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  • FIRST POST
    • andy green
    • By andy green 19th Jun 17, 8:08 PM
    • 6Posts
    • 1Thanks
    andy green
    QUick divorce
    • #1
    • 19th Jun 17, 8:08 PM
    QUick divorce 19th Jun 17 at 8:08 PM
    Hello everyone, I am trying to fill in a divorce petition and it makes me blame my wife , I have no choice other than a multiple choice of "she is an adulterer" or "has behaved in such a way that I cannot live with her". Now we have sort-of agreed to do it amicably but if I use any of the two choices she has seen it and has flipped. So can I say that "I have behaved in such a way" ? It seems I have to blame her somehow and she will not have it. She actually does not want a divorce so the situation is ultra delicate. Now I do not want a prolonged thing where we both start a mud fight, there is 22 years of marriage so there is a lot of mud. I would gladly fill in the paper saying "I am the adulterer" "I have behaved in such a way". But this is not an option. Even if it were an option, would it then ask me for details?
Page 1
    • richardw
    • By richardw 19th Jun 17, 8:29 PM
    • 17,884 Posts
    • 7,299 Thanks
    richardw
    • #2
    • 19th Jun 17, 8:29 PM
    • #2
    • 19th Jun 17, 8:29 PM
    Why do you want a quick divorce?
    Posts are not advice and must not be relied upon.
    • jackieblack
    • By jackieblack 19th Jun 17, 8:47 PM
    • 7,007 Posts
    • 9,086 Thanks
    jackieblack
    • #3
    • 19th Jun 17, 8:47 PM
    • #3
    • 19th Jun 17, 8:47 PM
    As you have discovered, if you are petitioning for the divorce, the reason would have to be her unreasonable behaviour or adultery, or desertion.

    If the reason was your adultery, she would need to petition for the divorce. If she's not in agreement that is probably unlikely to happen.

    The other choices are two years separation, but this requires her consent, otherwise five years separation, which is by no definition a quick divorce.

    For a speedy divorce you will need to agree on the reasons for the irretrievable breakdown of the marriage.
    If she doesn't want the divorce that will obviously make it harder but whatever you put down as your reasons, if she doesn't want the divorce she can, by not responding in a timely manner, drag it out considerably.

    In practical terms, if you want a 'quick' divorce, you're going to have to come to some agreement.
    Last edited by jackieblack; 19-06-2017 at 8:58 PM.
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    • andy green
    • By andy green 19th Jun 17, 9:46 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    andy green
    • #4
    • 19th Jun 17, 9:46 PM
    • #4
    • 19th Jun 17, 9:46 PM
    I am suffering from brain cancer, I do not think I have 2 or 5 years. Sorry for being so blunt. Can I just mention that in the form somehow? Eg "I have brain cancer, I have become irritable, we fight like cats and dogs" ?
    • jackieblack
    • By jackieblack 19th Jun 17, 10:04 PM
    • 7,007 Posts
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    jackieblack
    • #5
    • 19th Jun 17, 10:04 PM
    • #5
    • 19th Jun 17, 10:04 PM
    I am suffering from brain cancer, I do not think I have 2 or 5 years. Sorry for being so blunt. Can I just mention that in the form somehow? Eg "I have brain cancer, I have become irritable, we fight like cats and dogs" ?
    Originally posted by andy green
    Maybe worth a free half hour with a solicitor to see what your options are but basically whoever petitions for divorce, the other party is deemed to be at fault.

    Fighting could be an example of unreasonable behaviour, but if she doesn't agree she could still drag it out.

    Sorry about your diagnosis, but I don't know whether that would be of any relevance in terms of gaining a divorce.

    Do you really need any extra stress/hassle at this time?

    Could she argue that your judgement is impaired because of your diagnosis? (I'm not saying it is, just that it's possible she could try and use it to contest the divorce)

    If you are determined, I think you could benefit from some proper legal advice due to your circumstances.
    Last edited by jackieblack; 19-06-2017 at 10:11 PM.
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    • Jojo the Tightfisted
    • By Jojo the Tightfisted 19th Jun 17, 10:58 PM
    • 22,604 Posts
    • 86,557 Thanks
    Jojo the Tightfisted
    • #6
    • 19th Jun 17, 10:58 PM
    • #6
    • 19th Jun 17, 10:58 PM
    Why do you want to divorce her? If it's her not responding to your prognosis in a supportive way, then to hell with her opinion, do it on unreasonable behaviour. If your diagnosis has brought it home to you that you don't want to be married to her, then it doesn't matter what she thinks about it.

    After all, she's already gone ballistic, it's not as if you can fix things by being all fluffy about it.


    In the meantime, I'd suggest you make a new will and ensure somebody else is named as your next of kin. So you still need to see a solicitor, who could probably advise you on the divorce as well as this.
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    • richardw
    • By richardw 19th Jun 17, 11:00 PM
    • 17,884 Posts
    • 7,299 Thanks
    richardw
    • #7
    • 19th Jun 17, 11:00 PM
    • #7
    • 19th Jun 17, 11:00 PM
    Sorry about your diagnosis.
    Macmillan website may have suggestions for legal advice.
    Posts are not advice and must not be relied upon.
    • PeacefulWaters
    • By PeacefulWaters 19th Jun 17, 11:23 PM
    • 6,591 Posts
    • 8,097 Thanks
    PeacefulWaters
    • #8
    • 19th Jun 17, 11:23 PM
    • #8
    • 19th Jun 17, 11:23 PM
    I am suffering from brain cancer, I do not think I have 2 or 5 years. Sorry for being so blunt. Can I just mention that in the form somehow? Eg "I have brain cancer, I have become irritable, we fight like cats and dogs" ?
    Originally posted by andy green
    Would she lose anything if you divorce? Pension rights? Death in service benefits? Widows benefits?

    Research and consider before divorcing and dying. You might be better remaining married but moving out.
    • silvercar
    • By silvercar 20th Jun 17, 9:11 AM
    • 35,530 Posts
    • 149,832 Thanks
    silvercar
    • #9
    • 20th Jun 17, 9:11 AM
    • #9
    • 20th Jun 17, 9:11 AM
    Sorry to hear your diagnosis.

    Maybe marriage guidance counselling would be a good option.
    • TBagpuss
    • By TBagpuss 20th Jun 17, 10:50 AM
    • 5,661 Posts
    • 7,415 Thanks
    TBagpuss
    Unfortunately ou are falling foul of our outdated divorce laws.

    You can't divorce her based on your behaviour. She could divorce you on that basis, and you could (if you wish) offer to contribute to her costs to do so.
    You can start a divorce based on your own adultery, either.

    If you prepare a petition based on her 'unreasonable behaviour' then the details you give don't need to be about inherently bad behaviour and can be quite vague. They can also be subjective.
    so something like (depending on the situation)
    "I felt that the Respondent was unsupportive of me following my diagnosis. This made me feel rejected" or "I felt that the Repondent was more interested in spending time with her friends than with me. This made me feel unloved and isolated"
    You don't need any more than that. You can add 'I reserve the right to provide more detailed particulars should it become necessary' if you want.

    It may help your wife if you speak to her to let her know that she does not have to agree that what you say in part 6 of the petition is accurate, all she has to do is say that she does not intend to defend the divorce.

    It is difficult, but unfortunately unless you are willing / able to wait until you have lived apart for 2 years then one of you has to blame the other. But not in much detaiL!
    • onomatopoeia99
    • By onomatopoeia99 20th Jun 17, 12:02 PM
    • 3,084 Posts
    • 6,851 Thanks
    onomatopoeia99
    There was an attempt made a few years ago to reform divorce law to allow one year, no fault divorces without consent. Ultimately, the religionists blocked it in parliament and it didn't get through. As TBagpuss says, our divorce laws are outdated, terribly so IMO.

    Make sure you make a will if you don't want intestacy rules to apply, and carry a next-of-kin card at all times if you don't want your wife to be the person the hospital talk to if you need treatment and are unable to nominate a NOK on admittance - the NOK of an adult has no legal status can't actually do anything, but they are the person the hospital informs about treatment.

    Legal processes can sometimes be made to move quickly when time is short, for example Steve Hewlett (late of Radio 4) went from proposing to married in about an hour, despite the legal requirement for some weeks of notice beforehand and so on.
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    • andy green
    • By andy green 20th Jun 17, 3:30 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    andy green
    OK thanks it seems my wife is very volatile and one day she says this and the next she says that. I cannot clearly depend on her to sign any documents put in front of her. And if God forbid, her family get involved, we should be preparing for WW3. Now I will see a solicitor and will definitely ask some questions.

    But I can also ask here. How do you sort out financials? For example pensions, insurances, accounts, deposits, property, cars even? I understand that obviously there must be some agreement from both parties as to who takes what, but how do you "draw a line" beyond which there can be no more claims, no "I have changed my mind" etc? I mean when are you really FREE?
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 20th Jun 17, 3:52 PM
    • 27,831 Posts
    • 70,725 Thanks
    Mojisola
    But I can also ask here. How do you sort out financials? For example pensions, insurances, accounts, deposits, property, cars even?
    Originally posted by andy green
    I'm sorry to suggest this but, if your wife blocks the divorce for long enough, she will have it all - she doesn't have much incentive to co-operate.

    Anything that's jointly owned will become hers.

    As the widow, she will get the benefits from pension schemes, insurances, etc.

    You could write a new will leaving anything you own as an individual to other people but she could contest that - she has a ready-made excuse in that she could claim your illness affected your judgment when you made the new will.
    • BrassicWoman
    • By BrassicWoman 20th Jun 17, 5:03 PM
    • 1,166 Posts
    • 4,940 Thanks
    BrassicWoman
    Ah, so it's you have broken you marriage vows...

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5667329

    Afraid you will have to wait. Generally best to properly end one relationship before starting another unless you have an open relationship; I can see why your wife would resist giving you an easy out.
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    • Fireflyaway
    • By Fireflyaway 20th Jun 17, 5:43 PM
    • 1,037 Posts
    • 1,040 Thanks
    Fireflyaway
    You seem concerned about hurting her feelings. Do you still love her? Seems sad to get divorced after 22 years. Your diagnosis probably has changed the way you behave together, its bound to be pretty stressful but is there not an alternative? What is your motive?
    • jackieblack
    • By jackieblack 20th Jun 17, 8:30 PM
    • 7,007 Posts
    • 9,086 Thanks
    jackieblack
    But I can also ask here. How do you sort out financials? For example pensions, insurances, accounts, deposits, property, cars even? I understand that obviously there must be some agreement from both parties as to who takes what, but how do you "draw a line" beyond which there can be no more claims, no "I have changed my mind" etc? I mean when are you really FREE?
    Originally posted by andy green
    You can submit a Consent Order detaling the financial agreement to the court once you have your Decree Nisi. The judge needs to be satisfied that the CO is 'fair' to both parties, (although there is quite alot of flexibility as to what might constitute 'fair'). Once the CO is approved it becomes binding as soon as the Decree Absolute is issued.

    https://www.gov.uk/money-property-when-relationship-ends/apply-for-consent-order
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    • Ozzuk
    • By Ozzuk 21st Jun 17, 11:31 AM
    • 1,054 Posts
    • 1,592 Thanks
    Ozzuk
    You can't have your cake and eat it, if you've met someone else and your wife doesn't want to divorce then you are likely stuck for a number of years. Not surprising she's volatile if she is aware of your actions.

    Given your diagnosis, are perhaps her concerns centered around financial security - after all she has invested 22 years with you so might not want to see someone new get what she perceives as her entitlement. Maybe a better approach would be to work on the financial split, weighing it heavily in her favour (house, savings, pension, life insurance etc) and then she might be willing to agree to the divorce.

    Otherwise it just sounds like (from what you've written) you're done with her and just considering the new partner and your life.
    • leespot
    • By leespot 21st Jun 17, 1:11 PM
    • 542 Posts
    • 433 Thanks
    leespot
    You want to divorce your wife, to marry your new partner, you then plan to bring a child into the world when, quite honestly, you won't be around to be a father to it, and from what you say you have a family already - and you're still surprised your wife is "having none of it"? Bonkers, must be a wind up surely.
    • TBagpuss
    • By TBagpuss 22nd Jun 17, 1:36 PM
    • 5,661 Posts
    • 7,415 Thanks
    TBagpuss
    OK thanks it seems my wife is very volatile and one day she says this and the next she says that. I cannot clearly depend on her to sign any documents put in front of her. And if God forbid, her family get involved, we should be preparing for WW3. Now I will see a solicitor and will definitely ask some questions.

    But I can also ask here. How do you sort out financials? For example pensions, insurances, accounts, deposits, property, cars even? I understand that obviously there must be some agreement from both parties as to who takes what, but how do you "draw a line" beyond which there can be no more claims, no "I have changed my mind" etc? I mean when are you really FREE?
    Originally posted by andy green
    Speak to your solicitor. However, your best bet to move things on is likely to be to start proceedings based on her 'unreasonable behaviour' as I suggested above. If she choses not to sign the acknowledgment than you can arrange for her to be personally serviced with the papers and go from there. But i would suggest that you consider giving her to option to divorce you, first.

    Meanwhile, see a solicitor and make an up to date will. Make sure that the solicitor knows that you are married and seeking to divorce, and that you have a brain tumour. That way, they can advise you about what steps to take to reduce the risk of your will being sucessfully challenged (for instance, it may be appropriate to get your doctor to provide a certificate that you are mentally competent!)

    Consider also having Powers of Attorney prepared, particularly if you would want your current partner, or other family members, rather than your wife, to be able to manage your affairs for you if you become unable to do so.

    In relation to finances, if you can agree then you agree, and have the agreement drawn up as a consent order and approved by the court. Once the order is made by the court it can only be changed in very specific and unusual circumstances - for instance if it comes to light that one of you lied about your financial position, or where there is a fundamental change which could not have been reasonably foreseen (a 'bardour event') As the early death of one ex spouse can be a Bardour event (it was in the Badour case) it would be sensible to ensure that your solicitor is aware of your health and prognosis so that your ex can't argue that it was unforeseeable if you were to die shortly after the order being made.

    If you can't reach agreement then there would be a process of negotiation, mediation and then court proceedings. This can be fairly time consuming so probably start sooner rather than later.

    Meanwhile, consider whether you have pensions or other assets where you want to make changes to your preferred beneficiary.
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