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  • FIRST POST
    • aroominyork
    • By aroominyork 18th Jun 17, 11:57 AM
    • 185Posts
    • 29Thanks
    aroominyork
    SIPP nominee if no surviving spouse
    • #1
    • 18th Jun 17, 11:57 AM
    SIPP nominee if no surviving spouse 18th Jun 17 at 11:57 AM
    A SIPP nominee form only allows me to name one person, or a number of people to receive stated % shares of my SIPP. It does not, as happens with a will, let me say what happens if my nominee is no longer alive.

    Am I right is understanding that if either my wife or I die, our SIPP nominee would be the surviving one of us whether or not we have completed an expression of wish form? If that is the case, am I right in thinking we do not need to complete the form?

    Our concern is about what happens if we die at the same time, for example in a car accident, or we die in rapid succession without having changed our nominee between our deaths. In that case, we would want our SIPP nominees to be our children (who are not dependent on us and were born before 1993). So how do we arrange for our first nominee to be the surviving spouse, and if there is no surviving spouse for our nominees to be our children?
Page 1
    • xylophone
    • By xylophone 18th Jun 17, 12:46 PM
    • 22,881 Posts
    • 13,243 Thanks
    xylophone
    • #2
    • 18th Jun 17, 12:46 PM
    • #2
    • 18th Jun 17, 12:46 PM
    http://www.alliancetrustsavings.co.uk/forms-documents/general-forms/SIPP-expression-of-wish.pdf

    These notes are designed to help you to complete the expression of wishes form.
    Please consider carefully how you complete the form. We are not obliged to follow your wishes and we have to exercise our discretion as to how
    we distribute benefits on your death.
    That is why they are not included in your estate for inheritance tax (IHT) purposes. You do not have to
    indicate the percentages, you can if you wish do so, or you can leave them blank and leave it to our discretion as to the amounts.
    Generally, we can pay lump sums to anyone. We can pay income benefits to your dependents or only to other individuals if they have been
    nominated by you. After your death we can also make nominations on your behalf but only in very limited circumstances. We would suggest
    therefore that you include as wide a list of potential beneficiaries that you’d like us to consider.


    Presumably they'd work down the list....if the spouse were dead then move to the next beneficiary?

    Give your provider a ring and ask?

    re commorientes

    http://clarkekiernan.com/contentious-probate/simultaneous-deaths

    https://uk.practicallaw.thomsonreuters.com/2-383-4021?transitionType=Default&contextData=(sc.Defaul t)&firstPage=true&bhcp=1
  • jamesd
    • #3
    • 18th Jun 17, 2:26 PM
    • #3
    • 18th Jun 17, 2:26 PM
    You don't necessarily have to stick with their form. It's for their convenience and doesn't seem to meet your needs so send them a letter and the form telling them that the letter expresses your wishes.

    In the circumstances you have described the money at the first death would go to the surviving spouse or be split between them and the children, most to them. At their death it'd go to the children. Assuming that there are no former spouses or current financial dependents who could make a claim.

    If inheritance tax is a possible issue you could say that you want the spouse to get money up to the inheritance tax free limit and more if they request it, with the remainder split between the children. You can also have some of the money go to their children, if any, if you wish. Normally the parents would act as trustees for this money and can spend it for the benefit of the children, including on things like food, clothing and housing. This can be more tax efficient than potentially having taxable money paid to the parent and taxed at their tax rate. The money is taxable in that way if you die from age 75 onwards, before that it's tax free. They don't have to take this money in an immediate lump sum, it's likely to be better for them to take it as a beneficiary pension. At any age including the day of birth that money can be drawn as rapidly or slowly as desired to match need and tax efficiency.

    Survivorship clauses can be useful. One that nearly affected me was the averted death of a brother the day after the death of our mother. The survivorship clauses would have made her will binding on his former portion instead of his intestacy (which would have had the same effect as her will), or will (which would probably have been different).
    Last edited by jamesd; 18-06-2017 at 2:42 PM.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 18th Jun 17, 5:38 PM
    • 89,516 Posts
    • 54,967 Thanks
    dunstonh
    • #4
    • 18th Jun 17, 5:38 PM
    • #4
    • 18th Jun 17, 5:38 PM
    A SIPP nominee form only allows me to name one person, or a number of people to receive stated % shares of my SIPP. It does not, as happens with a will, let me say what happens if my nominee is no longer alive.
    There has been a trend in recent times for providers to request an explanation or fo you to describe your wishes in wordy form rather than give an absolute expression. Many will accept it in your own paper format.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. Different people have different needs and what is right for one person may not be for another. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from a Financial Adviser local to you.
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