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  • FIRST POST
    • jadc007
    • By jadc007 12th Jul 17, 11:58 AM
    • 5Posts
    • 0Thanks
    jadc007
    benefits & winning money
    • #1
    • 12th Jul 17, 11:58 AM
    benefits & winning money 12th Jul 17 at 11:58 AM
    Hi All,

    Just need some advice as it is stressing the hell out of me and ill try and make it simple as possible with the situation.

    This advice is for my mother who is on EESA? basically she earns X amount a fortnight and gets her rent paid monthly, she has suffered back pain and injury for many years now and is unable to work. december last year she luckily one on a game online £19,000 which when I heard made me so Happy as it was something I did not have to worry about as Im over 100 miles away because it was something i would help out with money when i could for food and etc.

    She did not declare the winnings to the social due to not knowing she had too and she put the money into my account for safe keeping and I fed her the money whenever she needed it because she admits she useless with money and I am good with that sort of thing. Now the social have investigated her because obviously she had a huge amount of money go in including her benefit from march 2016 - march 2017.

    She is on anti-depressants and after the phone interview 3 days ago she feels like shes having panic attacks.

    What is the worse that could happen and what is the best thing that can be done? will her benefits stop from now on? will she have to pay back any money ? she does not have any of the money left due to a passing in the family (paying for funerals) and helping out family.

    hope anyone can give some initial advice anyway would greatly appreciate it.

    Jack.
Page 3
    • Cheeky_Monkey
    • By Cheeky_Monkey 12th Jul 17, 10:55 PM
    • 1,343 Posts
    • 2,600 Thanks
    Cheeky_Monkey
    It doesn't sound as if she spend it all on herself.
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    That's irrelevant.
    • dippy3103
    • By dippy3103 13th Jul 17, 12:57 AM
    • 1,722 Posts
    • 2,592 Thanks
    dippy3103
    How could anyone prove that the OP knew she was supposed to report the increase in capital?
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    That's why it's rarely charged, but the offence is there and people can and are prosecuted for it.
    • Housing Benefit Officer
    • By Housing Benefit Officer 13th Jul 17, 6:39 AM
    • 2,386 Posts
    • 4,242 Thanks
    Housing Benefit Officer
    How would the DWP have known how much was in her bank account?
    Originally posted by Ostrava
    Data Matching Exercise - Google to see what it is. You can't have money travelling through your accounts undeclared and the HMRC/DWP not know.
    These are my own views and you should seek advice from your local Benefits Department or CAB.
    • Housing Benefit Officer
    • By Housing Benefit Officer 13th Jul 17, 6:41 AM
    • 2,386 Posts
    • 4,242 Thanks
    Housing Benefit Officer
    How could anyone prove that the OP knew she was supposed to report the increase in capital?
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    Because of the declaration she would have signed when claiming benefits.
    These are my own views and you should seek advice from your local Benefits Department or CAB.
    • seven-day-weekend
    • By seven-day-weekend 13th Jul 17, 9:27 AM
    • 29,496 Posts
    • 55,150 Thanks
    seven-day-weekend
    to be honest I have never claimed benefits so wouldn't no the ins and outs of winning money and claiming so didn't think nothing of it and her putting it my account was something like i said she knows im good with maintaining rather then blowing it like she would of done lol. Yep I'll push her to get it sorted asap - I would of hoped she looked also but she did tell me she had no clue she had too but hey thanks again
    Originally posted by jadc007
    Looks like she's blown it anyway, £19k in six months.

    I admit it does look suspicious that it is in your account.

    Really, no-one knows what will happen. But I would imagine she will have to pay at least some of it back.
    To love someone is to learn the song in their heart and to sing it to them when they have forgotten it
    'I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen. Not only because I see it, but because I see everything by it': C.S. Lewis
    St. Augustine — 'In essentials, unity; in non-essentials, liberty; in all things, charity.'
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 13th Jul 17, 9:28 AM
    • 28,352 Posts
    • 72,137 Thanks
    Mojisola
    Because of the declaration she would have signed when claiming benefits.
    Originally posted by Housing Benefit Officer
    The OP isn't the person who claimed the benefits.
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 13th Jul 17, 9:29 AM
    • 28,352 Posts
    • 72,137 Thanks
    Mojisola
    That's irrelevant.
    Originally posted by Cheeky_Monkey
    It's irrelevant to the money that will be taken back - it is relevant to the comments from people who thought the mother had been living the high life through spending such a lot of money in a short time.
    • calleyw
    • By calleyw 13th Jul 17, 9:37 AM
    • 8,634 Posts
    • 15,509 Thanks
    calleyw
    It's irrelevant to the money that will be taken back - it is relevant to the comments from people who thought the mother had been living the high life through spending such a lot of money in a short time.
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    No one has said the mother was living the high life. Just how the DWP will see it. As spending X amount in a certain time. They don't care how or what was done with it. Also they could say deprivation of capital. Even though that was not the OP's mother intention.

    The OP has not signed the declaration. But the mother did. Hence why she should have informed the DWP. Best to report any changes just in case. As then at least you can say I reported that.

    When with my Ex husband who was is on contribution ESA. I got him to ring and get a letter stating it did not matter what his savings where. Just so I had it in writing.

    Yours

    Calley
    Hope for everything and expect nothing!!!

    Good enough is almost always good enough -Prof Barry Schwartz

    If it scares you, it might be a good thing to try -Seth Godin
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 13th Jul 17, 9:53 AM
    • 28,352 Posts
    • 72,137 Thanks
    Mojisola
    Clearly not as you did allow her to 'blow' £19k in 7 months
    Originally posted by Cheeky_Monkey
    I have never earned 19K in a year. And still had to pay a mortgage and all bills associated with a house. Run a car and pay for all my prescriptions etc.

    £19k is a lot of money and don't forget that it was tax free as well. So to spend £1583 a month is a lot of money for a single person who does not work. And getting their rent and council tax paid. As well as free prescriptions and free dental work.
    Originally posted by calleyw
    No one has said the mother was living the high life.
    Originally posted by calleyw
    Didn't they? .........
    • calleyw
    • By calleyw 13th Jul 17, 10:20 AM
    • 8,634 Posts
    • 15,509 Thanks
    calleyw
    Didn't they? .........
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    You need to re-read what I was replying to.

    Its how the DWP will see it. They will take it as 19K spent/blown or what ever words you care to use over now it seems six months.

    I was pointing out that, over 12 months it was averaging over £1583 a month being spent. On top of benefits. The DWP will not tolerate that sort of spending for a single person. As that is how they will see it a single person. They don't care what you have done with the money. So not relevant where the money has gone, or who has spent the money and on what.

    The OP's mother has to deal with situation which I can understand is stressful. I am sure loads of other people would have not reported it either. Or not even thought to. But she got found out. And now it has too be dealt with.

    We are trying to show the OP how the DWP see it. Not me or you or uncle tom cobbly.

    Me, I always check and then check again and check again if I have too. I had an ex husband on benefits so am well aware of all the forms and declarations that have to be signed.

    The onus is on you, the claimant to report any changes. Best to report it even if you don't think it will makes any difference. And report it to each department you make a claim from. Don't assume that they will let each other know. Not always the case.

    I wish the OP's mum all the best and hope it gets sorted quickly.

    Yours

    Calley
    Hope for everything and expect nothing!!!

    Good enough is almost always good enough -Prof Barry Schwartz

    If it scares you, it might be a good thing to try -Seth Godin
    • seven-day-weekend
    • By seven-day-weekend 13th Jul 17, 10:50 AM
    • 29,496 Posts
    • 55,150 Thanks
    seven-day-weekend
    I too hope it gets sorted quickly, to avoid the OP's mum's stress.

    However, it might be a lesson worth learning that any extra money that comes your way if you are on means-tested benefits - ALWAYS ring and ask the DWP about it. Write down the person's name, the date, and the advice they gave you - then if it comes back to bite you in six months, you have a record of what was said. They too will be able to check their records.

    I must admit however, to feeling slightly puzzled that both the OP and her mum would think that they did not have to declare a £19k windfall - still it takes all sorts I suppose.
    Last edited by seven-day-weekend; 13-07-2017 at 10:56 AM.
    To love someone is to learn the song in their heart and to sing it to them when they have forgotten it
    'I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen. Not only because I see it, but because I see everything by it': C.S. Lewis
    St. Augustine — 'In essentials, unity; in non-essentials, liberty; in all things, charity.'
    • skcollo
    • By skcollo 13th Jul 17, 4:21 PM
    • 647 Posts
    • 1,788 Thanks
    skcollo
    Looks like she's blown it anyway, £19k in six months.

    I admit it does look suspicious that it is in your account.

    Really, no-one knows what will happen. But I would imagine she will have to pay at least some of it back.
    Originally posted by seven-day-weekend
    She should pay it all back, its fraud pure and simple.

    Here's another who got away with fraud, and continues to claim to this very day.

    http://www.burtonmail.co.uk/scratchcard-winner-admits-fraud-charges/story-21482854-detail/story.html
    It amazes me we have a system so abused, day in day out, and (it seems)
    nothing more than a light tap on the wrist, then back to claiming.
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 13th Jul 17, 4:50 PM
    • 3,805 Posts
    • 6,226 Thanks
    sangie595
    She should pay it all back, its fraud pure and simple.

    Here's another who got away with fraud, and continues to claim to this very day.

    http://www.burtonmail.co.uk/scratchcard-winner-admits-fraud-charges/story-21482854-detail/story.html
    It amazes me we have a system so abused, day in day out, and (it seems)
    nothing more than a light tap on the wrist, then back to claiming.
    Originally posted by skcollo
    ? How did she "get away with it", since she got caught, paid it all back, and presumably got a sentence on top of that. And how do you know she continues to claim benefits - this news item is from 15 YEARS ago!

    If people commit fraud then fine, they should indeed be dealt with accordingly. But this does not happen day in and day out, the system is not "so abused" but rather a very few people abuse it, and the outcomes are a lot more than a tap on the wrist and carry on claiming. You have been reading the Sun or the Mail too long.
    • PersianCatLady
    • By PersianCatLady 14th Jul 17, 12:32 AM
    • 339 Posts
    • 320 Thanks
    PersianCatLady
    I have never earned 19K in a year. And still had to pay a mortgage and all bills associated with a house. Run a car and pay for all my prescriptions etc.

    £19k is a lot of money and don't forget that it was tax free as well. So to spend £1583 a month is a lot of money for a single person who does not work. And getting their rent and council tax paid. As well as free prescriptions and free dental work.

    As I said before the OP's mother needs to get on to the family members who she has given money to and tell them she needs it back. And the reasons why.

    Yours

    Calley
    Originally posted by calleyw
    When you put it like this, it makes me feel sick.
    • PersianCatLady
    • By PersianCatLady 14th Jul 17, 12:35 AM
    • 339 Posts
    • 320 Thanks
    PersianCatLady
    Looks like she's blown it anyway, £19k in six months.

    I admit it does look suspicious that it is in your account.

    Really, no-one knows what will happen. But I would imagine she will have to pay at least some of it back.
    Originally posted by seven-day-weekend
    It is suspicious and I can't believe that the OP thinks that any one would fall for the "I didn't know" line.
    • PersianCatLady
    • By PersianCatLady 14th Jul 17, 12:41 AM
    • 339 Posts
    • 320 Thanks
    PersianCatLady
    It's irrelevant to the money that will be taken back - it is relevant to the comments from people who thought the mother had been living the high life through spending such a lot of money in a short time.
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    I don't care how the mother spent it.

    It makes me sick that we go to work and pay our taxes to support people who need help and they see nothing wrong in claiming benefits when they have £19,000 of their own money to spend as they please.
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 14th Jul 17, 6:32 AM
    • 3,805 Posts
    • 6,226 Thanks
    sangie595
    I "know" what happened in that case.
    I have no interest in you and your neighbours.....................unless you, or your neighbours scam a system I am forced to pay into.
    What you think of me is of no consequence to me, at all.
    Disney is a member of the benefit underclass, I didnt accuse anyone else of being a member of the benefit underclass, just that they exist, and there are millions more. Sorry if I touched a nerve.
    Originally posted by skcollo
    Thanks, but the only nerve that you touched is the one that reacts to entitled snobs. There are not millions of people stealing money from the benefits system. There are people not claiming the benefit money they are entitled to. Judging millions of benefit claimants by the actions of one person is prejudice. And by the way, I have no idea who or what you are, but I can guarantee you one thing - I pay far more into the system than you do! This is not about one or two people who are thieves. They exist at all levels in society. They should be, and are dealt with by the courts. The fact that you would prefer the courts to act differently is irrelevant to the specific crime. The fact that you are tarring benefit claimants generally for the actions of one person is the whole point. Let's hope that you never end up having to claim benefits and being treated as an "underclass" the way that you treat others.
    • skcollo
    • By skcollo 14th Jul 17, 9:25 AM
    • 647 Posts
    • 1,788 Thanks
    skcollo
    Thanks, but the only nerve that you touched is the one that reacts to entitled snobs. There are not millions of people stealing money from the benefits system. There are people not claiming the benefit money they are entitled to. Judging millions of benefit claimants by the actions of one person is prejudice. And by the way, I have no idea who or what you are, but I can guarantee you one thing - I pay far more into the system than you do! This is not about one or two people who are thieves. They exist at all levels in society. They should be, and are dealt with by the courts. The fact that you would prefer the courts to act differently is irrelevant to the specific crime. The fact that you are tarring benefit claimants generally for the actions of one person is the whole point. Let's hope that you never end up having to claim benefits and being treated as an "underclass" the way that you treat others.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    There is an underclass of "entitled" benefit claimants, they number millions, its hardly my fault you dont know about them.
    So far on this thread, I have judged two people, and stated my belief that there are millions more, I know in an average size town how many are "at it" screwing the system you so nobly fund it is no great leap to assume what goes on where I live isnt replicated across the UK.
    Millions of them.

    She may have to reconsider her ability to work, as no income will be forthcoming from the state until this runs its course.
    Originally posted by Alice Holt
    Last edited by skcollo; 14-07-2017 at 9:30 AM.
    • Thomas The Tank Top
    • By Thomas The Tank Top 14th Jul 17, 8:55 PM
    • 186 Posts
    • 483 Thanks
    Thomas The Tank Top
    C'mon Sangie. Even you must have your doubts?

    Mother gives daughter 19k to hide? Continues drawing her bennies.
    • PersianCatLady
    • By PersianCatLady 15th Jul 17, 12:59 AM
    • 339 Posts
    • 320 Thanks
    PersianCatLady
    There is an underclass of "entitled" benefit claimants, they number millions, its hardly my fault you dont know about them.
    So far on this thread, I have judged two people, and stated my belief that there are millions more, I know in an average size town how many are "at it" screwing the system you so nobly fund it is no great leap to assume what goes on where I live isnt replicated across the UK.
    Millions of them.

    Originally posted by skcollo
    I totally agree with you and I cannot believe that someone has said that there are not millions of people stealing (defrauding) money rom the benefits system.

    In the not so distant past, people used to be ashamed about accepting money or help even when they were desperate and really needed it.

    Nowadays there are a lot of people who are very entitled.

    A lot of people who rightfully claim benefits when they are single parents or during a period of illness start to feel that they are entitled to that money no matter what.

    Even when they move in with a new partner or go back to work, they don't really see why they should give-up that benefits income.

    A lady who lives locally was claiming ESA as a single parent and there is nothing wrong with that at all.

    However when her new partner "moved in" she took great pleasure in telling people how much better off she was going to be financially.

    As her partner has a NMW job, I asked her how and she had no qualms in telling me that because didn't want to sponge off of her new partner, she was going to keep on claiming and it would be so easy for her to do as her new partner was going to use his parent's home as his official address for payslips and driving licences, etc.

    She added that if her partner didn't move in then she would get the benefit money so you said "what difference does it make if he does move in?"

    So as a family, they now have the income from his job and yet she still gets ESA, CTC, CB, HB and full CTS.

    It is sickening isn't it??
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