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  • FIRST POST
    • napoleon route
    • By napoleon route 10th Jul 17, 2:04 AM
    • 8Posts
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    napoleon route
    Is this taking money by deception?
    • #1
    • 10th Jul 17, 2:04 AM
    Is this taking money by deception? 10th Jul 17 at 2:04 AM
    Long story short. My girlfriend bought a new flat and being a diligent and very savvy woman she did a Land Registry search on the private road at the front of the property. The search revealed that a plot of land on the road which was marked as parking for the property next door was in fact owned by the management company of the property where she had bought. There were warning signs from Flashpark and a camera in the window of the next door property to deter people in our property from using it. Naturally when I visited my girlfriend I began to use this parking space and sure enough, as night follows day, a few weeks later I received two PCN's from Flashpark on behalf of their client who purported to own the space. As I was working away at the time, the PCN's took a while to get to me and before I had the chance to challenge Flashpark, I received a letter from CCS Collect demanding payment of the two 'fines'. I replied to the debt collectors with proof of the ownership of the land in the form of paid for, dated copies of the Land Registry documents, clearly showing that their clients did not own the land I had parked upon at the time in question. CCS Collect have subsequently written to me confirming that they have returned my file to their client and will no take no further action against me. I should also add, that at every stage I have copied in, by registered post the owners of the next door property who have erected the parking signs and camera, but despite my letters being signed for, I have had no response from them. Flashpark advise me to follow their appeals procedure which will involve me in a POPLA. I do not wish to do this as to my mind this would validate their actions, which from the outset I have regarded as an illegal act. I firmly believe that the owners of the property next door are involved in attempting to take money by deception, as they do not own the land involved. I would rather welcome advice on where to go and what to do next to put an end to this matter once and for all. Many thanks.
Page 1
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 10th Jul 17, 7:14 AM
    • 6,698 Posts
    • 5,700 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #2
    • 10th Jul 17, 7:14 AM
    • #2
    • 10th Jul 17, 7:14 AM
    Taking money by deception may be of interest to your local Trading Standards Department, write to them.
    • Quentin
    • By Quentin 10th Jul 17, 8:31 AM
    • 32,119 Posts
    • 16,208 Thanks
    Quentin
    • #3
    • 10th Jul 17, 8:31 AM
    • #3
    • 10th Jul 17, 8:31 AM
    Follow the advice in the newbies FAQ thread near the top of the forum. Send in an appeal if you are not too late with the object of getting a popla code

    The ppcs monitor this forum and can use your posts against you. Edit your OP to remove details of who was driving
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 10th Jul 17, 8:53 AM
    • 13,626 Posts
    • 21,373 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #4
    • 10th Jul 17, 8:53 AM
    • #4
    • 10th Jul 17, 8:53 AM
    Paragraphs please OP.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Johno100
    • By Johno100 10th Jul 17, 9:10 AM
    • 2,865 Posts
    • 3,082 Thanks
    Johno100
    • #5
    • 10th Jul 17, 9:10 AM
    • #5
    • 10th Jul 17, 9:10 AM
    Just had a look at the Flashpark website and the brochure for this self-ticketing operation. While it seems they ask for a plan of the site and where the signs rented from them are going to be located. They seemingly don't request any documentary evidence that the individual or business who sign up to their scheme actually have any legal right to try and enforce parking restrictions on the land in question.
    • napoleon route
    • By napoleon route 10th Jul 17, 10:43 AM
    • 8 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    napoleon route
    • #6
    • 10th Jul 17, 10:43 AM
    • #6
    • 10th Jul 17, 10:43 AM
    Sorry Quentin, I think you are rather missing the point. I am happy to admit that I was driving the car and that the car was parked where Flaskpark say it was. The whole point of my asking advice was that the land I was parked on does NOT belong to the people who have employed Flashpark to issue me with a PCN.

    I have got the debt collectors to drop the case, I now want Flashpark to do the same, but without using their appeals procedure as this would be endorsing by default what I believe to be a criminal act on their behalf.

    I have read through the other threads prior to posting this and can find no similar cases, hence I thought it might be of interest and I might get some good advice in return...
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 10th Jul 17, 11:21 AM
    • 1,364 Posts
    • 2,551 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    • #7
    • 10th Jul 17, 11:21 AM
    • #7
    • 10th Jul 17, 11:21 AM
    Why not follow The Deep's advice while at the same time sending Flashpark a Letter before Claim for the misuse of personal data.

    Flashpark simply process photos taken by "entrepreneurs" and other scum out for a quick buck. FP don't know if there is a contact in place as they pass the buck back to the "entrepreneurs".

    So there is a big hole in these self-ticketing operators business plan which you can exploit and make yourself £250 at the same time.

    Plenty of people here to help with the fun.
    Life's for living, get on with it rather than worrying about these. If they hassle, counter claim.
    • napoleon route
    • By napoleon route 10th Jul 17, 12:02 PM
    • 8 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    napoleon route
    • #8
    • 10th Jul 17, 12:02 PM
    • #8
    • 10th Jul 17, 12:02 PM
    Thanks Johno100 and IamEmanresu good calls from both of you. Which kind of makes you wonder how much of this goes on? My advice would be to check with the Land Registry if you have any doubt at all about the ownership of the land that you have been charged for parking on.
    • Johno100
    • By Johno100 10th Jul 17, 12:48 PM
    • 2,865 Posts
    • 3,082 Thanks
    Johno100
    • #9
    • 10th Jul 17, 12:48 PM
    • #9
    • 10th Jul 17, 12:48 PM
    Why not follow The Deep's advice while at the same time sending Flashpark a Letter before Claim for the misuse of personal data.

    Flashpark simply process photos taken by "entrepreneurs" and other scum out for a quick buck. FP don't know if there is a contact in place as they pass the buck back to the "entrepreneurs".

    So there is a big hole in these self-ticketing operators business plan which you can exploit and make yourself £250 at the same time.


    Plenty of people here to help with the fun.
    Originally posted by IamEmanresu
    I'm sure someone else will be able to confirm, but I understood that the BPA at least have now outlawed the payment of 'commission' or similar with these self-ticketing operations.
    Last edited by Johno100; 10-07-2017 at 12:52 PM.
    • Loadsofchildren123
    • By Loadsofchildren123 10th Jul 17, 1:11 PM
    • 982 Posts
    • 1,695 Thanks
    Loadsofchildren123
    Sorry Quentin, I think you are rather missing the point. I am happy to admit that I was driving the car and that the car was parked where Flaskpark say it was.
    Originally posted by napoleon route
    I agree. Where you have a strong defence as driver there seems no point to me in trying to hide behind being the RK - often all you can do is "not admit" you were driving and flail around trying to show that others use your car and it can't be presumed to be you - just say you were driving and defend on that basis. There cannot be a valid claim as they don't own the land.
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 10th Jul 17, 1:30 PM
    • 1,364 Posts
    • 2,551 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    I'm sure someone else will be able to confirm, but I understood that the BPA at least have now outlawed the payment of 'commission' or similar with these self-ticketing operations.
    Why not search for it in their Code of Practice and their Code of Professional Conduct. Or was it perhaps a verbal warning given with the wink of an eye.

    The point being made was there are holes in the PPC business model that can be exploited - the main one being the way each party tries to hold another party liable by getting them to sign a form.

    The biggest culpit is of course the DVLA.
    Life's for living, get on with it rather than worrying about these. If they hassle, counter claim.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 10th Jul 17, 1:35 PM
    • 48,322 Posts
    • 61,785 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Absolutely agree, the way forward is a Trading Standards complaint, with evidence, and a complaint to the DVLA that Flashpark have obtained your data regarding parking on land where they are ticketing unlawfully, as the land is not owned by the hand that feeds them.

    And a LBC that means business, claiming £250 a pop (per PCN) for each time Flashpark obtained and processed your data without reasonable cause. You'll need to double check the legal name for 'Flashpark' for your court claim, so you don't fall at the first hurdle of naming the defendant company correctly.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

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