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    • CodeMatcha
    • By CodeMatcha 16th Jun 17, 12:58 PM
    • 11Posts
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    CodeMatcha
    Overpriced Season Tickets
    • #1
    • 16th Jun 17, 12:58 PM
    Overpriced Season Tickets 16th Jun 17 at 12:58 PM
    After struggling to pay rent in London, I decided to move in with a family member in High Wycombe. I would need to pay a few bills etc, but no rent.

    I work a civil service job right in the center of London, which I love, but it is not extremely well paid (at least not when paying London prices).

    I wanted more money left at the end of the month to pay back debt and to go out with friends. As its on a trainline, the journey isnt that much longer than the bus routes from some of the zone 2 rooms I was looking at (just over an hour).

    Just looked up the price of a season ticket between High Wycombe station and London (including travel card) and it's £408 a month! I was moving so I didnt pay rent for a bit - but it certainly feels like I am now!

    They charge £329/m just for the 24 min train between High Wycombe and London Marylebone. Its an hours journey in total for £408/m...

    I have a 16-25 railcard, but I cant apply it to a season ticket. This there any cheaper way of doing this? It would give me the freedom to travel all around london, but so would a £100ish railcard :/

    Is this insane, or was I just navie to expect trains to be cheaper? I dont know how much driving would cost (not that I would drive into London)? Lots of people I know commute from Brighton and Milton Keynes etc
    Last edited by CodeMatcha; 16-06-2017 at 1:01 PM.
Page 1
    • Lokolo
    • By Lokolo 16th Jun 17, 2:56 PM
    • 19,669 Posts
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    Lokolo
    • #2
    • 16th Jun 17, 2:56 PM
    • #2
    • 16th Jun 17, 2:56 PM
    The Chiltern Railways lines are expensive. I have my HW to London Travelcard season ticket at a lovely £4k a year.

    Your only other option is to drive to Amersham, which is zone 9, and get the metropolitan line £3,400 a year odd. But it is a longer journey and you obviously would still need to then drive to Amersham from Wycombe.

    I get a train at 7.44 and am at my office by 8.50ish. This is HW -> Marylebone -> Walk to Baker Street -> Tube to Barbican -> 10 minute walk to work.
    • CodeMatcha
    • By CodeMatcha 16th Jun 17, 4:33 PM
    • 11 Posts
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    CodeMatcha
    • #3
    • 16th Jun 17, 4:33 PM
    • #3
    • 16th Jun 17, 4:33 PM
    Thanks, maybe an option to consider in the future. I dont know the stations around there, so its really helpful.

    Unfortunatly I cant drive just yet - I'm planning to cycle to HW station.
    • Altarf
    • By Altarf 17th Jun 17, 9:26 AM
    • 2,799 Posts
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    Altarf
    • #4
    • 17th Jun 17, 9:26 AM
    • #4
    • 17th Jun 17, 9:26 AM
    is there any cheaper way of doing this?
    Originally posted by CodeMatcha
    The obvious thing to do as you work for the civil service is stop buying monthly tickets and take the interest free loan they will give you and buy an annual ticket.

    £4256 per year vs £408 per month would save you £640.

    Do you need the Travelcard element that adds over £800 a year? How far is your office? Could you walk. How about using the Boris Bikes? Why not get an old bike secondhand and leave it at Marylebone? Why not use the cycle to work scheme and buy a folding bike to take on the train?

    Is this insane, or was I just navie to expect trains to be cheaper?
    Originally posted by CodeMatcha
    With a season ticket you will be paying £19 a day (assuming you don't use the ticket on weekends or holidays) against the £32.60 you would pay if you bought a daily return ticket. That sounds like quite a discount.

    I dont know how much driving would cost (not that I would drive into London)?
    Originally posted by CodeMatcha
    Cost of buying a car, plus cost of maintenance, plus cost of fuel, plus cost of parking, plus cost of congestion charge.

    But most importantly the cost of your time. Do you think you could drive from High Wycombe to central London in an hour?

    £19 is a bargain.
    • CodeMatcha
    • By CodeMatcha 17th Jun 17, 2:48 PM
    • 11 Posts
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    CodeMatcha
    • #5
    • 17th Jun 17, 2:48 PM
    • #5
    • 17th Jun 17, 2:48 PM
    Thanks.

    I didnt know about the loan, and didnt think I could get a season ticket because I may not stay a full year. I didnt realise I could get them refunded if I move.

    Unfortunately I do need a travelcard as its an hour by bike to both work and my boyfriends.

    I've always lived in places where I could get trams/tubes and buses, so I have never paid more than £5 a day (I have an under 25 railcard now). Obviously this covers a greater distance, but its still only an hour.

    There are limited houses in London (hence they are expensive), so I have been thinking about moving outside for a while. I had a 2 bed flat in my old city for less than £800, and a 1 bed for less than £600. They keep coming up with better transport links to encourange people to move outside London, but clearly not making them affordable. If I was paying rent, I would have to go back to renting a room in Zone 1/2 again as it wouldnt be cost affective. This doesnt help the housing problem in London. Is cheaper transport not easier than building more houses in London?

    £19 is a bargain.
    Also it is expensive compared to other trains in the UK - I train everywhere and thats a short distance for £19. So I dont feels its a bargin just because they charge even more normally.
    Last edited by CodeMatcha; 17-06-2017 at 3:29 PM.
    • wealdroam
    • By wealdroam 17th Jun 17, 3:03 PM
    • 18,642 Posts
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    wealdroam
    • #6
    • 17th Jun 17, 3:03 PM
    • #6
    • 17th Jun 17, 3:03 PM
    Also it is expensive compared to other trains in the UK - I train everywhere and thats a short distance for £19. So I dont feels its a bargin just because they charge even more normally.
    Originally posted by CodeMatcha
    That may be so, but the trains into London during the rush hour are always full so why would the train companies want to reduce the prices?

    Do you understand the economics of supply and demand?

    On a lightly used service it might make sense to reduce prices to encourage more custom, but it makes no sense to reduce prices for services that are over-subscribed, does it?
    • CodeMatcha
    • By CodeMatcha 17th Jun 17, 3:15 PM
    • 11 Posts
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    CodeMatcha
    • #7
    • 17th Jun 17, 3:15 PM
    • #7
    • 17th Jun 17, 3:15 PM
    That may be so, but the trains into London during the rush hour are always full so why would the train companies want to reduce the prices?

    Do you understand the economics of supply and demand?

    On a lightly used service it might make sense to reduce prices to encourage more custom, but it makes no sense to reduce prices for services that are over-subscribed, does it?
    Originally posted by wealdroam
    Of course I understand why its expensive. I'm reacting to the comment above who stated that £19 was a bargin. Of course its not! - no matter what they charge at other times. Replying like that and trying to be condescending is just childish and at somepoint you will insult someone.

    The goverment does have a say in this - it's not a mars bar. Its to do with what proportion we pay compared with what the goverment does towards the train - and it keeps increasing. The High Wycombe line is one of the most insanely overpriced at the moment - and it doesnt need to be. Its a public service and hence can be capped etc.

    I'm not moving to High Wycome by choice - I am doing so because I love my job in London, but rent is too expensive. If the 20 min train costs the same as rent then something is wrong. Our train fares are 6 times higher than the EU.
    Last edited by CodeMatcha; 17-06-2017 at 3:23 PM.
    • wealdroam
    • By wealdroam 17th Jun 17, 4:15 PM
    • 18,642 Posts
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    wealdroam
    • #8
    • 17th Jun 17, 4:15 PM
    • #8
    • 17th Jun 17, 4:15 PM
    Our train fares are 6 times higher than the EU.
    Originally posted by CodeMatcha
    Are you sure?

    Can you provide a citation please, or perhaps examples that can be compared?
    • silverwhistle
    • By silverwhistle 17th Jun 17, 11:25 PM
    • 1,489 Posts
    • 1,949 Thanks
    silverwhistle
    • #9
    • 17th Jun 17, 11:25 PM
    • #9
    • 17th Jun 17, 11:25 PM
    Are you sure?

    Can you provide a citation please, or perhaps examples that can be compared?
    Originally posted by wealdroam
    I don't think it's as big as that but it is significant. When I lived in Italy the low cost of public transport was always a pleasant surprise - Torino-Milano €12.45, 1hr52 minutes, for example, or €33 on the high speed Frecciarossa 1 hour (which I've only ever used once). Distance around 90 miles. The local motorway, on the other hand, had the highest prices in the country!
    • Altarf
    • By Altarf 18th Jun 17, 9:40 AM
    • 2,799 Posts
    • 1,660 Thanks
    Altarf
    Thanks.

    I didnt know about the loan, and didnt think I could get a season ticket because I may not stay a full year. I didnt realise I could get them refunded if I move.
    Originally posted by CodeMatcha
    If you leave you will have to pay back the balance of the loan, e.g. £4,000 loan and you leave after 6 months, then must pay back £2,000.

    However if you cancel your season ticket you don't get a pro-rata refund, e.g. cancel a £4,000 a year season ticket after six months you don't get £2,000 back.

    What they do is recalculate what it would have cost had you bought monthly, weekly, or daily tickets. So if that £4,000 ticket would have cost £400 per month, then you will get £1,600 back (they will have calculated the tickets should have cost you £400 x 6 = £2400) which could leave you £400 short paying back the loan.

    The way around this is if you still need a train ticket, just a different train ticket is to do a 'changeover'. Then they do calculate the difference between the old ticket and the new ticket on a pro-rata basis, and you either get the pro-rata difference back if it is a cheaper ticket (or pay the difference if more expensive).

    If you don't need a train ticket at all, then it can (depending on the timing) be cheaper to do a changeover to Devonport to Devonport Dockyard than cancelling the season ticket. Devonport to Devonport Dockyard is the cheapest season ticket in the UK at £116 per year, so although you will lose something, you lose the least.
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