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  • FIRST POST
    • rsb1965purple
    • By rsb1965purple 17th Jul 17, 2:46 PM
    • 14Posts
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    rsb1965purple
    NIMPS - Not in my parking space - Parker in wrong car park
    • #1
    • 17th Jul 17, 2:46 PM
    NIMPS - Not in my parking space - Parker in wrong car park 17th Jul 17 at 2:46 PM
    Hello,

    Got a parking ticket through the post on Saturday from NIMPS.co.uk or not in my parking space.com. The was no parking ticket issued on the car. They are a trading name of Startaq and are BPA registered but I cant find any information of anyone contesting the charges.

    Basically what it is there are 2 dentists next door to each other. I dropped my daughter off and waited in the car with my other daughter (who is disabled if that matters) , turns out the car park I was in was for the wrong dentist. So technically I was in the wrong. But of course I don't feel I should have to pay, but on what grounds can I appeal ? The signage seems o.k

    Cant appeal to the landowner I spoke the the dentist and they were very unhelpful even to the point of being rude. It even looks like it may have been them that took the photo. A bit of research show that they get £15 for every ticket that gets paid.

    Because the ticket was issued through the post do I still have to wait 26 days to appeal it ?

    Of course my first appeal letter would be refusing to name the driver would that be enough ?
Page 1
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 17th Jul 17, 2:53 PM
    • 15,843 Posts
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    Umkomaas
    • #2
    • 17th Jul 17, 2:53 PM
    • #2
    • 17th Jul 17, 2:53 PM
    Because the ticket was issued through the post do I still have to wait 26 days to appeal it ?
    No need, that's only relevant in the case if a windscreen ticket.

    I suspect it was one of the staff taking a photo with a smartphone then uploading it to the PPC.

    https://bmpa.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/212623845-StarTraq-Ltd

    What was the date of the parking event?

    On what date did you receive the NtK?

    You use the blue text appeal from the NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #1.

    Not litigious currently.

    http://www.bmpa.eu/companydata/StarTraq.html
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 17th Jul 17, 2:55 PM
    • 1,806 Posts
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    IamEmanresu
    • #3
    • 17th Jul 17, 2:55 PM
    • #3
    • 17th Jul 17, 2:55 PM
    Congratulations on getting one of the first Startaq tickets.

    They are basically a systems company with lots of experience in processing council tickets and the paperwork will most likely be correct.

    However look for the human error side such as the wording on the signs; the quality of the images; the location of the signs and whether they were confusing.

    Are the signs "forbidding".

    You might also want to dob in the dentist to the local council for not having planning permission for the signs. Also check if they are paying non-domestic rates for the spaces too.
    Life's for living, get on with it rather than worrying about these. If they hassle, counter claim.

    Send them that costs schedule though, 24 hours before the hearing, and file it with the court. Take with you evidence that you have sent the costs schedule to them and when.
    LoC
    • Herzlos
    • By Herzlos 17th Jul 17, 3:19 PM
    • 6,057 Posts
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    Herzlos
    • #4
    • 17th Jul 17, 3:19 PM
    • #4
    • 17th Jul 17, 3:19 PM
    You should also complain to both dentists about the car getting ticketed, and the fact that whilst someone took a photo of the car, no-one asked the driver (who you are not naming) to move.

    It reeks of entrapment, especially since they get this £15 kick-back if you pay up.
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 17th Jul 17, 4:14 PM
    • 7,409 Posts
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    The Deep
    • #5
    • 17th Jul 17, 4:14 PM
    • #5
    • 17th Jul 17, 4:14 PM
    If the "bad" dentist has a website or a Facebook page write bad stuff on it, they hate that!
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • rsb1965purple
    • By rsb1965purple 17th Jul 17, 4:40 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    rsb1965purple
    • #6
    • 17th Jul 17, 4:40 PM
    • #6
    • 17th Jul 17, 4:40 PM
    You use the blue text appeal from the NEWBIES FAQ sticky, post #1.
    But I'm not contesting the signage. The photo they have shows (the driver) parked in front of it altough it doesnt make it clear to which dentist the sign relates to. See the example signage they have on their site. Cant post a link as I'm a new member

    Also they already got the owners details from the DVLA so I cant really contest them getting the owners details.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 17th Jul 17, 4:46 PM
    • 15,843 Posts
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    Umkomaas
    • #7
    • 17th Jul 17, 4:46 PM
    • #7
    • 17th Jul 17, 4:46 PM
    So what parking does the signage offer?
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 17th Jul 17, 5:03 PM
    • 40,511 Posts
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    Fruitcake
    • #8
    • 17th Jul 17, 5:03 PM
    • #8
    • 17th Jul 17, 5:03 PM
    But I'm not contesting the signage. The photo they have shows (the driver) parked in front of it altough it doesnt make it clear to which dentist the sign relates to. See the example signage they have on their site. Cant post a link as I'm a new member

    Also they already got the owners details from the DVLA so I cant really contest them getting the owners details.
    Originally posted by rsb1965purple
    Yes you are, but without seeing the signs, we can't comment on them. However very few parking scammers manage to get it right.

    The BPA template in Blue is a catch all to get you a PoPLA code and let the scammers know you are getting forum help.
    It could say, the driver was abducted by aliens so either cancel the charge or give me a PoPLA code.
    It doesn't matter what the template says, just use it as it is. That way you won't inadverantly give away the driver's details, and you will get a PoPLA code.
    If/when it is rejected, then you construct a PoPLA appeal using all the relevant template points from post 3 of the NEWBIES.

    You can post pictures by uploading them to a web posting site such as tinypic or photobucket. Paste the URL here but change http to hxxp. Someone here will change it back to a live link.
    Take and upload pics of the entrance(s) and any signs there as well as around the car park..
    Last edited by Fruitcake; 17-07-2017 at 5:07 PM.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • rsb1965purple
    • By rsb1965purple 17th Jul 17, 5:09 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    rsb1965purple
    • #9
    • 17th Jul 17, 5:09 PM
    • #9
    • 17th Jul 17, 5:09 PM
    hxxps://notinmyparkingspace.com/

    Shows an example of the signage, I'm pretty sure thats the one displayed. I'll have to go back and take a few pictures at some point
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 17th Jul 17, 5:14 PM
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    Fruitcake
    hxxps://notinmyparkingspace.com/

    Shows an example of the signage, I'm pretty sure thats the one displayed. I'll have to go back and take a few pictures at some point
    Originally posted by rsb1965purple
    https://notinmyparkingspace.com/

    You definitely need your own pics of the entrance and signs and not rely on theirs.

    Their sign looks forbidding to me, but I'm no expert. The additional charge for card payments is I believe prohibited.
    If you get a PCN, and leave, then come back again at all, even if you park "properly" you will get another charge? That sounds like an unfair term. Additional charges if the PCN isn't paid? That doesn't sound right either.

    If you can't tell which dentist/car park the sign belongs to, how can it be clear and meet the BPA requirements.

    The DVLA doesn't hold/give out owner details, only registered keeper details. If the signage doesn't meet the requirements of the BPA CoP, then they have not only breached that CoP, but also their KADOE contract with the DVLA. Consequently they have no right to obtain keeper details and thus it is a breach of the DPA. That's why it's in the NEWBIES template.
    Last edited by Fruitcake; 17-07-2017 at 5:24 PM.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 17th Jul 17, 5:30 PM
    • 1,806 Posts
    • 3,186 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    Send a copy of that sign to the DVLA. They have ruled that the phrase "and application will be made" is incorrect and misleading. Ask that the DVLA auditors visit StarTraq.

    No point in rolling over if you were misled. You have to point out why.

    StarTraq won't mind the abuse as they will use it to refine their system. That's what they do. So give them as much as they can take.
    Life's for living, get on with it rather than worrying about these. If they hassle, counter claim.

    Send them that costs schedule though, 24 hours before the hearing, and file it with the court. Take with you evidence that you have sent the costs schedule to them and when.
    LoC
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 17th Jul 17, 5:33 PM
    • 15,843 Posts
    • 24,568 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    Prohibitive sign. No parking contract offered. A trespass only case which only the landowner can progress.

    If it is the dentist who is taking the photos, you need to find out if they own the land. If they are just renting the premises, it's likely they won't have authority from the landowner to enter a contract with a PPC.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • rsb1965purple
    • By rsb1965purple 17th Jul 17, 5:39 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    rsb1965purple
    Brilliant, off with my camera tonight to get some photos I'll do it when they have all gone home, I'm a coward I know.

    So if the signage is incorrect as in the example I could not only overturn the parking but counter claim for £250 ?
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 17th Jul 17, 5:57 PM
    • 15,843 Posts
    • 24,568 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    So if the signage is incorrect as in the example I could not only overturn the parking but counter claim for £250 ?
    A counterclaim would not be on the basis of misleading/incorrect signage. It *could* be on the basis of a breach of the Data Protection Act principles, but you would need to have a full grasp of what it is they've done wrong and how this might breach the DPA.

    But you can only counterclaim if they first issue a claim against you. You could claim against them in your own right via MCOL whether or not they issue you with a claim.

    But I'm afraid you're running away with this ideas before you've sorted out more basic issues like getting your initial appeal in, getting your POPLA code, then winning at POPLA. These are the building blocks for anything further.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 17th Jul 17, 6:52 PM
    • 51,635 Posts
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    Coupon-mad
    Because the ticket was issued through the post do I still have to wait 26 days to appeal it ?
    Nope. No need to wait. Did it arrive by day 15?

    Can you show us the PCN, I've never seen one from them...
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • rsb1965purple
    • By rsb1965purple 19th Jul 17, 10:48 AM
    • 14 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    rsb1965purple
    Visited the car park the other night, sure enough the signage is exactly as the one posted on there website so I have that going for me so thats a good thing.

    But now heres the question. I go to fill the appeal form online. There are 3 options for user status , Driver (which I obviously am not)
    Owner
    Hirer

    Now with a bit of research, in law the owner is not the same as keeper. The DVLA make a point of saying that the person named on the registration document is not necessarily the owner. So which is it ? Feels like a trap to me.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 19th Jul 17, 10:55 AM
    • 51,635 Posts
    • 65,296 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    I would put 'owner'..

    Can we see that Notice they sent? Was it received by you, by day 15 and does it mention keeper liability?
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • DoaM
    • By DoaM 19th Jul 17, 11:07 AM
    • 3,565 Posts
    • 3,613 Thanks
    DoaM
    Is there not an Other option? Is this selection manadtory?

    If in doubt, select Owner then make clear in the wording that the appeal is as Keeper but the Owner option was selected as that is the closest option provided in the appeal form.

    Is there not an appeal by post/email option? (Check the NTK. As C-m suggests, please scan the PCN/NTK [both sides], redact any personal info then host on an image site like imgur or tinypic. Post a link to it here, again changing http to hxxp).
    Diary of a madman
    Walk the line again today
    Entries of confusion
    Dear diary, I'm here to stay
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 19th Jul 17, 4:21 PM
    • 40,511 Posts
    • 80,903 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    Visited the car park the other night, sure enough the signage is exactly as the one posted on there website so I have that going for me so thats a good thing.

    But now heres the question. I go to fill the appeal form online. There are 3 options for user status , Driver (which I obviously am not)
    Owner
    Hirer

    Now with a bit of research, in law the owner is not the same as keeper. The DVLA make a point of saying that the person named on the registration document is not necessarily the owner. So which is it ? Feels like a trap to me.
    Originally posted by rsb1965purple
    You could either select "owner" with a caveat as suggested above, or send a keeper appeal by post, stating that this option was not available on their online appeal form.
    Send first class from a Post Office counter and obtain a free proof of posting if you want to send a postal appeal. Don't use any other method of posting.

    Please do complain to the DVLA about the improper wording, and also complain to your MP.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • rsb1965purple
    • By rsb1965purple 27th Aug 17, 4:01 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    rsb1965purple
    O.k I have gone through the process. The complaints process online is seriously flawed as it only allows 1000 characters for your complaint. Managed to get an E-mail out of them and send the blue text verbatim without having to add any extra clauses.

    I have finally got my POPLA code. Where do we go from here
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