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  • FIRST POST
    • Takedap
    • By Takedap 7th Jul 17, 10:58 AM
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    Takedap
    Android help please.
    • #1
    • 7th Jul 17, 10:58 AM
    Android help please. 7th Jul 17 at 10:58 AM
    Hi. I'm running a cheap chinese tablet (Kocaso M776) with ver 4.1.2 on it. It's got 1GB RAM & 2GB of "internal memory" & a slot with a 32GB micro SD card. I keep getting a message for running out of storage space so I want to delete as much bloatware as I can.

    I've rooted the tablet using Kingo & installed System App Remover from Playstore.

    When I look at the apps, it's telling me that most are either "Key Module" or are marked as "Should Keep"

    I need to know what it is safe to remove. Surely things like Angry Birds, Fruit Ninja or the Amazon Kindle app can't be Key Modules??

    All I really want at the moment is basic internet & e-mail access & a SAT-Nav app in addition to the camera & phone stuff. Just one browser, No live wallpapers, Office Suite or Skype or Twitter. Then I can decide what I want to put on it.
    Thanks to anyone who can help.
Page 1
    • kwikbreaks
    • By kwikbreaks 7th Jul 17, 12:43 PM
    • 8,825 Posts
    • 4,412 Thanks
    kwikbreaks
    • #2
    • 7th Jul 17, 12:43 PM
    • #2
    • 7th Jul 17, 12:43 PM
    If you are using https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.jumobile.manager.systemapp then the menu (accessed from arrow at top of System app screen which mine starts up showing) lets you pick User app - anything on that menu should be safe although I'd advise keeping things such as Google Play Services and the Play Store which appear there for me. There is a backup option which you should maybe use before deleting.
    • Takedap
    • By Takedap 7th Jul 17, 1:53 PM
    • 50 Posts
    • 23 Thanks
    Takedap
    • #3
    • 7th Jul 17, 1:53 PM
    • #3
    • 7th Jul 17, 1:53 PM
    Thanks for the reply. I've looked at the User Apps & apart from a few Google apps (Google & Google+), it's mostly stuff that I've installed myself & want to keep. Am I really stuck with the pre-installed games & wallpapers etc which are in the System Apps list? Also, I don't use Skype or Twitter but these are listed as Key Modules.
    • Johnmcl7
    • By Johnmcl7 7th Jul 17, 1:53 PM
    • 2,306 Posts
    • 1,498 Thanks
    Johnmcl7
    • #4
    • 7th Jul 17, 1:53 PM
    • #4
    • 7th Jul 17, 1:53 PM
    Have you looked into swapping the memory so that the external SD card becomes the internal memory? It's a while since I looked into it but may be worth a look and see if that's any use to you as 2GB is a tiny amount of memory for running Android, I can't see you'll be able to free up much space.

    John
    • Takedap
    • By Takedap 7th Jul 17, 2:01 PM
    • 50 Posts
    • 23 Thanks
    Takedap
    • #5
    • 7th Jul 17, 2:01 PM
    • #5
    • 7th Jul 17, 2:01 PM
    Have you looked into swapping the memory so that the external SD card becomes the internal memory? It's a while since I looked into it but may be worth a look and see if that's any use to you as 2GB is a tiny amount of memory for running Android, I can't see you'll be able to free up much space.

    John
    Originally posted by Johnmcl7
    That sound like an ideal answer to my problems. Any idea where I can find an "Idiot's Guide" on how to do this?
    • esuhl
    • By esuhl 7th Jul 17, 3:04 PM
    • 7,434 Posts
    • 5,256 Thanks
    esuhl
    • #6
    • 7th Jul 17, 3:04 PM
    • #6
    • 7th Jul 17, 3:04 PM
    That sound like an ideal answer to my problems. Any idea where I can find an "Idiot's Guide" on how to do this?
    Originally posted by Takedap
    If you've rooted your phone already, have a look at Apps2SD.

    You can create a partition on your SD card which gets mounted as part of the main system storage. My phone only has 1GB system storage; not even enough to install the latest Google Apps! The only way to make the phone usable was to use Apps2SD.

    Free with ads: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=in.co.pricealert.apps2sd
    £2.89: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=in.co.pricealert.apps2sd.pro

    The user interface isn't immediately intuitive. Give us a shout if you have any questions. It's pretty straightforward once you know what the options do.
    • Takedap
    • By Takedap 7th Jul 17, 3:43 PM
    • 50 Posts
    • 23 Thanks
    Takedap
    • #7
    • 7th Jul 17, 3:43 PM
    • #7
    • 7th Jul 17, 3:43 PM
    If you've rooted your phone already, have a look at Apps2SD.

    You can create a partition on your SD card which gets mounted as part of the main system storage. My phone only has 1GB system storage; not even enough to install the latest Google Apps! The only way to make the phone usable was to use Apps2SD.

    Free with ads: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=in.co.pricealert.apps2sd
    £2.89: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=in.co.pricealert.apps2sd.pro

    The user interface isn't immediately intuitive. Give us a shout if you have any questions. It's pretty straightforward once you know what the options do.
    Originally posted by esuhl
    Thanks, going to look now. I see there's also some Youtube instructional vids. BTW, what size partition would you recommend for the 32GB card & what about a swapfile? (PS, please don't think from these questions that I know what I talking about!!)
    Last edited by Takedap; 07-07-2017 at 3:46 PM.
    • esuhl
    • By esuhl 7th Jul 17, 9:21 PM
    • 7,434 Posts
    • 5,256 Thanks
    esuhl
    • #8
    • 7th Jul 17, 9:21 PM
    • #8
    • 7th Jul 17, 9:21 PM
    Thanks, going to look now. I see there's also some Youtube instructional vids. BTW, what size partition would you recommend for the 32GB card & what about a swapfile? (PS, please don't think from these questions that I know what I talking about!!)
    Originally posted by Takedap
    Partition size is really up to you. I split my 32GB card into two 16GB partitions -- one for Apps2SD to mount as a system partition, the other for my own files/photos/music, etc.

    I wouldn't worry about the swapfile. Whatever Android has set up is probably fine. You're not changing anything other than adding a new partition, and letting Apps2SD take care of it.

    N.B. When you repartition the SD card (via Apps2SD), everything already on the card will be erased, so make sure it's backed up first!

    N.B.2 Android cannot mount partitions on the SD card until after the OS has loaded. This means that you won't see any shortcuts to apps unless you do a soft reboot. (You can get Apps2SD to do this automatically for you.) If you don't reboot, you can still access apps via the App Manager.
    Last edited by esuhl; 07-07-2017 at 9:25 PM.
    • Robisere
    • By Robisere 8th Jul 17, 6:06 PM
    • 1,633 Posts
    • 2,421 Thanks
    Robisere
    • #9
    • 8th Jul 17, 6:06 PM
    • #9
    • 8th Jul 17, 6:06 PM
    Don't know if this might help, but this software can burn SD & Micro SD to a PC for backup purposes. I use it to make backups of my tablet, you will need an SD card reader:
    https://etcher.io/
    There may be more than one way to skin a cat.
    But the result is always inedible.

    • Takedap
    • By Takedap 12th Jul 17, 2:25 PM
    • 50 Posts
    • 23 Thanks
    Takedap
    If you've rooted your phone already, have a look at Apps2SD.

    Free with ads: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=in.co.pricealert.apps2sd
    £2.89: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=in.co.pricealert.apps2sd.pro

    The user interface isn't immediately intuitive. Give us a shout if you have any questions. It's pretty straightforward once you know what the options do.
    Originally posted by esuhl
    OK, I've got the Apps2SD & split the SD into 2 x 16 GB partitions (one Fat32 & the other ext4). When I've tried moving (linking?) apps to the card, it seems like only a small amount of space is freed up & I'm still getting the "Running out of storage" message. Can apps be directly installed to the card rather than moved? If necessary, I don't mind doing a factory reset on the tablet & repartitioning the card to give me a "clean start". That way, could I then reinstall my apps straight to the card? Would this help?
    • esuhl
    • By esuhl 12th Jul 17, 4:38 PM
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    esuhl
    OK, I've got the Apps2SD & split the SD into 2 x 16 GB partitions (one Fat32 & the other ext4).
    Originally posted by Takedap
    Sounds good.

    When I've tried moving (linking?) apps to the card, it seems like only a small amount of space is freed up & I'm still getting the "Running out of storage" message.
    Originally posted by Takedap
    Strange. Apps2SD first moves the installation files to the extra partition, and then creates links to them on the original partition. The storage space required by links is tiny, so you shouldn't get a "running out of space" message... :-/

    Can apps be directly installed to the card rather than moved? If necessary, I don't mind doing a factory reset on the tablet & repartitioning the card to give me a "clean start". That way, could I then reinstall my apps straight to the card? Would this help?
    Originally posted by Takedap
    Unfortunately, that's not possible.

    When linking apps, you can select which data to move to the extra partition. The default option only moves some data, so maybe you need to move/link the apps again, making sure you've ticked all the boxes (or hit "select all") to make sure everything is moved to the SD card.

    Behind the "success" pop-up message in the image below is the screen where you can "select all" data to move, for each app:



    Also, don't try to remove important system apps -- anything that's part of the Android system, or vital apps like the phone dialler.

    If apps don't fully move, you might well need to tick the last box to "disable app before linking/unlinking".

    Hope that helps...
    • Takedap
    • By Takedap 12th Jul 17, 5:08 PM
    • 50 Posts
    • 23 Thanks
    Takedap
    Thanks again for this. More questions though! Should I be able to see the new partition in the Settings/Device/Storage part of the system? The only difference I can see is that my SD card is now showing as being 15.7GB instead if the (nearly) 32GB that it was before.
    Also, I've been linking tha apps using the "Select All" method. If I try to use the "Disable App" function, the app just seems to disappear!
    I had to uninstall some of my user apps to get enough space to install Apps2SD but after moving some stuff, there still wasn't enough room to put my apps back on.
    With regards to your advice not to move important system apps, it seem like almost everything is considered to be a system app! That was part of my initial moan...
    Last edited by Takedap; 12-07-2017 at 5:18 PM.
    • esuhl
    • By esuhl 13th Jul 17, 12:30 AM
    • 7,434 Posts
    • 5,256 Thanks
    esuhl
    Thanks again for this. More questions though!
    Originally posted by Takedap
    No worries -- keep 'em coming!

    Should I be able to see the new partition in the Settings/Device/Storage part of the system? The only difference I can see is that my SD card is now showing as being 15.7GB instead if the (nearly) 32GB that it was before.
    Originally posted by Takedap
    No -- Apps2SD mounts the partition as a directory (sub-folder), so you won't see the partition in the root view of a file explorer. This is just how Linux-based OSes work.

    If you go in to Apps2SD, choose "Link apps to SD card", then the three vertical dots at the top right, then "Storage info", you should be able to see the directories and partitions that are in use.

    Also, I've been linking tha apps using the "Select All" method. If I try to use the "Disable App" function, the app just seems to disappear!
    Originally posted by Takedap
    Yes -- I think that's the only way it works. You need to have that box ticked to disable the app so it can be unloaded from memory and moved. The app is still available in the "app list"; it just deletes the shortcut on your home screen, and you have to manually add it back. :-/

    I wonder if this is why you're not seeing the extra space. Maybe files in use haven't been moved from the original location? I'd try moving them back, and then moving them to the extra partition with the "disable app" box ticked.

    With regards to your advice not to move important system apps, it seem like almost everything is considered to be a system app! That was part of my initial moan...
    Originally posted by Takedap
    Ah; I think you misunderstand. Don't move important system apps! Stuff that sounds like your device might stop working if you move it!

    Or disable them permanently, then move them. Instead of clicking the "Link/Unlink" button, click the three vertical dots and choose "Disable".

    I haven't used it, but in the same menu there's a "Convert to user app" option. I presume this makes it possible to uninstall a system app if you're SURE you don't need it. Be careful, though!

    I've disabled Browser, Calendar, Email, Exchange Services, Google Calendar Sync, Google Text-to-speech engine, Live lock screen service, Music, Photo Screensavers, PhotoPhase, Theme Chooser, Theme Manager Service, Themes Provider, Wallpaper Picker, Weather Provider, and Weather service.

    (Browser, Email, Music and the Weather Provider and service apps aren't needed at all if you use your own browser, media player and weather service.)

    If you're not sure just have a quick google to see what the system app does and whether or not you're likely to need it. Again, be careful -- if you disable something the tablet needs to function, you'll have to reinstall the operating system!
    • Takedap
    • By Takedap 13th Jul 17, 9:59 AM
    • 50 Posts
    • 23 Thanks
    Takedap
    [QUOTE=esuhl;72830533]No worries -- keep 'em coming!

    OK. Hope you don't regret that because I've got more woes! Now got a new problem. When starting Apps2SD, I'm getting an error screen asking me if I want to continue.

    The details are "2nd partition was not mounted some apps might not be detected. A soft reboot is required to mount. You can fix this issue by recreating mount script with Use normal method mount method. No/Yes"

    If I press Yes, the tablet reboots but then gives the error message "Unfortunately, com.google.apps.maps has stopped" I press OK but it just goes into a loop with the message coming back after a few seconds.

    I can power down & restart & then when the "2nd partition etc" message come up, I press No & the tablet boots up as normal (but, I'm assuming without mounting the partition)

    I've tried restoring Maps back to it's original location but it fails.

    When I access the storage info tag, it tells me that there has used 438MB so something has either been moved or created but my Internal storage show only8% free (Total 1011.2MB, Used 920.9MB, Free 90M.3MB) & my system storage say 0% Free (Total 758.6MB, Used 753.4MB, Free 5.2MB)

    There's also a Phone storage (which I assume is the "internal SD card") This is 89% Free (Total 1.2 GB, used 131.7 MB, Free 1.1 GB)

    And then there's the "proper" SD card with the 2 partitions. The FAT32 partition is 99% free & the ext4 partition is 92% free.

    Hope this info helps.
    • esuhl
    • By esuhl 13th Jul 17, 7:45 PM
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    • 5,256 Thanks
    esuhl
    EDIT: Maybe read the post below first!

    OK. Hope you don't regret that because I've got more woes!
    Originally posted by Takedap
    Not at all -- I could have done with some help when I was using it for the first time!

    Now got a new problem. When starting Apps2SD, I'm getting an error screen asking me if I want to continue.

    The details are "2nd partition was not mounted some apps might not be detected. A soft reboot is required to mount. You can fix this issue by recreating mount script with Use normal method mount method. No/Yes"
    Originally posted by Takedap
    That's not an error. Android doesn't mount extra partitions until after it's booted. The only way to run apps on the 2nd partition is to do a "soft reboot" after the device boots.

    Actually, it looks like there are three methods to create a script to mount the 2nd partition. The "normal method" doesn't require anything extra to work, so that's what I use. If you have init.d or su.d support (because you installed some geeky Linux tools of some kind), there are other ways to create the startup script. I don't know if these remove the requirement to soft-boot.

    I'd avoid creating the mount script to get the phone to soft reboot automatically until you've got everything working. That way you can choose whether to mount the 2nd partition (in case something goes wrong, like with Google Maps).

    If I press Yes, the tablet reboots but then gives the error message "Unfortunately, com.google.apps.maps has stopped" I press OK but it just goes into a loop with the message coming back after a few seconds.

    I can power down & restart & then when the "2nd partition etc" message come up, I press No & the tablet boots up as normal (but, I'm assuming without mounting the partition)

    I've tried restoring Maps back to it's original location but it fails.
    Originally posted by Takedap
    Uh-oh. That doesn't sound good.

    I didn't move any Google apps to the SD card, just in case (although I did disable some). Google Maps provides location services for other apps. I wonder if the location service is being loaded early on in the boot process...?

    Is the phone usable at all with the 2nd partition mounted? If so, I'd try to boot the phone, soft reboot to mount the 2nd partition, then disable location access:
    https://support.google.com/android/answer/2819558?hl=en

    Then try another hard, then soft reboot to see if you still get the error message. Either way, I'd then try unlinking Google Maps from the SD card via Apps2SD again (with the 2nd partition mounted).

    If you get error messages, preventing files from being moved, maybe try just ticking one box at a time on the "link/unlink" screen to see if you can move the file types back individually.

    If you get really stuck, it *might* be possible to use the Terminal Emulator to manually move the files back and delete the links.

    Actually... if you get stuck, email the developer. She was brief, but helpful when I contacted her.

    When I access the storage info tag, it tells me that there has used 438MB so something has either been moved or created but my Internal storage show only8% free (Total 1011.2MB, Used 920.9MB, Free 90M.3MB) & my system storage say 0% Free (Total 758.6MB, Used 753.4MB, Free 5.2MB)

    There's also a Phone storage (which I assume is the "internal SD card") This is 89% Free (Total 1.2 GB, used 131.7 MB, Free 1.1 GB)

    And then there's the "proper" SD card with the 2 partitions. The FAT32 partition is 99% free & the ext4 partition is 92% free.

    Hope this info helps.
    Originally posted by Takedap
    To be honest, I find the way that Android installs files rather complicated/confusing -- I think this is due to the way that Android runs applications in protected sandboxes for security. Anyway, it's quite different to GNU/Linux systems.

    I'm not sure I'll be able to make much sense of your storage figures, I'm afraid. But when I used Apps2SD, it did always reduce the usage of the built-in system partition.

    I presume you're following any on-screen messages -- like the one that says that you MUST have "USB debugging" enabled...?
    Last edited by esuhl; 13-07-2017 at 8:02 PM.
    • esuhl
    • By esuhl 13th Jul 17, 8:03 PM
    • 7,434 Posts
    • 5,256 Thanks
    esuhl
    I just checked out the FAQs on the Apps2SD site. Here are a few relevant tips:

    Linked apps are suddenly crashing
    Use the Partition Tool to repair the SD card 2nd partition
    Use "Fix permission on 2nd partition" option available in "Link apps to SD card" left navigation drawer
    Apps start to crash after linking
    Unlink/Don't link lib folder of apps
    While installing/updating apps I'm getting 'insufficient storage available' or other errors
    Follow below steps to fix this:
    1) Change the app install location to Internal/Phone storage
    2) Clear Play Store data and cache
    3) Use the Broken app cleaner to delete left over files/folders
    4) Reboot
    And there are some random usage suggestions here:
    http://www.apps2sd.info/suggestions.html
    • Takedap
    • By Takedap 13th Jul 17, 8:19 PM
    • 50 Posts
    • 23 Thanks
    Takedap

    I'm not sure I'll be able to make much sense of your storage figures, I'm afraid. But when I used Apps2SD, it did always reduce the usage of the built-in system partition.
    Originally posted by esuhl


    TBH, I only really quoted the figures so that you could see that the app was actually using (or at least attempting to use) the new partition.


    I presume you're following any on-screen messages -- like the one that says that you MUST have "USB debugging" enabled...?
    Originally posted by esuhl
    Yes, I've got that bit enabled (not that I know what it means but ...)

    I'll have a look at the suggestions in the new post & have a fiddle over the weekend. I'll let you know how it goes, one way or the other.

    I'm still being drawn to doing a factory restore & starting again. At least this would be the easiest time to do it as I've already backed up my stuff before wiping the card. And it would clear all the caches & other stored rubbish.

    Thanks again for taking the time to help.
    • esuhl
    • By esuhl 13th Jul 17, 11:09 PM
    • 7,434 Posts
    • 5,256 Thanks
    esuhl
    Yes, I've got that bit enabled (not that I know what it means but ...)
    Originally posted by Takedap
    Ha ha -- me neither. It's required for adb (the Android Device Bridge) which allows you to connect the device to a PC and run commands on the PC to control the phone, but... I have literally no idea why Apps2SD needs it. I assume it's pretty important, though. *shrug*

    I'll have a look at the suggestions in the new post & have a fiddle over the weekend. I'll let you know how it goes, one way or the other.
    Originally posted by Takedap
    No worries. Take your time. It took me a while (and a lot of reading) to get my head round how it all works. It's pretty straightforward once you know what options to use, and which boxes to tick. (And that you can ignore 95% of the options in the main menu!)

    If you can stick with it, I reckon you should be able to get Apps2SD to do exactly what you want. (The only downsides being the annoying soft-reboot and having to recreate home page icons.)

    I'm still being drawn to doing a factory restore & starting again. At least this would be the easiest time to do it as I've already backed up my stuff before wiping the card. And it would clear all the caches & other stored rubbish.
    Originally posted by Takedap
    That would be a GREAT idea. I ended up wiping my phone several times when I was trying to install a custom operating system and set up Apps2SD.

    If you can do a full reset and wipe everything, then you can try out all the "risky" things (like moving Google Maps), be slightly aggressive in what you move and disable, and if anything goes wrong you can just do another factory reset and start again.

    This is the best way to experiment and get your head round how things work and what it's "safe" to disable.

    Good luck! I think you're close to getting it all sorted.
    • Takedap
    • By Takedap 17th Jul 17, 8:28 PM
    • 50 Posts
    • 23 Thanks
    Takedap
    Just a quick thanks to everyone who has helped (especially esuhl for your time & patience) All the suggestions have helped in some way & I'm now in a much better state than when I started.
    I did the factory restore & then rooted the tablet again & loaded APS2SD. I found a site that recommended which bits of the system could safely be disabled or deleted & I went though them one by one.
    After confirming that everything was still working, I reloaded just the apps that I wanted & where necessary moved them to the new partition on the card (some of them actually gave the option of installing there when I reloaded them so that was a bonus.)
    Anyway, the end result is that I've got rid of loads of rubbish, installed what I needed & have finished up with more spare storage than I originally started with.
    Thanks again y'all....
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