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  • FIRST POST
    • jadc007
    • By jadc007 12th Jul 17, 11:58 AM
    • 5Posts
    • 0Thanks
    jadc007
    benefits & winning money
    • #1
    • 12th Jul 17, 11:58 AM
    benefits & winning money 12th Jul 17 at 11:58 AM
    Hi All,

    Just need some advice as it is stressing the hell out of me and ill try and make it simple as possible with the situation.

    This advice is for my mother who is on EESA? basically she earns X amount a fortnight and gets her rent paid monthly, she has suffered back pain and injury for many years now and is unable to work. december last year she luckily one on a game online £19,000 which when I heard made me so Happy as it was something I did not have to worry about as Im over 100 miles away because it was something i would help out with money when i could for food and etc.

    She did not declare the winnings to the social due to not knowing she had too and she put the money into my account for safe keeping and I fed her the money whenever she needed it because she admits she useless with money and I am good with that sort of thing. Now the social have investigated her because obviously she had a huge amount of money go in including her benefit from march 2016 - march 2017.

    She is on anti-depressants and after the phone interview 3 days ago she feels like shes having panic attacks.

    What is the worse that could happen and what is the best thing that can be done? will her benefits stop from now on? will she have to pay back any money ? she does not have any of the money left due to a passing in the family (paying for funerals) and helping out family.

    hope anyone can give some initial advice anyway would greatly appreciate it.

    Jack.
Page 4
    • skcollobcat10
    • By skcollobcat10 15th Jul 17, 6:39 AM
    • 188 Posts
    • 2,131 Thanks
    skcollobcat10
    I totally agree with you and I cannot believe that someone has said that there are not millions of people stealing (defrauding) money rom the benefits system.

    In the not so distant past, people used to be ashamed about accepting money or help even when they were desperate and really needed it.

    Nowadays there are a lot of people who are very entitled.

    A lot of people who rightfully claim benefits when they are single parents or during a period of illness start to feel that they are entitled to that money no matter what.

    Even when they move in with a new partner or go back to work, they don't really see why they should give-up that benefits income.

    A lady who lives locally was claiming ESA as a single parent and there is nothing wrong with that at all.

    However when her new partner "moved in" she took great pleasure in telling people how much better off she was going to be financially.

    As her partner has a NMW job, I asked her how and she had no qualms in telling me that because didn't want to sponge off of her new partner, she was going to keep on claiming and it would be so easy for her to do as her new partner was going to use his parent's home as his official address for payslips and driving licences, etc.

    She added that if her partner didn't move in then she would get the benefit money so you said "what difference does it make if he does move in?"

    So as a family, they now have the income from his job and yet she still gets ESA, CTC, CB, HB and full CTS.

    It is sickening isn't it??
    Originally posted by PersianCatLady

    There are 2 types of ESA benefit:

    Contribution Based ESA:

    meaning the person is a beneficiary of that benefit e.g. Has worked and paid into the system and has enough paid national insurance stamps and is entitled if disabled or illness strikes to claim such.

    These people mostly do not get means tested help e.g. Pay for full rent, CT prescriptions dental treatment etc. If they have a partner or an inheritance or similar their money is not affected.

    Income based ESA:

    These people may be have never worked due to illness from childhood or others never worked due to not wanting to, or long term unemployed. If on income based they get all the HB CT free prescriptions and dental and opticians benefits.

    On top of all this either type can have half a dozen kids and then receive extra benefits. Even people who work nowadays get benefits. But just because people are on these benefits, the majority of them are not fiddling the system.
    • poppy12345
    • By poppy12345 15th Jul 17, 7:20 AM
    • 1,149 Posts
    • 1,024 Thanks
    poppy12345
    All this and the OP hasn't returned to post anything since just after the first post...
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 15th Jul 17, 9:40 AM
    • 3,526 Posts
    • 5,828 Thanks
    sangie595
    C'mon Sangie. Even you must have your doubts?

    Mother gives daughter 19k to hide? Continues drawing her bennies.
    Originally posted by Thomas The Tank Top
    Yes, of course I do. But I have my doubts about the OP. This thread has turned into an assault on benefit claimants in general with wild and unsubstantiated allegations about millions of them committing fraud. I am a completely unreasonable person - I expect people to tell the truth, I expect people not to cheat and steal, and I expect people to deal honestly with each other. I have no qualms about people who defraud the system (or the boardroom) being dealt with by the courts. I irresponsibly expect people who are unemployed to get jobs! In fact, personally, I would do away with benefits for the unemployed altogether and create armies of socially useful jobs (it isn't like there isn't an awful lot of work that isn't being done!) which people would be forced to do - and if they want a better job then they do what the rest of us have to do and work for one.

    You see, it's amazing isn't it that the assumption is that if you stand up for benefit claimants, the immediate assumption is that your are some bleeding heart liberal? Given half a chance at running the world, I would probably be tougher than most people taking pot shots on this board. And by the way, I also don't just sit around on a website taking anonymous pot shots at countless millions - I put my politics into practice.

    But what I object to is baseless allegations that millions (i.e. the vast majority) of claimants are liars and thieves. The vast majority of claimants are decent and honest people who, through no fault of their own, find themselves at the mercy of circumstances, and berated as !!!!less by idiots who know nothing about them.

    For those who keep insisting that there are millions of benefit cheats - put up or shut up. Post links to the evidence that millions of benefit claimants are cheating or stealing.
    • teddysmum
    • By teddysmum 15th Jul 17, 3:14 PM
    • 8,010 Posts
    • 4,771 Thanks
    teddysmum
    All this and the OP hasn't returned to post anything since just after the first post...
    Originally posted by poppy12345
    The only other post, from them, is about getting money for a £5 note with a printing error.
    • Alice Holt
    • By Alice Holt 15th Jul 17, 4:01 PM
    • 1,284 Posts
    • 1,401 Thanks
    Alice Holt
    The only other post, from them, is about getting money for a £5 note with a printing error.
    Originally posted by teddysmum
    Perhaps it was amongst the winnings that Jack (or James) supposedly banked for his mother!!
    Last edited by Alice Holt; 15-07-2017 at 4:04 PM.
    • Carrieanne
    • By Carrieanne 15th Jul 17, 8:47 PM
    • 59 Posts
    • 54 Thanks
    Carrieanne
    Yes, of course I do. But I have my doubts about the OP. This thread has turned into an assault on benefit claimants in general with wild and unsubstantiated allegations about millions of them committing fraud. I am a completely unreasonable person - I expect people to tell the truth, I expect people not to cheat and steal, and I expect people to deal honestly with each other. I have no qualms about people who defraud the system (or the boardroom) being dealt with by the courts. I irresponsibly expect people who are unemployed to get jobs! In fact, personally, I would do away with benefits for the unemployed altogether and create armies of socially useful jobs (it isn't like there isn't an awful lot of work that isn't being done!) which people would be forced to do - and if they want a better job then they do what the rest of us have to do and work for one.

    You see, it's amazing isn't it that the assumption is that if you stand up for benefit claimants, the immediate assumption is that your are some bleeding heart liberal? Given half a chance at running the world, I would probably be tougher than most people taking pot shots on this board. And by the way, I also don't just sit around on a website taking anonymous pot shots at countless millions - I put my politics into practice.

    But what I object to is baseless allegations that millions (i.e. the vast majority) of claimants are liars and thieves. The vast majority of claimants are decent and honest people who, through no fault of their own, find themselves at the mercy of circumstances, and berated as !!!!less by idiots who know nothing about them.

    For those who keep insisting that there are millions of benefit cheats - put up or shut up. Post links to the evidence that millions of benefit claimants are cheating or stealing.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    I reckon you'll have an eternal wait for them to put up. Nanny reckons fraud accounted for 0.9% of the benefit bill during 2015-2016. https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/528719/fraud-and-error-prelim-estimates-2015-16.pdf

    Am intrigued by what you would class as 'socially useful jobs' and if they would displace people already paid to undertake them, and perhaps increase the unemployment total. As you likely know, there's legions of fit and able working age people in receipt of benefits who are unemployed but are not counted as unemployed.
    • skcollo
    • By skcollo 15th Jul 17, 10:13 PM
    • 491 Posts
    • 1,271 Thanks
    skcollo
    A lady who lives locally was claiming ESA as a single parent and there is nothing wrong with that at all.

    However when her new partner "moved in" she took great pleasure in telling people how much better off she was going to be financially.

    As her partner has a NMW job, I asked her how and she had no qualms in telling me that because didn't want to sponge off of her new partner, she was going to keep on claiming and it would be so easy for her to do as her new partner was going to use his parent's home as his official address for payslips and driving licences, etc.

    She added that if her partner didn't move in then she would get the benefit money so you said "what difference does it make if he does move in?"

    So as a family, they now have the income from his job and yet she still gets ESA, CTC, CB, HB and full CTS.
    Originally posted by PersianCatLady
    I reckon you'll have an eternal wait for them to put up. Nanny reckons fraud accounted for 0.9% of the benefit bill during 2015-2016. https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/528719/fraud-and-error-prelim-estimates-2015-16.pdf
    Originally posted by Carrieanne
    The case I quote above is fraud, pure and simple.
    Just for the record I posted that millions were screwing the system. And they are.

    Any couple doing 24 hours a week and getting a £30-40k lifestyle is poncing off the taxpayer, perfectly legal but morally reprehensible.
    Any single parent with a boy/girl friend who "visits" regularly, is screwing the system. Anyone hiding assets is screwing the system.
    All the self employed ebayers, big issue sellers,etc etc are having a laugh.
    The system is open to wholesale abuse, and it gets razzed on a regular basis.

    Safety net. Dont make me laugh.
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 15th Jul 17, 10:36 PM
    • 3,526 Posts
    • 5,828 Thanks
    sangie595
    Just for the record I posted that millions were screwing the system. And they are..
    Originally posted by skcollo
    Thanks for that. That's all the evidence we needed. In other words, you are lying about the millions committing benefit fraud.
    • skcollo
    • By skcollo 15th Jul 17, 10:42 PM
    • 491 Posts
    • 1,271 Thanks
    skcollo
    Thanks for that. That's all the evidence we needed. In other words, you are lying about the millions committing benefit fraud.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    You can link to me posting that, I assume?
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 15th Jul 17, 10:52 PM
    • 3,526 Posts
    • 5,828 Thanks
    sangie595

    Am intrigued by what you would class as 'socially useful jobs' and if they would displace people already paid to undertake them, and perhaps increase the unemployment total. As you likely know, there's legions of fit and able working age people in receipt of benefits who are unemployed but are not counted as unemployed.
    Originally posted by Carrieanne
    You did get the fact that if one scraps unemployment, you can't actually displace people to increase the unemployment totals? But, let's see, off the top of my head - nobody has cleaned my street for a decade, the park has no litter pickers because we can't afford them, when winter comes nobody clears the streets because they aren't important to anyone except the people who live there, the elderly neighbours can't get any help because they aren't sick enough, the local primary school has 30+ in a class and can't afford enough teaching assistants and that's not even to mention the 121 help required by pupils who can't be statemented because there aren't the fund to support them... and what about universal affordable nursery care so that mothers can go out to work, etc.,etc. And I am not yet off the next street!

    And yes I accept that there are fit and able people who are not in employment - but why should that make any difference? Everybody is a winner if we have a society that is full of contributers.

    But all that is by the by. That's what I would like to see. But it still comes down to a poster who has repeatedly said that millions of people have deliberately defrauded the system, and now, challenged to produce facts, appears to be saying that they haven't defrauded anything at all... but they may as well have done. In their opinion. Maybe. Well not actually.
    • skcollo
    • By skcollo 15th Jul 17, 11:01 PM
    • 491 Posts
    • 1,271 Thanks
    skcollo
    But it still comes down to a poster who has repeatedly said that millions of people have deliberately defrauded the system, and now, challenged to produce facts, appears to be saying that they haven't defrauded anything at all... but they may as well have done. In their opinion. Maybe. Well not actually.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    Still waiting for your link to my post accusing millions of benefit fraud.

    Dont worry if you cant find it today, or tomorrow. Lets say you come back inside the next week.......or so.
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 16th Jul 17, 8:18 AM
    • 3,526 Posts
    • 5,828 Thanks
    sangie595
    Still waiting for your link to my post accusing millions of benefit fraud.

    Dont worry if you cant find it today, or tomorrow. Lets say you come back inside the next week.......or so.
    Originally posted by skcollo
    #59, #64, #73

    Sorry that I couldn't post immediately, but I wasn't aware that you had a right to have me sitting around waiting for your request.
    • skcollo
    • By skcollo 16th Jul 17, 10:00 AM
    • 491 Posts
    • 1,271 Thanks
    skcollo
    #59, #64, #73

    Sorry that I couldn't post immediately, but I wasn't aware that you had a right to have me sitting around waiting for your request.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    lol

    Still waiting for a post of mine accusing millions of fraud.

    Of course you cant find one, they dont exist. If I say fraud I mean fraud, if I say screwing the system, thats what I mean, maybe you read my comment "perfectly legal, but morally reprehensible" did you understand that?

    As for
    I have no idea who or what you are, but I can guarantee you one thing - I pay far more into the system than you do!
    Originally posted by sangie595
    , that kind of sums you up, you admit you have "no idea" about me, but you are sure you "pay far more into the system " than I do.
    That's Diane Abbott style accounting.
    You're not Diane Abbott? Are you?
    • dippy3103
    • By dippy3103 16th Jul 17, 10:53 AM
    • 1,704 Posts
    • 2,559 Thanks
    dippy3103
    Fraud in the true criminal sense is totally different to playing the system. Not all frauds are equal either - low level from sheer desperation is different to sheer greed and deliberate.

    I don't believe that they didn't know £19k would affect benefit though.
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 16th Jul 17, 11:37 AM
    • 3,526 Posts
    • 5,828 Thanks
    sangie595
    If I say fraud I mean fraud, if I say screwing the system, thats what I mean, maybe you read my comment "perfectly legal, but morally reprehensible" did you understand that?
    Originally posted by skcollo
    I think you are confusing fraud with legitimate claims. If people are claiming in compliance with the rules, then that is a legitimate claim. In which case I would agree - yes, there are millions of legitimate claims, and very few fraudulent ones.

    Now that you have confirmed that there are millions of legitimate claims. I'm out. Of course, that isn't at all what you were trying to say. You were simply stirring up **** about people on benefits. And, as is made very clear on this board, if you don't like the system, this isn't the place to discuss it.
    • avogadro
    • By avogadro 16th Jul 17, 11:52 AM
    • 3,162 Posts
    • 5,331 Thanks
    avogadro
    Thanks for that. That's all the evidence we needed. In other words, you are lying about the millions committing benefit fraud.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    You are arguing with a multiple banned AE. He has expressed the same sentiments, in the same words, under all his other accounts, and doubtless keeps a few 'spare' for when ollocks-spelt-backwards gets PPRed.

    Report or Ignore
    • skcollo
    • By skcollo 16th Jul 17, 1:31 PM
    • 491 Posts
    • 1,271 Thanks
    skcollo
    I think you are confusing fraud with legitimate claims. If people are claiming in compliance with the rules, then that is a legitimate claim. In which case I would agree - yes, there are millions of legitimate claims, and very few fraudulent ones.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    I'm not confused at all, that's you. Read below.
    Fraud in the true criminal sense is totally different to playing the system. Not all frauds are equal either - low level from sheer desperation is different to sheer greed and deliberate.

    I don't believe that they didn't know £19k would affect benefit though.
    Originally posted by dippy3103
    It doesnt take a genius to screw the system, in fact the 0.7% of fraud is testimony to that.
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