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  • FIRST POST
    • ixworth
    • By ixworth 10th Jul 17, 6:42 PM
    • 17Posts
    • 3Thanks
    ixworth
    CEL PCN issued to me for leased vehicle
    • #1
    • 10th Jul 17, 6:42 PM
    CEL PCN issued to me for leased vehicle 10th Jul 17 at 6:42 PM
    My lease company notified me in early May that they had received a PCN from CEL for overstaying the free period in a car park on 24th April. They said that they had responded by providing my details as the Hirer.


    On 5th July I received a one-page PCN with no supporting documentation, no photographic evidence, no reference to me as the hirer or any reference to the fact that this was in response to an earlier issued NtK.


    I'm confused as to how to proceed. On the face of it, because there's no mention of me as a hirer, this is simply a first contact for an alleged incident that took place 2 and a half months ago (74 days) which would be far too late for them to proceed (wouldn't it?).


    If the notice was clearly apparent as a Notice to Hirer, I'd follow up with the POFA 13 and 14 approach as they have failed to send the required 'documents' to me with the postal notice, by day 21 after the date they were informed of the hirer's details (back in May).


    I'd appreciate some guidance on which basis to appeal on, or would a dual defence work best perhaps? I've searched the forum btw and couldn't find anything that looked like my circumstances.


    Thanks in anticipation, A
Page 1
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 10th Jul 17, 6:44 PM
    • 50,723 Posts
    • 64,127 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #2
    • 10th Jul 17, 6:44 PM
    • #2
    • 10th Jul 17, 6:44 PM
    I would go with the POFA 13 and 14 approach and add some wording pointing out that the letter itself is woefully inadequate, if intended to be a 'NTH', but that this is your appeal as hirer/lessee.

    The whole point is to get a POPLA code and kill this off. Appeal by email.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • ixworth
    • By ixworth 10th Jul 17, 8:43 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    ixworth
    • #3
    • 10th Jul 17, 8:43 PM
    • #3
    • 10th Jul 17, 8:43 PM
    Let's give that a go then. As you say, I should in any case get a POPLA code.
    • Ixworth
    • By Ixworth 16th Oct 17, 11:09 AM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Ixworth
    • #4
    • 16th Oct 17, 11:09 AM
    • #4
    • 16th Oct 17, 11:09 AM
    3 months now since I asked for POPLA. I got the automated response from them, but nothing further from them since. Does this mean that the matter is at an end?
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 16th Oct 17, 3:12 PM
    • 3,958 Posts
    • 2,211 Thanks
    KeithP
    • #5
    • 16th Oct 17, 3:12 PM
    • #5
    • 16th Oct 17, 3:12 PM
    3 months now since I asked for POPLA. I got the automated response from them, but nothing further from them since. Does this mean that the matter is at an end?
    Originally posted by Ixworth
    Did you appeal, or did you 'ask for POPLA'?

    To answer your question it would help if you told us what this 'automated response' said.
    .
    • ixworth
    • By ixworth 17th Oct 17, 2:24 PM
    • 17 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    ixworth
    • #6
    • 17th Oct 17, 2:24 PM
    • #6
    • 17th Oct 17, 2:24 PM
    Both really...


    I contacted CEL through their website with the following email:


    To whom it may concern,

    I refer to the above-detailed Parking Charge Notice (“PCN”) issued to me by Civil Enforcement Ltd (“CEL”).


    I understand that at the beginning of May CEL issued a PCN relating to the alleged parking incident to the vehicle’s registered keeper XXXXXX Ltd, and that XXXXXX responded promptly to the PCN identifying me as the Lessee/Hirer.

    I therefore assume that the PCN I have received, while making no reference to the fact, is CEL’s attempt at issuing me with a Notice to Hirer, and will proceed to deal with this matter on this basis.

    I confirm that as the hirer of this vehicle, I am its keeper for the purpose of the corresponding definition under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (“POFA”) and I write to formally challenge the validity of this PCN.

    You will no doubt be familiar with the strict requirements of Schedule 4 of POFA to be followed in order for a parking operator to be able to invoke keeper liability for a Parking Charge. There are a number of reasons why CEL’s Notice to Hirer did not comply with POFA; in order that you may understand why, I suggest that you carefully study the details of Paragraphs 13 and 14 of Schedule 4 in particular.

    Given that CEL has forfeited its right to keeper liability, please confirm that you shall now cancel this charge. Alternatively, should you choose to reject my challenge, please provide me with details of the Independent Appeals Service (POPLA), their contact details and a unique POPLA appeal reference so that I may escalate the matter to POPLA.

    Thank you for your cooperation and I look forward to receiving your response within the relevant timescales specified under the British Parking Association Ltd Code of Practice.





    CEL responded automatically with a standard "we'll get back to you in 21 days response" (which I can't find at the moment). Not a peep since 10th July.


    • Redx
    • By Redx 17th Oct 17, 2:45 PM
    • 16,110 Posts
    • 20,172 Thanks
    Redx
    • #7
    • 17th Oct 17, 2:45 PM
    • #7
    • 17th Oct 17, 2:45 PM
    nobody other than CEL can answer your question

    there is no surety on the matter until 6 years have elapsed
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
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