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  • FIRST POST
    • AJ16
    • By AJ16 15th Jul 17, 1:31 PM
    • 81Posts
    • 31Thanks
    AJ16
    Met PCN- late demand for £100
    • #1
    • 15th Jul 17, 1:31 PM
    Met PCN- late demand for £100 15th Jul 17 at 1:31 PM
    Hi, We received a MET PCN back in April, I responded to it straightaway with the normal template type of letter listing the various non compliance with the BPA code of conduct and asked for a POPLA appeal code. I heard nothing back and assumed they had thrown in the towel but yesterday a Parking Charge Reminder arrived with 7 days to pay £100.
    The last sentence says "Further information including how to pay, the right to appeal (please be advised that the independent appeals service (POPLA) is no longer available) etc. can be found on the reverse of this letter.

    I'm not sure what options are open to me now as I was pinning my hopes on POPLA. Does this mean that it's been disbanded and that it's free for all for these cowboys?

    (sorry but I have forgotten how to attach files to the post)
Page 1
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 15th Jul 17, 1:42 PM
    • 40,416 Posts
    • 80,738 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    • #2
    • 15th Jul 17, 1:42 PM
    • #2
    • 15th Jul 17, 1:42 PM
    Complain to the BPA and DVLA that you never received a PoPLA code thus denying you the opportunity to appeal. Send a copy to the scammers as well.

    Complain to your MP, Mrs May, and the landowner.

    There is not much else you can do except wait to see if they want to try court. You can safely ignore debt colectors of course..
    Which template did you use? Hopefully it was the one from the NEWIES thread, not the dreadful not the "official MSE" version that gives away the driver's identity.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • pappa golf
    • By pappa golf 15th Jul 17, 2:34 PM
    • 7,401 Posts
    • 7,560 Thanks
    pappa golf
    • #3
    • 15th Jul 17, 2:34 PM
    • #3
    • 15th Jul 17, 2:34 PM
    did you send your appeal by email or by royal mail , I presume you kept a screen shot or proof of posting?
    • AJ16
    • By AJ16 15th Jul 17, 2:41 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    AJ16
    • #4
    • 15th Jul 17, 2:41 PM
    • #4
    • 15th Jul 17, 2:41 PM
    Complain to the BPA and DVLA that you never received a PoPLA code thus denying you the opportunity to appeal. Send a copy to the scammers as well.

    Complain to your MP, Mrs May, and the landowner.

    There is not much else you can do except wait to see if they want to try court. You can safely ignore debt colectors of course..
    Which template did you use? Hopefully it was the one from the NEWIES thread, not the dreadful not the "official MSE" version that gives away the driver's identity.
    Originally posted by Fruitcake
    Hey thanks Fruitcake, I'm puzzled as the POPLA website appears to be functioning normally indicating that they are alive and well, the BPA website also shows Met Parking as being members so what gives??

    No I didn't use the MSE template, I have made a couple of successful appeals against ECP over the past 18months or so so used those as reference and tweaked them accordingly to suit the circumstance.

    MET PCN & my April letter- see links:

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/9frfrx5bovxplyg/MET%20Parking%20notice_Page_1.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/9frfrx5bovxplyg/MET%20Parking%20notice_Page_1.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/9frfrx5bovxplyg/MET%20Parking%20notice_Page_1.jpg?dl=0
    • AJ16
    • By AJ16 15th Jul 17, 2:44 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    AJ16
    • #5
    • 15th Jul 17, 2:44 PM
    • #5
    • 15th Jul 17, 2:44 PM
    did you send your appeal by email or by royal mail , I presume you kept a screen shot or proof of posting?
    Originally posted by pappa golf
    It was sent Royal Mail, probably I just put a stamp on the envelope and posted it back. Even if it got lost in the mail it would seem odd that they waited over two months to get their £100.
    • Johno100
    • By Johno100 15th Jul 17, 3:14 PM
    • 3,001 Posts
    • 3,216 Thanks
    Johno100
    • #6
    • 15th Jul 17, 3:14 PM
    • #6
    • 15th Jul 17, 3:14 PM
    Hey thanks Fruitcake, I'm puzzled as the POPLA website appears to be functioning normally indicating that they are alive and well, the BPA website also shows Met Parking as being members so what gives??
    Originally posted by AJ16
    It should be quite obvious that they either didn't receive your appeal or received and ignored it, thus you are now outside the window for POPLA to consider your case.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 15th Jul 17, 6:52 PM
    • 50,750 Posts
    • 64,169 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #7
    • 15th Jul 17, 6:52 PM
    • #7
    • 15th Jul 17, 6:52 PM
    Complain to the BPA and DVLA that you never received a PoPLA code thus denying you the opportunity to appeal. Send a copy to the scammers as well.

    Complain to your MP, Mrs May, and the landowner.

    Originally posted by Fruitcake
    As above, quite simple.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 15th Jul 17, 7:16 PM
    • 7,191 Posts
    • 6,240 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #8
    • 15th Jul 17, 7:16 PM
    • #8
    • 15th Jul 17, 7:16 PM
    Apcoa ignored my son in law's appeal last December. I complained like mad to all and sundry and they finally issued a PoPla code late last month. No explanation, no apology.

    Send a written complaint to your local Trading Standards Office as well as those mentioned in post 2.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • AJ16
    • By AJ16 16th Jul 17, 8:51 AM
    • 81 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    AJ16
    • #9
    • 16th Jul 17, 8:51 AM
    • #9
    • 16th Jul 17, 8:51 AM
    As above, quite simple.
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    Morning CM (legend),

    Thanks for that I did try writing to the DVLA last December about them releasing my address to ECP but never got a reply. I used this address-

    Release of Information
    Paying Enquiries Section
    DVLA
    Swansea
    SA99 1AJ

    Do you know of a more suitable one I could use?
    cheers.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 16th Jul 17, 9:37 AM
    • 14,996 Posts
    • 23,551 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    Morning CM (legend),

    Thanks for that I did try writing to the DVLA last December about them releasing my address to ECP but never got a reply. I used this address-

    Release of Information
    Paying Enquiries Section
    DVLA
    Swansea
    SA99 1AJ

    Do you know of a more suitable one I could use?
    cheers.
    Originally posted by AJ16
    Use this email address:

    david.dunford@dvla.gsi.gov.uk

    David Dunford is the manager of the data sharing team. He is the person to contact, but not about the release of your address. Like it or not, it is a legitimate action in the context of private parking.

    You complain to him about the refusal to issue you with a POPLA code.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • AJ16
    • By AJ16 16th Jul 17, 11:18 AM
    • 81 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    AJ16
    Use this email address:

    david.dunford@dvla.gsi.gov.uk

    David Dunford is the manager of the data sharing team. He is the person to contact, but not about the release of your address. Like it or not, it is a legitimate action in the context of private parking.

    You complain to him about the refusal to issue you with a POPLA code.
    Originally posted by Umkomaas
    Many thanks Umkomaas (another peoples' legend), I will do that today.

    I only wrote to them about the other matter as recommended in another posting last year, I will update that post.
    • AJ16
    • By AJ16 17th Jul 17, 7:19 AM
    • 81 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    AJ16
    Apcoa ignored my son in law's appeal last December. I complained like mad to all and sundry and they finally issued a PoPla code late last month. No explanation, no apology.

    Send a written complaint to your local Trading Standards Office as well as those mentioned in post 2.
    Originally posted by The Deep
    Hi, We don't have a Trading Standards Office so I guess I need to complain to the Citizens' Advice Bureau?
    • Johno100
    • By Johno100 17th Jul 17, 7:41 AM
    • 3,001 Posts
    • 3,216 Thanks
    Johno100
    Hi, We don't have a Trading Standards Office so I guess I need to complain to the Citizens' Advice Bureau?
    Originally posted by AJ16
    The enforcement of trading standards and associated tasks is a statutory duty of councils, it may not be called Trading Standards where you live (some call it Regulatory Services) or is the responsibility of the County rather than the borough or town council, but you can't just not have one.

    Check here and this should tell you.

    https://www.tradingstandards.uk/consumers/support-advice
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 17th Jul 17, 12:29 PM
    • 7,191 Posts
    • 6,240 Thanks
    The Deep
    Do not bother complaining to CAB unless you are up to your ears in debt. Their ignorance of Consumer and Contract law is legendary.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 17th Jul 17, 7:46 PM
    • 50,750 Posts
    • 64,169 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Hi, We don't have a Trading Standards Office so I guess I need to complain to the Citizens' Advice Bureau?
    Originally posted by AJ16
    No chance!
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • AJ16
    • By AJ16 23rd Jul 17, 11:54 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    AJ16
    update 23 July
    On your advice I emailed the BPA complaining about MET Parking Services, they responded back very quickly and asked if I had proof of posting my 'appeal' letter to MET, I simply said that the date of posting was the date of the letter.

    I also wrote this to MET- See enclosed correspondence to the British Parking Association.

    "Be aware that as you did not respond to my 7 May letter, you denied me the opportunity to appeal, consequently complaints have been raised against you to the BPA, DVLA, The land owner, Trading Standards, my local MP, I may well also lobby the Prime Minister."

    I thought then that MET would respond and say that as I didn't have proof of posting that there was no evidence to prove that I had sent the 'appeal' to them and I would be denied a POPLA code. Anyway a couple of days ago a letter arrived from MET (strangely dated 23 July!). They said-


    " We note that you did not receive our rejection of representation sent 31st May 2017 (I enclose a copy for your reference) and did not have the chance to pay at the discounted rate. We have on this occasion as a goodwill gesture reset the charge to a discounted rate of £50 to be paid within 14 days of this letter. I have also reissued a POPLA code for you..."


    In fact they enclosed two copy letters, one dated 17 May which requested further evidence (bear in mind that my 'appeal' to the PCN was very detailed), the other dated 31 May.

    The fact that I didn't receive either letter from them makes me very suspicious, the fact that they are now offering 'goodwill' is unexpected indeed and odd from a parking company!

    I don't know what you guys think but I get the impression that something doesn't add up here and that it's maybe only because I wrote to the BPA that they responded in this way. I guess that as they themselves didn't have POP for their letters that they were obliged to respond as they did particularly with BPA looking on. The very fact that they put todays date on a letter sent out last week gives a clue as to how poor they are at getting things right.

    I'm still waiting to hear back from Mc Donald's but I am now going to make a POPLA appeal and and home in on poor signage which does not comply with the BPA code of conduct. I'll include loads of other relevant points as well as the two previous appeals were upheld.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 24th Jul 17, 12:03 AM
    • 50,750 Posts
    • 64,169 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    I don't know what you guys think but I get the impression that something doesn't add up here and that it's maybe only because I wrote to the BPA that they responded in this way.
    Yes. We have seen this sooo often from MET. The suspicion is they never send rejection letters in some cases, and wait for a few people to demand a POPLA code, then cough one up when cornered by the BPA.

    Other victims never do complain, ignore it and get pursued for months by debt collector letters, and I am sure plenty fold and pay.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • AJ16
    • By AJ16 3rd Sep 17, 10:45 AM
    • 81 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    AJ16
    UPDATE

    I got a reply from Mc Donald's but not that helpful partly because we now have a POPLA appeal in progress.

    I submitted a long appeal statement and last week POPLA emailed to say that MET Parking Services had submitted their case and oddly offered me the opportunity to respond.

    There was a link to their words which opened fine, but the link to their photos did not so I had to twice request POPLA to resend, eventually on Friday they sent a PDF which shows the operator's photos and I have included a Dropbox link to it below. I would like some advice please on how to respond now as the MPS written response has addressed some of my main points.

    I think the case hangs on the signage and in particular the absence of a large sign at the entrance as required by the BPA Code of Practice. There is a contract letter from Mc Donalds which requires that "MET to act, at all times, in accordance with the BPA Code of Practice...".

    The one they mark as their entrance sign is not at the entrance and does not comply with the Code, it doesn't even have an ANPR warning or logo on it and no charging information.

    You will see that it has a 2013 date stamp also so they couldn't even be bothered to take an up to date one.

    The exit photo has a clip of the front number plate and my surname is misspelled at one point so it shows how sloppy they are.

    Do you think I should really home in on the lack of entrance signage and not mention anything else?

    This is the link to their case submission, Sections A and E are the most relevant ones.
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/820l70u92g5ns0v/MP%20POPLA%20submission%20%28redacted%20informatio n%20copy%29.pdf?dl=0
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 3rd Sep 17, 11:25 AM
    • 14,996 Posts
    • 23,551 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    The one they mark as their entrance sign is not at the entrance and does not comply with the Code, it doesn't even have an ANPR warning or logo on it and no charging information.
    Your vehicle has been captured by their ANPR camera before it has reached the entrance sign, so either they are capturing you before you enter the car park, or their entrance sign is not at the entrance. They can't have it both ways!

    Do you think I should really home in on the lack of entrance signage and not mention anything else?
    You need to also comment on the amount of tiny print on their other signs, especially the virtual hidden level of parking charge. The Supreme Court in Beavis accepted that the signage their formed a contract with the motorist especially as the 'penalty' was very clearly displayed.

    Check out ParkingEye signs on Google images and embed in your reply the image where £85 is shown in significantly larger font than that used on the rest of the sign. Compare it with the MET version where the font size of the 'penalty' is the same as the rest of the wording.

    Also check out 'Lord Denning's Red Hand' statement and build it into your rebuttal.

    See if others want to add anything if there's still time to meet the POPLA 7-day deadline for your rebuttal.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • AJ16
    • By AJ16 3rd Sep 17, 12:06 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 31 Thanks
    AJ16
    Your vehicle has been captured by their ANPR camera before it has reached the entrance sign, so either they are capturing you before you enter the car park, or their entrance sign is not at the entrance. They can't have it both ways!


    You need to also comment on the amount of tiny print on their other signs, especially the virtual hidden level of parking charge. The Supreme Court in Beavis accepted that the signage their formed a contract with the motorist especially as the 'penalty' was very clearly displayed.

    Check out ParkingEye signs on Google images and embed in your reply the image where £85 is shown in significantly larger font than that used on the rest of the sign. Compare it with the MET version where the font size of the 'penalty' is the same as the rest of the wording.

    Also check out 'Lord Denning's Red Hand' statement and build it into your rebuttal.

    See if others want to add anything if there's still time to meet the POPLA 7-day deadline for your rebuttal.
    Originally posted by Umkomaas
    Thanks for your time and thanks re your assessment, it's very kind of you. POPLA emailed first on 29th but only sent the MP PDF on 31st so I have a few days yet although I will aim to submit at end of today or tomorrow latest.
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