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  • FIRST POST
    • abs1118
    • By abs1118 17th Jun 17, 8:49 AM
    • 1Posts
    • 0Thanks
    abs1118
    New roof deals
    • #1
    • 17th Jun 17, 8:49 AM
    New roof deals 17th Jun 17 at 8:49 AM
    Hi, I am an overseas landlord and my property needs a new roof as the wood under the slate is rotting. Does anyone have any good advice on getting a new roof done?! My insurance won't cover because it's just due to wear and tear.

    Thanks!!
Page 1
    • Annie1960
    • By Annie1960 18th Jun 17, 6:19 PM
    • 2,669 Posts
    • 1,491 Thanks
    Annie1960
    • #2
    • 18th Jun 17, 6:19 PM
    • #2
    • 18th Jun 17, 6:19 PM
    Insurance will never cover this type of work.

    Get three quotes from local roofers. Avoid the cheapest one. As you are overseas this may be more difficult, so can you get someone local to do this on your behalf? Do you have a family member or old neighbour you can trust?

    When you are choosing a contractor, check they have public liability insurance, and avoid anyone who asks for cash.

    Try firms that have some sort of regulation. There is not much meaningful regulation in the construction industry, but you could try any organisation that has an ADR in case something goes wrong. For example, the FMB, or Which? Trusted Traders.

    Forget TrustaTrader - they are a fake organisation working in the interests of people who advertise with them, not the consumer.
    • Furts
    • By Furts 18th Jun 17, 6:42 PM
    • 3,466 Posts
    • 2,168 Thanks
    Furts
    • #3
    • 18th Jun 17, 6:42 PM
    • #3
    • 18th Jun 17, 6:42 PM
    Insurance will never cover this type of work.

    Get three quotes from local roofers. Avoid the cheapest one. As you are overseas this may be more difficult, so can you get someone local to do this on your behalf? Do you have a family member or old neighbour you can trust?

    When you are choosing a contractor, check they have public liability insurance, and avoid anyone who asks for cash.

    Try firms that have some sort of regulation. There is not much meaningful regulation in the construction industry, but you could try any organisation that has an ADR in case something goes wrong. For example, the FMB, or Which? Trusted Traders.

    Forget TrustaTrader - they are a fake organisation working in the interests of people who advertise with them, not the consumer.
    Originally posted by Annie1960
    Stop and think very carefully before following this post. I built a large new home for my family. I accepted the cheapest quote for the brickwork, This was only around 40% of the next highest quote. The work was done and it was fine. I paid cash and this too was fine,

    I accepted the cheapest quote for the roofing. This was a similar fraction of the next highest quote. The work was done and it was to an exceptional standard. For this I also paid cash.

    The carpenter was the cheapest quote, as was the plumber and the electrician. All were fine.

    Unlike many consumers I drew up a Specification for the works, and informed every trade of my standards before they submitted a quote. All trades knew that I would be inspecting their work and none raised any concerns about this.
    • Annie1960
    • By Annie1960 18th Jun 17, 7:38 PM
    • 2,669 Posts
    • 1,491 Thanks
    Annie1960
    • #4
    • 18th Jun 17, 7:38 PM
    • #4
    • 18th Jun 17, 7:38 PM
    Hardly possible in this case as the OP is abroad.
    • Furts
    • By Furts 18th Jun 17, 8:06 PM
    • 3,466 Posts
    • 2,168 Thanks
    Furts
    • #5
    • 18th Jun 17, 8:06 PM
    • #5
    • 18th Jun 17, 8:06 PM
    Being abroad has nothing to do with writing a Specification. OP has access to the internet because a thread exists here. So away they go. They are too far away to meet contractors to obtain quotes but a simple answer exists. Either travel here to do so or arrange professional advise to act on their behalf. This is a reality of life when being a landlord.

    But there is a broader issue which you consistently, resolutely and stubbornly refuse to accept. Consumers think it is child's play to arrange building work. You consistently fail to say get real and seek professional advise. People should not be following your example and ignorance is not bliss. There are countless Chartered Building Surveyors and Clerks Of Works who could take on all the requirements for OP if OP is prepared to pay for this.

    The reality is very few consumers are prepared to seek professional advice and help. Then complaints and bitterness arise when things go wrong. Does this sound familiar?
    • Annie1960
    • By Annie1960 18th Jun 17, 10:35 PM
    • 2,669 Posts
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    Annie1960
    • #6
    • 18th Jun 17, 10:35 PM
    • #6
    • 18th Jun 17, 10:35 PM
    Being abroad has nothing to do with writing a Specification. OP has access to the internet because a thread exists here. So away they go. They are too far away to meet contractors to obtain quotes but a simple answer exists. Either travel here to do so or arrange professional advise to act on their behalf. This is a reality of life when being a landlord.

    But there is a broader issue which you consistently, resolutely and stubbornly refuse to accept. Consumers think it is child's play to arrange building work. You consistently fail to say get real and seek professional advise. People should not be following your example and ignorance is not bliss. There are countless Chartered Building Surveyors and Clerks Of Works who could take on all the requirements for OP if OP is prepared to pay for this.

    The reality is very few consumers are prepared to seek professional advice and help. Then complaints and bitterness arise when things go wrong. Does this sound familiar?
    Originally posted by Furts

    So let's apply your model to everything else.

    For example, let's immediately remove all regulations from food production. Next time you go to the supermarket, you will need to bring your testing kits to determine if the products you buy are safe and free from nasty bacteria. Alternatively, you can employ someone to do this for you.

    If you buy something with listeria, botulism, or some other nasty, then it's your fault if you get ill.
    • Doozergirl
    • By Doozergirl 18th Jun 17, 10:56 PM
    • 23,738 Posts
    • 66,064 Thanks
    Doozergirl
    • #7
    • 18th Jun 17, 10:56 PM
    • #7
    • 18th Jun 17, 10:56 PM
    You're better off lobbying the government than this board.
    Everything that is supposed to be in heaven is already here on earth.
    • ComicGeek
    • By ComicGeek 19th Jun 17, 9:06 AM
    • 183 Posts
    • 131 Thanks
    ComicGeek
    • #8
    • 19th Jun 17, 9:06 AM
    • #8
    • 19th Jun 17, 9:06 AM
    So let's apply your model to everything else.

    For example, let's immediately remove all regulations from food production. Next time you go to the supermarket, you will need to bring your testing kits to determine if the products you buy are safe and free from nasty bacteria. Alternatively, you can employ someone to do this for you.

    If you buy something with listeria, botulism, or some other nasty, then it's your fault if you get ill.
    Originally posted by Annie1960


    Who on earth said to remove regulations? The point is that there are regulations, British Standards, best practice guidance etc that already exist for the construction industry. The problem is that some consumers can't/won't be bothered to research something before spending thousands of pounds.

    Those that can be bothered to research will find a huge amount of info on t'internet that allows them to prepare specifications and contracts properly. Only those who don't have time, are too lazy or are doing something very unique/difficult need to appoint professionals to assist them.

    In your analogy it's the equivalent of having a slightly more expensive chicken on the shelf that has been checked and safe, and then a second cheaper chicken which hasn't and you take the risk of getting seriously ill - it's still the consumers choice! Although I would add that on some (most?) jobs us professionals can actually save clients money as well as doing it properly....
    • Annie1960
    • By Annie1960 19th Jun 17, 11:51 AM
    • 2,669 Posts
    • 1,491 Thanks
    Annie1960
    • #9
    • 19th Jun 17, 11:51 AM
    • #9
    • 19th Jun 17, 11:51 AM
    I hope this link is useful for the OP.

    https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/get-more-help/finding-a-trustworthy-trader/

    I can't see anything here about employing a Clerk of Works, but please correct me if I am wrong.
    • Annie1960
    • By Annie1960 19th Jun 17, 11:52 AM
    • 2,669 Posts
    • 1,491 Thanks
    Annie1960
    You're better off lobbying the government than this board.
    Originally posted by Doozergirl
    How does this post help the OP?

    Just asking.
    • Annie1960
    • By Annie1960 19th Jun 17, 12:14 PM
    • 2,669 Posts
    • 1,491 Thanks
    Annie1960
    Who on earth said to remove regulations? The point is that there are regulations, British Standards, best practice guidance etc that already exist for the construction industry. The problem is that some consumers can't/won't be bothered to research something before spending thousands of pounds.

    This argument is called a thought experiment. I am not seriously suggesting we should remove food hygiene regulations, just suggesting what would happen if they were removed.

    Those that can be bothered to research will find a huge amount of info on t'internet that allows them to prepare specifications and contracts properly. Only those who don't have time, are too lazy or are doing something very unique/difficult need to appoint professionals to assist them.

    Why should consumers have to do this for builders, when we don't have to do it for most other things? Do you do all this research every time you book an electrician? No, you just check their registration, which is easy to do. What about when you make an appointment with a dentist or doctor? Should you have to find out how to select one? Write a specification of exactly what should be done? No, the state regulates them because they can kill you if they are not properly trained. Similarly, a bad builder can kill you just as dead.

    In your analogy it's the equivalent of having a slightly more expensive chicken on the shelf that has been checked and safe, and then a second cheaper chicken which hasn't and you take the risk of getting seriously ill - it's still the consumers choice!

    No, this is not the argument I am making. There should be no cheaper unregulated chicken on the shelf. All chickens should be equally regulated. Some may be priced differently, but this is called a free market, not an unregulated market.

    We do not give consumers the choice to use an unregulated gas engineer, so why do we let unregulated builders thrive?

    I'm glad to further explain my argument so hopefully you will be better able to understand the point I'm making.

    Although I would add that on some (most?) jobs us professionals can actually save clients money as well as doing it properly....
    Originally posted by ComicGeek

    ...........................

    Just waiting for Doozergirl to come along and report my post for being 'offensive'.
    Last edited by Annie1960; 19-06-2017 at 2:18 PM.
    • Grenage
    • By Grenage 19th Jun 17, 12:38 PM
    • 1,204 Posts
    • 1,117 Thanks
    Grenage
    Is it too much to ask that people with an axe avoid grinding it on every post that might be in any way related to their issue?

    That would be swell.
    • teneighty
    • By teneighty 19th Jun 17, 1:23 PM
    • 986 Posts
    • 683 Thanks
    teneighty
    Bit worrying that the tread title is "new roof deals", not the best starting point.

    One snippet of advice I would give as OP lives abroad is to use a roofing contractor that is a member of the National Federation of Roofing Contractors. The better larger firms I have used have all been members but it should not be taken that all members are necessarily perfect. You should still get multiple quotes and do the usual checks.

    Some advice on the NFRC website about choosing a contractor, Building Regulations and available guarantee scheme. https://www.nfrc.co.uk/using-a-member
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