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  • FIRST POST
    • Hank123
    • By Hank123 16th Jul 17, 5:29 PM
    • 4Posts
    • 3Thanks
    Hank123
    Parking Eye County Court Claim Letter
    • #1
    • 16th Jul 17, 5:29 PM
    Parking Eye County Court Claim Letter 16th Jul 17 at 5:29 PM
    Hi Everyone

    New here and head already starting to spin from all the (very good) info

    In March 2017 I received a Parking Charge Notice from Parking Eye regarding a 29 minute overstay on a private car park. The free time limit was two hours and my car was pictured entering and leaving the car park on ANPR cameras totaling a stay of 2 hrs 29mins.

    The PCN was dated 5 days after the offense and came to me as the registered keeper, I do not recall when it arrived at my address, however for whatever reason I chose to ignore it. I think in part because I ignored a parking ticket I got from the very same car park many years earlier (before it was Parking Eye enforced) and never heard anything again, and also because I didn't check here or elsewhere to see what the latest and best advice was. Unsurprisingly I am regretting that decision.

    I then ignored a further letter from Parking Eye, headed "Letter Before County Court Claim", again not looking like the wisest decision on my part.

    Finally, I have just received a letter which is a County Court Claim Form which sprung me into action to get on here and investigate, and it seems I may need some help.

    Surprisingly, I found both previous letters, if that is of any help, I was convinced Id binned them.

    A couple of things to note, I have not admitted to being the driver (as there has been zero correspondence on my part so far), I'm honestly not sure if I was but I do use that car park occasionally, however, I was so sure the issue would disappear if I ignored it that I haven't given it a second thought until now. Its likely I was the driver but sometimes a couple of other people do have access to, and use my car (my car is worth about £500 so is not very special to me lol).

    Secondly and at the risk of showing you all my lack of understanding on this issue.. Am I right in thinking there are issues surrounding how Parking Companies get your data/information as the registered keeper?? If so the following may be important and that is that I did once get a PCN from Parking Eye many years ago on a completely different car park in a different city, that time my very cautious mother got wind of it and essentially forced me into paying it at the first opportunity. I am fairly certain I had a different car back then but not 100% sure, would this impact on any possible defense? The possibility they already have my details.

    I believe I'm too late for a POPLA appeal and that now I need to respond to this letter within 14 days. Having looked at quite a few other defense letters I feel I might be able to make a start on one but would love you guys to chime in on any good routes to take.

    I hope there is enough information here for people to go on, any help would be greatly appreciated folks.

    Regards
Page 1
    • Redx
    • By Redx 16th Jul 17, 5:36 PM
    • 16,483 Posts
    • 20,637 Thanks
    Redx
    • #2
    • 16th Jul 17, 5:36 PM
    • #2
    • 16th Jul 17, 5:36 PM
    read post #2 of the NEWBIES sticky thread , especially the BARGEPOLE posts

    login online and acknowledge service (no defence at this stage)

    no chance of appealing it now

    then draft your defence over the next 28 days (doubles from 14 to 28 calendar days)

    base any defence of yours on any similar BPA member defence , so PE , or CEL , or UKPC etc

    post it here as a draft (no personal info) , for critique

    they obtained RK details as a member of the BPA AOS and KADOE contract, at the time of the contravention , using "reasonable cause" , and as keeper they will hold you liable under POFA2012
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • Hank123
    • By Hank123 16th Jul 17, 5:44 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Hank123
    • #3
    • 16th Jul 17, 5:44 PM
    • #3
    • 16th Jul 17, 5:44 PM
    Ok Ill make sure to check that thread out properly, thanks very much for such a swift respose!!!
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 16th Jul 17, 5:46 PM
    • 51,440 Posts
    • 65,043 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #4
    • 16th Jul 17, 5:46 PM
    • #4
    • 16th Jul 17, 5:46 PM
    Your case is similar to ParkingEye v Beavis so I would tell you to consider a complaint to the landowner/retailer and making an offer (sorry). We know that PE will cancel after court claims have started, if they get a complaint from the landowner but only if they are paid about sixty quid.

    I know that's not what you want to hear, but you have described a situation so similar to ParkingEye v Beavis that I can't see you winning it at a hearing. Blame he UK Supreme Court Judges for that TERRIBLE, anti-consumer ''decision'' in favour of Capita-owned, sloshing in other people's money, ParkingEye.

    Prepare to defend it. But I would also urgently get the retailers on side and jointly approach PE with an offer to settle.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Redx
    • By Redx 16th Jul 17, 5:48 PM
    • 16,483 Posts
    • 20,637 Thanks
    Redx
    • #5
    • 16th Jul 17, 5:48 PM
    • #5
    • 16th Jul 17, 5:48 PM
    I agree , this is too much like BEAVIS and PE won that one 3 times

    so get reading up on BARRY BEAVIS vs PE as well , then consider the above
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • Cygnus Alpha
    • By Cygnus Alpha 16th Jul 17, 7:12 PM
    • 190 Posts
    • 311 Thanks
    Cygnus Alpha
    • #6
    • 16th Jul 17, 7:12 PM
    • #6
    • 16th Jul 17, 7:12 PM
    Your only hope is on signage. Were the signs clear etc.

    I won against PE on an overstay on the signage point. But then they did hide the sign behind the tree and I could demonstrate that I could walk from the sign to the shop without being troubled by a sign.
    • Redx
    • By Redx 16th Jul 17, 7:16 PM
    • 16,483 Posts
    • 20,637 Thanks
    Redx
    • #7
    • 16th Jul 17, 7:16 PM
    • #7
    • 16th Jul 17, 7:16 PM
    or NO VALID CURRENT LANDHOLDER CONTRACT

    ie:- no LOCUS STANDII

    chances are there are very few or NO other ways of winning this , barring a landholder cancellation or being on your side
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • Hank123
    • By Hank123 16th Jul 17, 7:42 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Hank123
    • #8
    • 16th Jul 17, 7:42 PM
    • #8
    • 16th Jul 17, 7:42 PM
    Yes, I did fear I'd be on shakey ground with this one.

    With regards to the signage I am literally going out the door now to go and check the signage at the carpark, from memory though the signage is not obstructed in any way, there are multiple signs but they are reletively small and not at the entrance (but as stated I may be wrong on that) Would it be worth posting any pictures here on this thread so you guys could give your opinions???

    Also at this stage given whats been said here and given the things I've read regarding wining cases many of which seem to have glaring mitigating circumstances that I don't have, then I think the idea of settling at a lower amount would possibly be my best option.

    Couple of questions...

    How do I find out who the land owner is? A much less professional outfit used to police this car park for Comet Electrical Stores, however since Comet folded no one has been policing the car park (retail outlets situated at this retail park include KFC, Halfords, Carpet Right and Home Bargains) recently Farm Foods took over the old comet store and that seems to have coincided with the car park being policed again, this time by PE, would this be a place to start or would I need to go to a Land Registry or something?

    Also there will be zero proof of any purchase made that day so any ideas on the likelihood a land owner would be sympathetic to my case? And would the best approach be "loyal customer who is furious with this situation" or more of a " i throw myself t your mercy" type letter?

    Sorry for all the follow up questions!
    • Cygnus Alpha
    • By Cygnus Alpha 16th Jul 17, 7:46 PM
    • 190 Posts
    • 311 Thanks
    Cygnus Alpha
    • #9
    • 16th Jul 17, 7:46 PM
    • #9
    • 16th Jul 17, 7:46 PM
    The car park I was at also did not have a sign at the entrance either. I argued that every other car park in the area did.

    What you should be looking for is whether you could actually reasonable have left your car and walked to the store without seeing a sign. Another thing you should be looking at is whether you can actually read the signs and whether they are compliant.

    My case was pre-Beavis and ironically I lost on the GPEOL point which is normally the winner.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 16th Jul 17, 10:55 PM
    • 15,425 Posts
    • 24,122 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    recently Farm Foods took over the old comet store and that seems to have coincided with the car park being policed again, this time by PE, would this be a place to start or would I need to go to a Land Registry or something?
    Something at the back of my mind recalls FarmFoods being involved in cancelling a PPC ticket (but I may be way off in your case) so worth considering an approach to their manager. Don't bother with the multi-tasking customer services/shelf filling/cashier/floor cleaning drone.

    But a (£3-£4) paid request to Land Registry might get you to your target more accurately.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Hank123
    • By Hank123 18th Jul 17, 2:08 AM
    • 4 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Hank123
    Thanks, worth a shot at least.

    Regarding signage on the site, I manged to get hold of a Local Planning Meetings notes regarding a back dating of permission for the signs. There are 28 signs in total, 21 of which sit 2100mm high, measured from ground to bottom of sign, and are 800 x 600mm in size. There are also another 7 regarding disabled bays and sit on 4/5 ft poles these are 600 x 600mm.

    Ill be totally honest here, if you're looking for them you cant miss them, if you're not looking for them however they easily blend into the background of all the other street furniture, I believe most of the taller signs are simply strapped to existing lampposts.

    Struggling to add the pictures of the signs on here unfortunately.
    • Cygnus Alpha
    • By Cygnus Alpha 18th Jul 17, 6:59 AM
    • 190 Posts
    • 311 Thanks
    Cygnus Alpha
    Of course the signs are clear if you are looking for them!

    Clearly this used to be a "free" car park so why would anyone look for new signs if they have parked there before.

    The number of signs is irrelevant. The question is, could you have reasonably walked from your car to where you were shopping without being troubled by a sign given that there was no sign at the entrance. Also note that some signs would be side on so you would not see them.

    If you are willing to persuade a judge of that then you should use signage as a defence.
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