Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • JIL
    • By JIL 14th Jul 17, 11:31 PM
    • 2,791Posts
    • 18,750Thanks
    JIL
    A Female Doctor Who.
    • #1
    • 14th Jul 17, 11:31 PM
    A Female Doctor Who. 14th Jul 17 at 11:31 PM
    According to BBC website the new Dr who will be revealed on Sunday after Wimbledon.

    Any guesses as to who this will be?

    My money is on Kris Marshall.

    Any other thoughts?

    I don't even watch Dr Who!
    Last edited by JIL; 17-07-2017 at 8:13 PM. Reason: Added who to title.
Page 8
    • colinw
    • By colinw 17th Jul 17, 10:06 AM
    • 50,901 Posts
    • 139,032 Thanks
    colinw
    My Doctor is female and she is quite good.....
    • onlyroz
    • By onlyroz 17th Jul 17, 10:21 AM
    • 13,675 Posts
    • 26,029 Thanks
    onlyroz
    My Doctor is female and she is quite good.....
    Originally posted by colinw
    Yes, I've heard that women can even be train drivers these days
    • andromedean
    • By andromedean 17th Jul 17, 10:39 AM
    • 1,374 Posts
    • 1,655 Thanks
    andromedean
    Whatever next I wonder?

    BBC decides Britain 'not ready' for Glaswegian Dalek
    Last edited by andromedean; 17-07-2017 at 10:43 AM.
    • decbel
    • By decbel 17th Jul 17, 11:07 AM
    • 1,494 Posts
    • 1,617 Thanks
    decbel
    There is talk about a male assistant in Doctor Who.

    If memory serves there has already been one but his name escapes me.

    He was was in Emmerdale farm for years.

    I think he also wore a kilt.
    • colinw
    • By colinw 17th Jul 17, 11:13 AM
    • 50,901 Posts
    • 139,032 Thanks
    colinw
    There is talk about a male assistant in Doctor Who.

    If memory serves there has already been one but his name escapes me.

    He was was in Emmerdale farm for years.

    I think he also wore a kilt.
    Originally posted by decbel
    He played Joe Sugden....Fray Bentos Heinz I think
    • onlyroz
    • By onlyroz 17th Jul 17, 11:45 AM
    • 13,675 Posts
    • 26,029 Thanks
    onlyroz
    There is talk about a male assistant in Doctor Who.

    If memory serves there has already been one but his name escapes me.

    He was was in Emmerdale farm for years.

    I think he also wore a kilt.
    Originally posted by decbel
    Rory Williams
    Mickey Smith
    Jack Harkness
    Nardole


    Etc.
    • dontone
    • By dontone 17th Jul 17, 12:00 PM
    • 3,898 Posts
    • 11,852 Thanks
    dontone
    There is talk about a male assistant in Doctor Who.

    If memory serves there has already been one but his name escapes me.

    He was was in Emmerdale farm for years.

    I think he also wore a kilt.
    Originally posted by decbel
    It was Jamie McCrimmon (2nd Doctor companion - appeared in the Five & Two Doctors as well)
    Ian Chesterton
    The Brigadier/ Sgt Yates/Mike Benton
    Harry Sullivan
    Steven Taylor
    Ben Jackson
    Turlough
    Kamelion
    K9 (he's voiced by a bloke)
    Adric

    Then the Nu-Who lot.

    And I'm told I'm not a proper fan lol.
    BEST EVER WINS WON IN ORDER (so far) = Sony Camcorder, 32" lcd telly, micro ipod hifi, Ipod Nano, Playstation 3, Andrex Jackpup, Holiday to USA, nintendo wii, Liverpool vs Everton tickets, £250 Reward Your thirst, £500 Pepsi, p&o rotterdam trip, perfume hamper, Dr Who stamp set, steam cleaner.

    comping = nowt more thrillin' than winnin'
    • zagubov
    • By zagubov 17th Jul 17, 12:11 PM
    • 14,953 Posts
    • 127,791 Thanks
    zagubov
    Ah, right.

    So we could have a disabled James Bond then? A black female lesbian Jamie Bond?

    A wheelchair-bound or a James Bond with cerebral palsy? That should make the chase sequences interesting.

    Come to think of it, why not a Mr Marple for some of Agatha's stories? Or a... etc.
    Originally posted by quidsinquentin
    Well it was a detective show rather than an action show but Ironside introduced disabled characters. Plus John Steed's (the Avengers') bosses Mother and Father, were wheelchair-bound and blind respectively.

    But there's nothing can beat Randall and Hopkirk where one character was stone dead from the first episode onwards.
    There is no honour to be had in not knowing a thing that can be known - Danny Baker
    • dontone
    • By dontone 17th Jul 17, 12:16 PM
    • 3,898 Posts
    • 11,852 Thanks
    dontone
    Well it was a detective show rather than an action show but Ironside introduced disabled characters. Plus John Steed's (the Avengers') bosses Mother and Father, were wheelchair-bound and blind respectively.

    But there's nothing can beat Randall and Hopkirk where one character was stone dead from the first episode onwards.
    Originally posted by zagubov



    And he also wore the best/worst ill fitting wig ever
    BEST EVER WINS WON IN ORDER (so far) = Sony Camcorder, 32" lcd telly, micro ipod hifi, Ipod Nano, Playstation 3, Andrex Jackpup, Holiday to USA, nintendo wii, Liverpool vs Everton tickets, £250 Reward Your thirst, £500 Pepsi, p&o rotterdam trip, perfume hamper, Dr Who stamp set, steam cleaner.

    comping = nowt more thrillin' than winnin'
    • RichardD1970
    • By RichardD1970 17th Jul 17, 12:20 PM
    • 2,715 Posts
    • 3,961 Thanks
    RichardD1970
    Does Richard Hurndle's incarnation of the Doctor not count then, or is that too nerdy?

    I watched the first ever episode when it was broadcast on the 30th of November 1963, and have been a fan ever since. I shall give the new actor and stories a chance, even though a female Doctor Foreman doesn't sit well in my childhood mind.
    Originally posted by Fruitcake
    Richard Hurndle stood in for William Hartnell so played the same incarnation, very good piece of casting.

    We won't mention Peter Cushing!
    • onlyroz
    • By onlyroz 17th Jul 17, 12:23 PM
    • 13,675 Posts
    • 26,029 Thanks
    onlyroz
    Well it was a detective show rather than an action show but Ironside introduced disabled characters. Plus John Steed's (the Avengers') bosses Mother and Father, were wheelchair-bound and blind respectively.

    But there's nothing can beat Randall and Hopkirk where one character was stone dead from the first episode onwards.
    Originally posted by zagubov
    Disabled action heroes? Charles Xavier or Daredevil?

    As for gender morphing roles, most people eventually agreed that the female Starbuck was better than the male one, despite initial scepticism.
    • Gers
    • By Gers 17th Jul 17, 3:44 PM
    • 5,962 Posts
    • 35,611 Thanks
    Gers
    Wasn't Martha Jones A doctor?

    And I'm not able to fathom out any reasonable objection to a female Time Lord / Lady. Apart from 'I don't like it' that is. Don't understand the PC argument either. It's not pandering to any PC agenda, it's recognising that the ways and mores of the world in general are changing.

    Part of the canon is 'change'. Nothing new in that.

    I was at a Dr Who festival in November 2015 held in London, there were plenty of female Drs hanging around. All dressed up as their own favourite one.
    • dontone
    • By dontone 17th Jul 17, 4:37 PM
    • 3,898 Posts
    • 11,852 Thanks
    dontone
    Wasn't Martha Jones A doctor?

    And I'm not able to fathom out any reasonable objection to a female Time Lord / Lady. Apart from 'I don't like it' that is. Don't understand the PC argument either. It's not pandering to any PC agenda, it's recognising that the ways and mores of the world in general are changing.

    Part of the canon is 'change'. Nothing new in that.

    I was at a Dr Who festival in November 2015 held in London, there were plenty of female Drs hanging around. All dressed up as their own favourite one.
    Originally posted by Gers
    Okay. I'll try and explain my opinion the best I can (I might be repeating myself here, but ho-hum)
    I would have been perfectly okay with a female 'Doctor' HAD they said that they would have a spin off featuring a Timelady (they could have had a regenerated Romana and explained how she went on in E-Space, etc) and just see how the general reaction to it would be.
    They could even have had a series with the clone, just to see what would happen.
    What I didn't want is Doctor Who as a woman, never have, never wanted. To me a Doctor should always be a middle aged bloke with a bit of an attitude. So I do think there is a bit of PC there because there has been ample opportunity to do a seperate show from the main one, (it could have filled the gap left by the Sarah Jane Adventures) and now they have cast a lady in the role. BTW, I didn't like the reveal either, it felt a bit meh!! considering the time and effort gone into the previous announcements.
    I had a feeling it would happen with all the hints and also the episode on Gallifrey where the chap got killed and regenerated into a lady. That was fine as a one off, because it gave us a bit more of an insight into Gallifrey that we haven't had for a long time.
    But, I don't think it will work because the Doctor has had companions & foes that have been women, and some of them have been strong characters and perfect foils for the DW character. Missy, who keeps getting mentioned, is not a full time character, and it worked because she was a bit of a madam and was a whole lot better that the Simm portrayal.
    Some roles should never be tampered with, & I'm afraid that this could really backfire, it could be the death blow again to the show.
    And I am getting extremely hacked of with the media and 'fans' who keep having a pop at those against the decision. Everybody is entitled to their own opinions, it seems like there is a lot of childish comments, abusive language, and down right bullying directed at those who have a difference of opinion to others. If you like it, fair enough, but leave folk alone who aren't keen on the idea. We aren't sexist or what have you. We just don't agree with it.
    BTW, re. ladies dressing up as their favourites, a lot of them do that - but it also has to be said that a lot of women fans aren't happy with the decision either.
    Sorry for the waffle. I still feel a bit disappointed by the whole thing.
    BEST EVER WINS WON IN ORDER (so far) = Sony Camcorder, 32" lcd telly, micro ipod hifi, Ipod Nano, Playstation 3, Andrex Jackpup, Holiday to USA, nintendo wii, Liverpool vs Everton tickets, £250 Reward Your thirst, £500 Pepsi, p&o rotterdam trip, perfume hamper, Dr Who stamp set, steam cleaner.

    comping = nowt more thrillin' than winnin'
    • Gers
    • By Gers 17th Jul 17, 6:33 PM
    • 5,962 Posts
    • 35,611 Thanks
    Gers
    Okay. I'll try and explain my opinion the best I can (I might be repeating myself here, but ho-hum)
    I would have been perfectly okay with a female 'Doctor' HAD they said that they would have a spin off featuring a Timelady (they could have had a regenerated Romana and explained how she went on in E-Space, etc) and just see how the general reaction to it would be.
    They could even have had a series with the clone, just to see what would happen.
    What I didn't want is Doctor Who as a woman, never have, never wanted. To me a Doctor should always be a middle aged bloke with a bit of an attitude. So I do think there is a bit of PC there because there has been ample opportunity to do a seperate show from the main one, (it could have filled the gap left by the Sarah Jane Adventures) and now they have cast a lady in the role. BTW, I didn't like the reveal either, it felt a bit meh!! considering the time and effort gone into the previous announcements.
    I had a feeling it would happen with all the hints and also the episode on Gallifrey where the chap got killed and regenerated into a lady. That was fine as a one off, because it gave us a bit more of an insight into Gallifrey that we haven't had for a long time.
    But, I don't think it will work because the Doctor has had companions & foes that have been women, and some of them have been strong characters and perfect foils for the DW character. Missy, who keeps getting mentioned, is not a full time character, and it worked because she was a bit of a madam and was a whole lot better that the Simm portrayal.
    Some roles should never be tampered with, & I'm afraid that this could really backfire, it could be the death blow again to the show.
    And I am getting extremely hacked of with the media and 'fans' who keep having a pop at those against the decision. Everybody is entitled to their own opinions, it seems like there is a lot of childish comments, abusive language, and down right bullying directed at those who have a difference of opinion to others. If you like it, fair enough, but leave folk alone who aren't keen on the idea. We aren't sexist or what have you. We just don't agree with it.
    BTW, re. ladies dressing up as their favourites, a lot of them do that - but it also has to be said that a lot of women fans aren't happy with the decision either.
    Sorry for the waffle. I still feel a bit disappointed by the whole thing.
    Originally posted by dontone

    So, your reason is 'I don't like it' then. A perfectly clear opinion to which you are perfectly entitled to hold.

    Of course, I regard your stance as unreasonable and not well argued.

    It boils down to the writers and the BBC. I don't think it'll fall flat especially as all three of the new Drs (excluding Christopher Eccleston) have been subjected to the same sort of criticism - too young, too odd, too old, not right for the Dr, too geeky, too weird and so on and so on.

    No one Dr will please all the people and it's not really a matter for debate. The selection is made. You can chose to live with it and continue as a fan or move on and stop watching. I'm not sure the BBC will miss you.
    • Jojo the Tightfisted
    • By Jojo the Tightfisted 17th Jul 17, 6:39 PM
    • 23,375 Posts
    • 90,872 Thanks
    Jojo the Tightfisted
    Disabled action heroes? Charles Xavier or Daredevil?

    As for gender morphing roles, most people eventually agreed that the female Starbuck was better than the male one, despite initial scepticism.
    Originally posted by onlyroz

    Mustn't forget Ironside.

    And Christopher Reed didn't just get the sympathy vote for the remake of Rear Window - he was extremely good as an actor with a severe disability. Because he was a good actor.


    It did occur to me that it must be nice for little girls to be able to pretend to be strong, leading characters without 'you can't be xxxxx, you're a girl - you have to be [random assistant/eye candy] instead' or 'why are you pretending to be a boy?' being heard. The alternative is what happened for many years - if they couldn't accept that the adornment role was what they wanted, they often ended up thinking girls were rather rubbish and maybe - only maybe - that has an effect upon the numbers identifying as being trans male?

    God knows, I didn't want to be a girl when I was a kid - they really were rubbish. The best one on TV was Wonder Woman, but all she did was twirl around in her knickers, be awesome, then have to go back to being demure and feminine whilst the Men made the decisions because That Was The Way The World Is.

    Princess Leia was promising in the first Star Wars, but by the end of the trilogy, she was chained to Jabba in a bikini being leered at by both the Hutt and the men/boys who watched it, and then got all lovey-dovey once the men and the psychotic teddy bears of Endor saved the day.

    I wasn't old enough to watch Alien when it was released - but I know a lot of people got their drawers in a twist when she took a genuine lead character role in the sequels, rather than the screaming, panicking, sobbing, fluffy haired woman in vest, knickers and no bra that managed to scrape through by the skin of her teeth at the end of the first film.

    I would have been disgusted as a kid if there was a female replacement for the characters I liked - but that was purely the prejudice I had learned through the years of girls being portrayed as being a bit crap, really. The female versions of existing characters and separate characters were definitely not aimed at me - She-Hulk, Catwoman, Electra, Poison Ivy, etc, were drawn in ways designed to appeal to males, for example - and their stories were all pretty lame, never mind the movies. Even more modern versions of comic book and Sci-fi characters were awful - the female in Thor was wooden and drippy (as she is in every movie), she wasted away and died in Revenge of the Sith because, well - nobody really knows or cares, she was just there as the means to create Luke, Leia and Vader (although he was equally irritating and constipated looking as Anakin - just whinier, although at least he didn't decide to die to make a point). And Black Widow, when they're not focusing on her backside, is only there because she's been sterilised, so would be all pregnant and lactating rather than kicking butt if she could be a 'proper woman'.

    I think the Ghostbusters reboot is utter tripe, but that's because I think the writing is atrocious. It's good that, again, kids can see females in a lead role, though - true equality means being able to star in a rubbish movie without the 'oh, well, what would you expect, we had to do it with females to get the backers to pay for it'.




    The main message I get from the comments posted online though, is that there are many people realising for the first time that they aren't the most important people in the world anymore - they're too old.

    I wasn't bothered by Dangermouse being remade. It's different, but it's OK. I don't have the right to demand it Stays Exactly The Same Because It's How I Feel That Matters. If, as somebody suggested to illustrate why having a woman star is utterly wrong, they wanted to remake Catweazle with a woman, I don't care - they could do it with Stig of the Dump, too. I'd pull a face at the thought of Bagpuss being remade, but if they did it, by all means have a little boy speaking the spell to wake him/her and the rest of the shop up. Postman Pat and Fireman Sam already have gender neutral names.

    Even Shakespeare has been fine with characters' genders being changed - The Tempest springs to mind. But that met with apoplectic rage from some. There's no reason why Lear has to be a King - Lear could easily be a Queen onstage (as well as off, going by some of the actors that have played the part ).


    It just doesn't matter what is done to shows and films - they're all pretend and we don't own the copyright. What matters is whether the writing and acting is any good.

    It is interesting to think that this is the reaction for a posh white woman taking the role - what would the reaction have been if it had been a trans person of colour? Or is this reaction saying that, as long as they had been born male, that would have been better than a female?


    The exciting thing is the look on children's faces - boys and girls - at the idea of the Doctor being a woman. They're the target audience, not the rest of us. We can choose to hold on to the feelings we had as children with the characters as they were at the time. Let today's children have that with this one.
    Last edited by Jojo the Tightfisted; 17-07-2017 at 6:44 PM.
    I could dream to wide extremes, I could do or die: I could yawn and be withdrawn and watch the world go by.

    Yup you are officially Rock n Roll
    Originally posted by colinw
    • dontone
    • By dontone 17th Jul 17, 6:47 PM
    • 3,898 Posts
    • 11,852 Thanks
    dontone
    So, your reason is 'I don't like it' then. A perfectly clear opinion to which you are perfectly entitled to hold.

    Of course, I regard your stance as unreasonable and not well argued.

    It boils down to the writers and the BBC. I don't think it'll fall flat especially as all three of the new Drs (excluding Christopher Eccleston) have been subjected to the same sort of criticism - too young, too odd, too old, not right for the Dr, too geeky, too weird and so on and so on.

    No one Dr will please all the people and it's not really a matter for debate. The selection is made. You can chose to live with it and continue as a fan or move on and stop watching. I'm not sure the BBC will miss you.
    Originally posted by Gers
    You can think/regard what you like. Who fans are the most stubborn around, no-one will ever be 100% happy with a certain baddie, a certain location, a certain companion & a certain Doctor. We will always have a whinge about something. Anybody who says otherwise is a liar.
    I've explained why I think it's a bad idea, and yet you still dismiss my opinion.
    I understand that the selection is made, it didn't matter who it was going to be, it will never appease everybody.
    I will always be a fan, but this will probably be my latest 'don't care for it phase' I will still have my DVD's, audio books & books to fall back on. I will never really fall out of love with it.
    BTW, I can't understand the too geeky bit, I have never heard anybody suggest that someone is too geeky for the role of the Doctor.
    Anyway, I'm getting tired with having to justify myself in regards to this. I have my opinion, i am sticking to it. If others don't like it, then tough.
    BEST EVER WINS WON IN ORDER (so far) = Sony Camcorder, 32" lcd telly, micro ipod hifi, Ipod Nano, Playstation 3, Andrex Jackpup, Holiday to USA, nintendo wii, Liverpool vs Everton tickets, £250 Reward Your thirst, £500 Pepsi, p&o rotterdam trip, perfume hamper, Dr Who stamp set, steam cleaner.

    comping = nowt more thrillin' than winnin'
    • Gers
    • By Gers 17th Jul 17, 7:08 PM
    • 5,962 Posts
    • 35,611 Thanks
    Gers
    You can think/regard what you like. Who fans are the most stubborn around, no-one will ever be 100% happy with a certain baddie, a certain location, a certain companion & a certain Doctor. We will always have a whinge about something. Anybody who says otherwise is a liar.
    I've explained why I think it's a bad idea, and yet you still dismiss my opinion.
    I understand that the selection is made, it didn't matter who it was going to be, it will never appease everybody.
    I will always be a fan, but this will probably be my latest 'don't care for it phase' I will still have my DVD's, audio books & books to fall back on. I will never really fall out of love with it.
    BTW, I can't understand the too geeky bit, I have never heard anybody suggest that someone is too geeky for the role of the Doctor.
    Anyway, I'm getting tired with having to justify myself in regards to this. I have my opinion, i am sticking to it. If others don't like it, then tough.
    Originally posted by dontone

    Far from dismissing your opinion I think you'll find that I said -

    A perfectly clear opinion to which you are perfectly entitled to hold
    I'm merely disagreeing with you - never asked you to justify yourself. My comment about not understanding wasn't aimed at you, you chose the mantle.

    Matt Smith was severely slated for being too geeky. And weird looking. And too much hair. Or was it not having ginger hair? Doesn't matter.
    • Meg x
    • By Meg x 17th Jul 17, 8:18 PM
    • 2,050 Posts
    • 2,259 Thanks
    Meg x
    Whatever next I wonder?
    Originally posted by andromedean
    This?

    ''Embrace the glorious mess that you are''

    Elizabeth Gilbert

    ''The world is made of faith, trust, and pixie dust''
    J.M. Barrie
    • onlyroz
    • By onlyroz 17th Jul 17, 9:25 PM
    • 13,675 Posts
    • 26,029 Thanks
    onlyroz
    JoJo, a brilliant analysis, as always, and I agree with every word (although I have to admit to quite liking the Ghostbusters reboot).
    Last edited by onlyroz; 18-07-2017 at 9:32 AM.
    • POPPYOSCAR
    • By POPPYOSCAR 17th Jul 17, 9:38 PM
    • 10,895 Posts
    • 22,845 Thanks
    POPPYOSCAR
    Did you, or did you watch it when it was first broadcast on the 23rd? So many people missed it the first time round, my family included, that it was repeated the following week when it was immediately followed by episode 2. That's when I first saw it.

    I was brought up with a crotchety old man who was quite ruthless and without empathy, who travelled the unknown universes and time with his granddaughter.

    This is the bit I can't get my head around. I shall watch and no doubt enjoy the new series with the new actor, but my childhood self will always say, but The Doctor is a man, who has a granddaughter.

    Also in my nerdy Whovian head, for me, there has only ever been one Doctor who has had many re-incarnations, not a first, or fifth, or fourteenth Doctor.
    Originally posted by Fruitcake
    I bought the dvd - loved it.
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

158Posts Today

2,101Users online

Martin's Twitter