually sent me more letters through the post stating I have “ignored your previous correspondence”, this is held to be untrue. Times and dates of all emails and their content that was sent to your department will be attached to the bottom of this letter as proof.
    Please now put this case 'on hold' and send me a copy of all photos taken, and all letters your clients purport to have sent to me. And a breakdown of how your clients contend that an already hugely-inflated parking charge (which the Supreme Court Judges in ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis held already included a significant sum in profit for the parking firm) has doubled and more, this despite the POFA 2012 Schedule 4 disallowing double recovery and setting a ceiling on the sum that can be recovered from a registered keeper like me.
    Does your Client contend they have complied with the POFA, because it is a fact that the keeper was not the driver. You have 21 days to supply the information in the interests of open communication and the overriding objective in pre-Court communication in any consumer dispute.
    Furthermore, I will ask you to explain why you have ignored the emails and have provided no evidence whatsoever thus far.
    The driver had a verbal contract which was overheard by others, and the PPC's own employee agreed that the driver would not the ticketed under these circumstances. The keeper is aware of the persuasive appeal case in Jopson v Home Guard at Oxford last year, and is confident that this has application here, and the Beavis case can be fully distinguished. Thus, any claim would be misconceived and bound to fail.
    Yours Faithfully
    (named keeper of this vehicle)

    I will print out all times and dates of emails sent, as well as the content within the latest email sent to them.
    do they have 21 days to reply to the question just about POFA or the letter as a whole?
    i will again send it in the form of a letter and email. signed by the keepers name on both.
    one last thing, with moving back to uni. if I request them to send all new forms of communication to a new address. do they have to comply?

    Thanks Coupon!
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 17th Sep 17, 2:03 PM
    • 50,098 Posts
    • 63,477 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    one last thing, with moving back to uni. if I request them to send all new forms of communication to a new address. do they have to comply?
    Yes but do you want that? This would mean that the address for service for the keeper would become your Uni address, and any court claim would arrive there - and any hearing would be for the keeper to attend, at that court (nearest to the purported address for service). A bit messy. Surely the keeper will prefer their own local court?
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • 360ollie
    • By 360ollie 17th Sep 17, 9:22 PM
    • 23 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    360ollie
    we are both moving back to Uni, the reasoning for this was that we could have the letters directly sent to where we are living instead of back home.
    one more thing before I send the letter off, does it matter if I post on the day of the expiring time frame i.e they have given me until tomorrow to make the payment.. if i post by tomorrow- before 4pm then the postal rule applies and that it would not matter if my reply is received a few days after (as long as it is correctly addressed/ stamped and I keep the postage receipt. Is that correct or is this time limit now irrelevant as they are only demanding payment?
    The letter will be posted tomorrow
    thanks Coupon!
    Last edited by 360ollie; 17-09-2017 at 10:19 PM.
    • Johnersh
    • By Johnersh 17th Sep 17, 10:48 PM
    • 418 Posts
    • 753 Thanks
    Johnersh
    Strictly speaking, there is no time limit (only the Claimant's imposed one) until Court proceedings are issued. Service rules are irrelevant. It is up to them whether or not to start a claim and at what point in time.

    Get your letter posted. Realistically, if the Claimant waits a day to check if the reply comes in, they will have had it before they instigate the MCOL process, even if they do act promptly.
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