Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • bobbymotors
    • By bobbymotors 19th Jun 17, 4:54 PM
    • 524Posts
    • 727Thanks
    bobbymotors
    Retirement developments...catch?
    • #1
    • 19th Jun 17, 4:54 PM
    Retirement developments...catch? 19th Jun 17 at 4:54 PM
    Can anyone enlighten me as to the various catches (if any) with these places as they are 60+ only and you appear to be able to get a better place for your money?
Page 1
    • Guest101
    • By Guest101 19th Jun 17, 4:57 PM
    • 15,128 Posts
    • 14,763 Thanks
    Guest101
    • #2
    • 19th Jun 17, 4:57 PM
    • #2
    • 19th Jun 17, 4:57 PM
    Can anyone enlighten me as to the various catches (if any) with these places as they are 60+ only and you appear to be able to get a better place for your money?
    Originally posted by bobbymotors


    To buy or to rent?


    Presumably to buy? You should read the lease carefully. Otherwise I would say they are simply harder to sell due to limitations of buyers.
    • aneary
    • By aneary 19th Jun 17, 4:59 PM
    • 730 Posts
    • 612 Thanks
    aneary
    • #3
    • 19th Jun 17, 4:59 PM
    • #3
    • 19th Jun 17, 4:59 PM
    The service charge tends to be a lot higher as they have wardens etc.
    • bobbymotors
    • By bobbymotors 19th Jun 17, 5:00 PM
    • 524 Posts
    • 727 Thanks
    bobbymotors
    • #4
    • 19th Jun 17, 5:00 PM
    • #4
    • 19th Jun 17, 5:00 PM
    To buy or to rent?


    Presumably to buy? You should read the lease carefully. Otherwise I would say they are simply harder to sell due to limitations of buyers.
    Originally posted by Guest101
    yes, to buy.
    And when you die can you pass the lease on?
    • theartfullodger
    • By theartfullodger 19th Jun 17, 5:02 PM
    • 9,045 Posts
    • 11,965 Thanks
    theartfullodger
    • #5
    • 19th Jun 17, 5:02 PM
    • #5
    • 19th Jun 17, 5:02 PM
    Indeed, as guest says: And service charges

    This may help
    https://www.ageuk.org.uk/Documents/EN-GB/Factsheets/FS2_Buying_Retirement_Housing_fcs.pdf
    - and this
    http://www.housingcare.org/elderly-uk-sheltered-housing.aspx
    Last edited by theartfullodger; 19-06-2017 at 5:06 PM.
    • kingstreet
    • By kingstreet 19th Jun 17, 5:02 PM
    • 32,212 Posts
    • 17,252 Thanks
    kingstreet
    • #6
    • 19th Jun 17, 5:02 PM
    • #6
    • 19th Jun 17, 5:02 PM
    Restricted sales market = unmortgageable.
    I am a mortgage broker. You should note that this site doesn't check my status as a Mortgage Adviser, so you need to take my word for it. This signature is here as I follow MSE's Mortgage Adviser Code of Conduct. Any posts on here are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as financial advice. Please do not send PMs asking for one-to-one-advice, or representation.
    • Guest101
    • By Guest101 19th Jun 17, 5:02 PM
    • 15,128 Posts
    • 14,763 Thanks
    Guest101
    • #7
    • 19th Jun 17, 5:02 PM
    • #7
    • 19th Jun 17, 5:02 PM
    yes, to buy.
    And when you die can you pass the lease on?
    Originally posted by bobbymotors


    It's not a catch all situation. Which is why it's vital to read the lease carefully.


    Sometiems yes, sometimes no.
    • Tiners
    • By Tiners 19th Jun 17, 6:26 PM
    • 223 Posts
    • 221 Thanks
    Tiners
    • #8
    • 19th Jun 17, 6:26 PM
    • #8
    • 19th Jun 17, 6:26 PM
    High service charges

    High ground rent

    Substantial depreciation especially when bought from new.

    Onerous and expensive catches in the lease (management co charging for a 'sales pack' when you come to sell and taking a percentage of the value when you do eventually manage to sell are just 2 examples).

    Intransigent/incompetent management companies... they will make it as difficult as possible for you to sell on, in an ideal world they would like a block full of empty, unoccupied retirement apartments, as someone will still be having to pay the ground rent, leasehold charges and management fees even if the occupant has moved out or died.
    • eddddy
    • By eddddy 19th Jun 17, 7:26 PM
    • 5,416 Posts
    • 5,081 Thanks
    eddddy
    • #9
    • 19th Jun 17, 7:26 PM
    • #9
    • 19th Jun 17, 7:26 PM
    Retirement properties are often higher density - which makes them cheaper to build in the first place.

    Properties are not mortgageable, but typically owners are in their 70s or 80s - so couldn't get mortgages anyway.

    (Often, the owners are widows/widowers downsizing from 'empty-nest' homes, with paid off mortgages.)


    Service charges are high, probably because...

    - They often have a warden
    - They often have communal areas (e.g. a lounge)
    - If they are flats, they will have lifts
    - Often the lease makes the freeholder (mgmnt co) responsible for...
    .. - Plumbing/bathroom fittings/ kitchen fittings in the flat
    .. - Heating in the flat
    .. - Electrics in the flat

    (e.g. If the heating breaks down or needs replacing, it's the freeholder's responsibility.)

    Look out for 'deferred service charges' which are payable when the property is sold.

    In London, they seem to increase in value at the same pace as other properties - don't know about elsewhere.
    • theartfullodger
    • By theartfullodger 19th Jun 17, 7:30 PM
    • 9,045 Posts
    • 11,965 Thanks
    theartfullodger
    Mortgages are available to those in late 60s, early 70s
    • kingstreet
    • By kingstreet 20th Jun 17, 5:58 AM
    • 32,212 Posts
    • 17,252 Thanks
    kingstreet
    Mortgages are available to those in late 60s, early 70s
    Originally posted by theartfullodger
    Yes and also include lifetime products and equity release.
    I am a mortgage broker. You should note that this site doesn't check my status as a Mortgage Adviser, so you need to take my word for it. This signature is here as I follow MSE's Mortgage Adviser Code of Conduct. Any posts on here are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as financial advice. Please do not send PMs asking for one-to-one-advice, or representation.
    • Davesnave
    • By Davesnave 20th Jun 17, 7:42 AM
    • 23,547 Posts
    • 89,393 Thanks
    Davesnave
    ......And they are full of "old" people!
    'A society grows great when old men plant trees whose shade they'll never sit in.'
    • moneyistooshorttomention
    • By moneyistooshorttomention 20th Jun 17, 11:02 AM
    • 13,933 Posts
    • 37,875 Thanks
    moneyistooshorttomention
    ......And they are full of "old" people!
    Originally posted by Davesnave
    Now would that be our generation Dave - ie "babyboomers ain't never gonna grow old" and we might be expecting top-volume Rolling Stones/headbanger music or "the elderly" do you think?

    Which raises another question - as to whether these properties could be treated like a normal house to live in all respects (eg our agegroup - still expecting to do whatever work we decide to on our houses up to and including gutting them if we decide to)? or whether one would be expected to live in them in an "elderly" way iyswim?
    #MeToo

    Why should our needs override the needs of all other living species? What makes us so special? (Brigit Strawbridge)
    • teddysmum
    • By teddysmum 20th Jun 17, 11:29 AM
    • 8,514 Posts
    • 5,043 Thanks
    teddysmum
    When in our 50s my husband and I stayed at a UK holiday village,out of season and found the whole place taken over by a large number of coach parties , which catered for the elderly.


    As a result ,we avoided the evening entertainment venue as it was just aimed at what these people 'wanted' eg Vera Lynn and wartime songs. I still remember asking my husband if, when we were older it would suddenly like this kind of entertainment is that old people do. ...It hasn't happened yet (late 60s).


    I would hate the momento mori atmosphere of seeing old people every day and noticing how they disappeared. It's bad enough seeing neighbours and well known media personalities whom you remember in their youth.
    • Davesnave
    • By Davesnave 20th Jun 17, 12:15 PM
    • 23,547 Posts
    • 89,393 Thanks
    Davesnave
    Now would that be our generation Dave - ie "babyboomers ain't never gonna grow old" and we might be expecting top-volume Rolling Stones/headbanger music or "the elderly" do you think?
    Originally posted by moneyistooshorttomention
    I wasn't really aiming the comment at a particular generation, although it's often the case that people who were teenagers in the 50s have remained a very different breed from those who followed a decade later.

    Assuming no debilitating illnesses, I meant that those who see themselves as ready for a typical retirement flat are old in outlook, regardless of their chronological age.
    'A society grows great when old men plant trees whose shade they'll never sit in.'
    • Tea Pea Dee
    • By Tea Pea Dee 20th Jun 17, 2:41 PM
    • 3,814 Posts
    • 636,338 Thanks
    Tea Pea Dee
    In an AA type of voice, my name is Tea Pea Dee and I live in a retirement village. Mixture of bungalows and flats. All leasehold, so no, you cannot gut them, but you can tart them up. Service charges high, but ground rent low. Service charges are always going to be higher in these type of homes because of the services of the Scheme Manager (Warden is a complete no-no in the vocabulary nowadays).

    It is almost "morgue-like" quiet, something which I love. Security and peace of mind is way above average. Dave, I am 60, and courtesy of the NHS (simple op. went badly wrong) I live here, but would bet I, and a few of the other old wrinklies, have a younger mindset than your goodself

    All in all, I love it here. Would I recommend one? The jury is still out on that one


    Respect for ourselves guides our morals, respect for others guides our manners~Laurence Sterne
    All animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others~George Orwell
    • bouicca21
    • By bouicca21 20th Jun 17, 5:15 PM
    • 3,237 Posts
    • 4,012 Thanks
    bouicca21
    Some are difficult to sell. Some have people queuing up to get one. If you end up with a difficult to sell one your heirs are going to have to pay out that service charge while the place is empty. Iive know some stay empty for over a year. Also if you rent the place out the contract might require a substantial fee to be paid to the management company.

    OTH there is a built in social group - if you like being with the wrinklies. Personally I'm still at the stage of denying wrinklihood.
    • daveyjp
    • By daveyjp 20th Jun 17, 5:28 PM
    • 7,149 Posts
    • 5,553 Thanks
    daveyjp
    No different to any leasehold property purchase, know what you are getting in to.

    They tend not to have an annual sinking fund, preferring instead to take a proportion of the property value when sold. They know most of the residents won't be there long so it's regular income!
    • Madmel
    • By Madmel 20th Jun 17, 5:57 PM
    • 624 Posts
    • 1,209 Thanks
    Madmel
    As others have said, the charges are high and they take a % when you sell them on. As well as the lift, resident warden and communal lounge, there was also a laundry with 4 Miele washing machines and dryers. We owned one for 11 years which mother-in-law lived in and for us and her it was ideal. She was 75 when she moved in, relocating from another part of the country. Although it was a new development, she soon made friends due to the numerous social events (coffee mornings, tai chi, art classes, bingo, whist etc.)

    If the weather was foul, she didn't have to go outside, but could toddle down to the lounge and always find some company. We felt that she was less dependent on us than she might have been without all the company and various local services and it was definitely worth the peace of mind.
    • POPPYOSCAR
    • By POPPYOSCAR 20th Jun 17, 6:05 PM
    • 10,816 Posts
    • 22,515 Thanks
    POPPYOSCAR
    They can take a long time to sell.

    In the meantime service charges, council tax etc. still has to be paid.
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

153Posts Today

1,696Users online

Martin's Twitter