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    • mutley74
    • By mutley74 13th Jul 17, 8:50 AM
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    mutley74
    Son to visit other parent advice pls
    • #1
    • 13th Jul 17, 8:50 AM
    Son to visit other parent advice pls 13th Jul 17 at 8:50 AM
    Son has live with me for 11 years, he is now aged 15.


    His mum lives a far away and does not keep much relationship with him. He has said he wants to see her during school holidays, and she messaged to say she is ready to see him again.


    Thing is I was going to send him on the coach or train, but she wont give me any address where he will be staying. As I am PWC (full residency rights) do I have a right to ask for this? I feel if anything goes wrong I have the right to know where he is. (I have an idea of the city but not an address where she lives. Too far for me to drive down). She also wont pay for 1/2 of his travel costs!

    Last time he went a few years back, he did not get on with her family, something happened and he was very upset. She did not support him at all then.

    Any help appreciated as ex is being un cooperative (as usual) and need to get this sorted out over next few days.
    Last edited by mutley74; 13-07-2017 at 8:54 AM.
Page 1
    • pmlindyloo
    • By pmlindyloo 13th Jul 17, 10:02 AM
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    pmlindyloo
    • #2
    • 13th Jul 17, 10:02 AM
    • #2
    • 13th Jul 17, 10:02 AM
    I don't know the background to your relationship with your son's mother but there may be a reason she doesn't want to give the address.

    As your son is 15 years old just make sure that he has a mobile phone so that you can contact him and he can contact you. If things go wrong then he can make arrangements and give you an address if you need to pick him up.

    Since it is your son that has made the request to pick him up then your paying for the travel expenses seem the right thing to do.

    To be honest, whatever the rights or wrongs of any of this it is your son who wants to meet up with his mum and you must give him the chance to do so. Making things difficult is not a good idea.
    • mutley74
    • By mutley74 13th Jul 17, 10:07 AM
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    mutley74
    • #3
    • 13th Jul 17, 10:07 AM
    • #3
    • 13th Jul 17, 10:07 AM
    I don't know the background to your relationship with your son's mother but there may be a reason she doesn't want to give the address.

    As your son is 15 years old just make sure that he has a mobile phone so that you can contact him and he can contact you. If things go wrong then he can make arrangements and give you an address if you need to pick him up.

    Since it is your son that has made the request to pick him up then your paying for the travel expenses seem the right thing to do.

    To be honest, whatever the rights or wrongs of any of this it is your son who wants to meet up with his mum and you must give him the chance to do so. Making things difficult is not a good idea.
    Originally posted by pmlindyloo

    I am trying to facilitate this the best I can. She lives over 250 miles from us (unless she has moved again). Driving down to collect him is not an option for me. Even if I knew her address I would never call up near hour - I have no interest or reason.


    No idea why I should pay the full travel expenses, when she should be paying 1/2 (that was terms in past contact orders).
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 13th Jul 17, 10:27 AM
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    Mojisola
    • #4
    • 13th Jul 17, 10:27 AM
    • #4
    • 13th Jul 17, 10:27 AM
    Son has live with me for 11 years, he is now aged 15.

    His mum lives a far away and does not keep much relationship with him. He has said he wants to see her during school holidays, and she messaged to say she is ready to see him again.

    She also wont pay for 1/2 of his travel costs!

    Last time he went a few years back, he did not get on with her family, something happened and he was very upset. She did not support him at all then.
    Originally posted by mutley74
    If your son got very upset last time, have you talked through with him what to do if something happens again? He's old enough now to walk away from trouble, get in touch with you and head for home.

    Would finding the money for travel be difficult for you or is it a case of it not being fair that you pay all the costs? If it's the fairness, you'll probably have to grit your teeth and accept that you're doing it for your son and he's the important one.

    As the distance is so great, what about booking a short break somewhere half way - if she really wants to see him, she will make her way there and they can spend the day together.

    If that goes well and your son wants to spend more time with her, you can revisit the problems of him being sent off alone.
    • pmlindyloo
    • By pmlindyloo 13th Jul 17, 10:46 AM
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    pmlindyloo
    • #5
    • 13th Jul 17, 10:46 AM
    • #5
    • 13th Jul 17, 10:46 AM
    I am trying to facilitate this the best I can. She lives over 250 miles from us (unless she has moved again). Driving down to collect him is not an option for me. Even if I knew her address I would never call up near hour - I have no interest or reason.


    No idea why I should pay the full travel expenses, when she should be paying 1/2 (that was terms in past contact orders).
    Originally posted by mutley74
    I feel that you are struggling with this and wonder if you have fears that your son might want to stay there rather than return to you. Or, you still feel very bitter about your ex not having contact with your son on a regular basis.

    It is difficult for you and I do understand but it is your son that wants the contact and you must respect this. The travelling expenses are a bit of a red herring really - your ex has not kept to the contact order (as far as I know) so really that does not apply.

    You do seem to be making excuses (forgive me for saying this because I do understand).

    I disagree about changing the arrangements - your son is old enough to cope with this. Just do the usual things you would do if he was going to stay with friends a long way off so that emergencies are covered and he knows what to do.

    Some parent have a secret code with their offspring - some form of text message which others wouldn't understand and be offended with -so that you would know that he is feeling uncomfortable and needs to leave. Perhaps you could work something out together?

    Is mum paying for his food etc? Do make sure that he has an emergency fund of money which he can use if he needs to get home.

    Whatever happens on the visit your son will have tried to rekindle his relationship with his mum and you will need to support him afterwards.
    • mutley74
    • By mutley74 13th Jul 17, 10:58 AM
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    mutley74
    • #6
    • 13th Jul 17, 10:58 AM
    • #6
    • 13th Jul 17, 10:58 AM
    I feel that you are struggling with this and wonder if you have fears that your son might want to stay there rather than return to you. Or, you still feel very bitter about your ex not having contact with your son on a regular basis.

    It is difficult for you and I do understand but it is your son that wants the contact and you must respect this. The travelling expenses are a bit of a red herring really - your ex has not kept to the contact order (as far as I know) so really that does not apply.

    You do seem to be making excuses (forgive me for saying this because I do understand).

    I disagree about changing the arrangements - your son is old enough to cope with this. Just do the usual things you would do if he was going to stay with friends a long way off so that emergencies are covered and he knows what to do.

    Some parent have a secret code with their offspring - some form of text message which others wouldn't understand and be offended with -so that you would know that he is feeling uncomfortable and needs to leave. Perhaps you could work something out together?

    Is mum paying for his food etc? Do make sure that he has an emergency fund of money which he can use if he needs to get home.

    Whatever happens on the visit your son will have tried to rekindle his relationship with his mum and you will need to support him afterwards.
    Originally posted by pmlindyloo

    I am not struggling with this.
    Simple - for years she never wanted to know him, apart from odd text or phone call. She never even bothered with a present on his birthday for a few years.
    He is the one who wants to see her, and she has agreed.
    She pays no CM and so its only fair she pays 1/2 the travel costs - she has never contributed anything to him for most of his life (she can afford to with her lifestyle too).


    Last time he visited, was supposed to stay with her for a week, but within 2 days I got a call to collect him - he said he did not like it there and could not settle. I managed to meet just over 1/2 way for me - but for my own reasons I cannot do this again. he is prepared to use the train if no changes involved.


    I just taken some professional advice, and I was advised I am as my rights as the main carer to ask for contact details, especially if there has been no regular contact and due to the distance involved.
    Last edited by mutley74; 13-07-2017 at 11:34 AM.
    • gettingtheresometime
    • By gettingtheresometime 13th Jul 17, 11:26 AM
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    gettingtheresometime
    • #7
    • 13th Jul 17, 11:26 AM
    • #7
    • 13th Jul 17, 11:26 AM
    The problem I see with her giving you an address now , given that she didn't want to initially, is that it could be any old address - so unless you were prepared to verify it in some way then what would be the point.


    So unless you were prepared to do some on the quiet detective work to find out that address then you've got a couple of choices


    1. Suck it up & let him go without knowing it


    2. Put your foot down & don't let him go - but this could obviously cause problems with your relationship with your son


    3. Be uber sneaky, provided your son agrees, and get him to install some sort of app that his location can be shown - I know there's been a lot of uproar recently about snapchat's latest upgrade for example. But as I said this option has to be used only with your son's agreement.


    What does he think about going & you not knowing where he is?
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    • Kim_13
    • By Kim_13 13th Jul 17, 11:29 AM
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    Kim_13
    • #8
    • 13th Jul 17, 11:29 AM
    • #8
    • 13th Jul 17, 11:29 AM
    My friend was in a similar situation, though without the distance factor. Her father agreed on the condition that I went as well. It won't help on the transport side of things but if the main issue is your son being there alone then it may be worth thinking about if there is a friend who would be willing/allowed to go.

    Given the distance I would want an address, if only to know that he has a way back via public transport established (it may mean researching the buses in her area) and can leave with or without his mother taking him to the station if he wants to. Be sure to get an open return in case it doesn't go well and he wants to come back earlier.

    On this occasion I would pay the transport costs if at all possible. If he can go while he is still 15 then it should be up to 50% cheaper. If your ex won't cough up to fund a future visit (if all goes well) then the blame can't be all on you as you'll have given him the means the first time around.
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    • Oakdene
    • By Oakdene 13th Jul 17, 11:32 AM
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    Oakdene
    • #9
    • 13th Jul 17, 11:32 AM
    • #9
    • 13th Jul 17, 11:32 AM
    Does he have an iPhone? If so you can use the find my iPhone app online to show where he is (at the time you needed to know). Obviously you would need to know his email address & password...
    • mutley74
    • By mutley74 13th Jul 17, 11:41 AM
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    mutley74
    Yes he has a mobile phone, he does not use an tracker app (rebelled with me on this a few times).


    I could get an address by other means, but it is lots of hassle. If there was regular contact between them, and distance not a major factor then maybe I would be a bit lenient. But when he went a few years back, he came back in tears (her bf was rude to him, and she did not help son against bf), I had to take legal advice and stop contact. Children's services told me at the time, if anything more serious happened I would be at fault for not having any idea where he was (she supplied her old address then - which I took on trust).


    He will have his debit card and some cash for emergency if he does go. But on his last visit she would not let him use mobile phone in the house to keep in touch with me via texts.
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 13th Jul 17, 11:44 AM
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    Mojisola
    Children's services told me at the time, if anything more serious happened I would be at fault for not having any idea where he was (she supplied her old address then - which I took on trust).
    Originally posted by mutley74
    Get back to Children's Services and ask for their advice on the new request for a stay with her.

    The previous BF problem would worry me - and the fact that his mother wouldn't let him use his phone.
    • kelpie35
    • By kelpie35 13th Jul 17, 11:46 AM
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    kelpie35
    Has your son told his mum that he will only be able to visit if she can help with transport expenses.

    That, to me, would show him how willing she is to have a relationship with him.

    He is a 15 year old lad and I would think he is wise enough to make important decisions.

    It is not his fault that your relationship broke down with his mum so you either have to be the bigger person and support your son.

    Does your son know the address that he is going to?

    I am sure your son will have a mobile phone so he will be able to contact you 24/7 so that should give you peace of mind.
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 13th Jul 17, 11:49 AM
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    Mojisola
    If you can arrange a meet-up for him with his mother in some way now it would probably be best.

    If he can see for himself whether she's really got any interest in him while you have a say in how his life is run, that will help him.

    If you fight his request (providing that social workers pass it), he may just wait until he's 16 and head off without asking you.
    • mutley74
    • By mutley74 13th Jul 17, 11:52 AM
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    mutley74
    Get back to Children's Services and ask for their advice on the new request for a stay with her.

    The previous BF problem would worry me - and the fact that his mother wouldn't let him use his phone.
    Originally posted by Mojisola

    I already have spoken to them, and they made it clear as he is under 18 I am fully responsible for his care as main carer. Therefore, need to know details of where he will be staying, and have the right to refuse if she does not cooperate.
    • Oakdene
    • By Oakdene 13th Jul 17, 11:55 AM
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    Oakdene
    I think the best thing would be for you, the mum & your son to meet at a mutually convienent location for a couple of hours & you go off & do your own thing whilst they maybe have lunch.
    • mutley74
    • By mutley74 13th Jul 17, 11:57 AM
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    mutley74
    If you can arrange a meet-up for him with his mother in some way now it would probably be best.

    If he can see for himself whether she's really got any interest in him while you have a say in how his life is run, that will help him.

    If you fight his request (providing that social workers pass it), he may just wait until he's 16 and head off without asking you.
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    on my solicitors advice, she can see him in the local area, but he cannot visit her residence.
    She did see him by this arrangement in December for 1 day. She never replied to my solicitor nor taken any professional advice herself to come to any agreement on contact back at her house.


    Children services tell me I am fully responsible until 18 years age (not 16).
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 13th Jul 17, 11:58 AM
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    Mojisola
    I already have spoken to them, and they made it clear as he is under 18 I am fully responsible for his care as main carer. Therefore, need to know details of where he will be staying, and have the right to refuse if she does not cooperate.
    Originally posted by mutley74
    And does your son know this so that he can see that your insistence on an address isn't you being awkward but coming from the social workers.
    • mutley74
    • By mutley74 13th Jul 17, 12:00 PM
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    mutley74
    And does your son know this so that he can see that your insistence on an address isn't you being awkward but coming from the social workers.
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    he did before, we discussed it last week, will talk it through to him again.
    • pinkshoes
    • By pinkshoes 13th Jul 17, 12:05 PM
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    pinkshoes
    Could you in invite his mum to come and visit, pay for the train fare, then pay for a hotel over night?

    I know this would involve you coughing up money, but it would remove the stress of having your son stay at an unknown address where he might not be happy, which would be worth it.

    That way they get to see each other, she doesn't need to pay anything, you avoid the stress, and your son doesn't have to be uncomfortable either.
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    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 13th Jul 17, 12:05 PM
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    Mojisola
    It's a horrible situation.

    On the basis of what happened before, all my instincts would be to keep him away from her but, if he needs/wants to see her again, it will happen at some point. Better to do it under your supervision and protection than on his own.

    I would try to work out something where she has to make an effort to see him such as traveling half-way. If she can't be bothered to do that, it will say a lot to her son.

    If she does, the meeting will take place on neutral ground and your son can judge whether he wants to visit her, her BF and her family at home or whether he'd like to keep the contact to her alone.
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