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  • FIRST POST
    • Adrian1999
    • By Adrian1999 13th Jun 17, 10:43 PM
    • 11Posts
    • 4Thanks
    Adrian1999
    Dealing with Total Parking Solutions (I'm a 99%)
    • #1
    • 13th Jun 17, 10:43 PM
    Dealing with Total Parking Solutions (I'm a 99%) 13th Jun 17 at 10:43 PM
    Hi new your both MSE & this forum area, hoping to get some advice to deal with Total Parking Solutions (TPS), the car park which uses ANPR, and the received a NTK PCN. I have read through Coupon-mad & crabman, encouraging me to perform some of my own research, and write up a draft letter.

    Some context; I overstayed in a short stay hospital car park (3.5 hours) designated for employees of the health board, of which I am. As a result of being unable to leave half way through performing a analytical analysis on biological samples of patients of the said HB, at the time of the incident.

    The received PCN states my name, address, images of my entry and exit, charge now payable of £20, the issue date of notice was 08/06/2017, however the letter was only received today (13/06/17) (how does this affect my appeal period?). Also, the letter has no name of warden or warden signature, is this signifcant too?

    From my understanding TPS is a member of BPA, so can retrieve information re myself. However, not a member of IPC, what are the implications here in terms of enforcement?

    I have began a draft letter, hope I could get some feedback? (Not finished)

    To whom it may concern,
    Re: Total Parking Solutions (TPS) Parking Charge Notice, verification code --------------

    I am the registered keeper and I wish to appeal a recent parking charge from Total Parking Solutions. I am a genuine employee of the contracting authority or client (Abertawe Bro Morgannwg University Health Board (ABMU)) to your enforcement of the short stay parking area.

    The delay of leaving the car park by 15 minutes over the designated 3.5 hours (3 hours 30 minutes), was a result of carrying out an analytical assay upon biological samples, which cannot be halted during preparation, or passed along due the professional nature to the duty of Care. Biological samples of patients in care of the ABMU health board, your contracting client, at the time of the incident. Thus, in the best interest of the A board and myself, and at the time of the event, seen to carry on to the completion of the biochemical pro

    As the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) identifies that the parking was overstayed by 15 minutes, this further identifies that no ‘grace period’ was allowed. Of which it did, my overstay period would of consisted of only 5 minutes.

    Reflective of both the PCN stated overstay time, and the potential time if a ‘grace period’ is enforced. The charge does not reflect an appropriate or genuine pre-estimate loss towards the respected time. As parking is granted free, failing to quantify any loss.

    Failure to respond appropriately, to confirm cancellation of PCN, or to provide in response with a POPLA verification code shall be reported as a breach of BPA Code of Practice.

    Yours faithfully,

    Registered keeper

    Many thanks for any responses!

    p.s. what is a small claim? - is this where they take you to not 'proper' court?
    Last edited by Adrian1999; 13-06-2017 at 11:04 PM. Reason: grammar & details
Page 1
    • Redx
    • By Redx 13th Jun 17, 11:50 PM
    • 15,516 Posts
    • 19,601 Thanks
    Redx
    • #2
    • 13th Jun 17, 11:50 PM
    • #2
    • 13th Jun 17, 11:50 PM
    if they are BPA AOS members then just follow the BPA advice in the NEWBIES sticvky thread, dont overthink it

    google MCOL to find out about the civil court procedures, which is at your local court in front of a judge , its a bit like Judge Rinder without all the theatrics
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 14th Jun 17, 12:48 AM
    • 40,304 Posts
    • 80,504 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    • #3
    • 14th Jun 17, 12:48 AM
    • #3
    • 14th Jun 17, 12:48 AM
    Edit your post to remove information about who did what. Only ever refer to The Driver and The Keeper. Parking scammers monitor this forum.

    Then just send the BPA template in blue from the NEWBIES thread as keeper, exactly as it is.

    After that you need to read up on how to beat this at the PoPLA stage, all of which is explained in the NEWBIES.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • fisherjim
    • By fisherjim 14th Jun 17, 8:48 AM
    • 2,415 Posts
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    fisherjim
    • #4
    • 14th Jun 17, 8:48 AM
    • #4
    • 14th Jun 17, 8:48 AM
    Sorry but your appeal will be laughed at by the PPC who are not interested in what you were doing, and "genuine pre-estimate of loss" has been dead in the water for a couple of years.
    The BPA threat is pointless it's their old boys' club that they pay into for advice, protection and access to the DVLA not to protect the motorist.

    Though you do have a better chance with POPLA than the kangaroo outfit run by the IPC.

    The reason you have images of entry and exit is because this was issued by anpr, no human intervention just a computer generated charge to make money.

    Follow the advice given and use tried and tested appeals route, you should also try talking to the estates management office who can cancel these, and might take your reasons in to consideration.
    To quote the words of the great Count Arthur Strong "You Couldn't make it up"
    • Johnersh
    • By Johnersh 14th Jun 17, 9:08 AM
    • 418 Posts
    • 753 Thanks
    Johnersh
    • #5
    • 14th Jun 17, 9:08 AM
    • #5
    • 14th Jun 17, 9:08 AM
    Since your employer DOES know what a histological assay is and the importance of the work, you might start with asking them to write on your behalf to the PPC to get the ticket rescinded.

    However, the forum is also full of cases where employers/management co's have refused to help. Worth a go to try and cut this off at source.
    • Adrian1999
    • By Adrian1999 14th Jun 17, 10:06 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    Adrian1999
    • #6
    • 14th Jun 17, 10:06 AM
    • #6
    • 14th Jun 17, 10:06 AM
    if they are BPA AOS members then just follow the BPA advice in the NEWBIES sticvky thread, dont overthink it

    google MCOL to find out about the civil court procedures, which is at your local court in front of a judge , its a bit like Judge Rinder without all the theatrics
    1. TPS is BPA AOS member -> should I use the template provided word for word?
    2. Why do I need to involve MCOL?


    Sorry I have no grasp of anything legal what so ever.


    Edit your post to remove information about who did what. Only ever refer to The Driver and The Keeper. Parking scammers monitor this forum.

    Then just send the BPA template in blue from the NEWBIES thread as keeper, exactly as it is.

    After that you need to read up on how to beat this at the PoPLA stage, all of which is explained in the NEWBIES.
    1. If I appeal, does this waive my opportunity to pay the initial fine? (As in, if I appeal and lose, will I have to pay a higher fine?)
    - how does this affect the overall time provided to handle the fine? As I have only 8 days to pay, due the fact I received the letter 5 days after the PCN was issued.

    2. The TPL terms of use starts the need to enclose, "Full name & address" (I understand not too). BUT, what are your thoughts on the impact of breaching their terms?
    3. My manager suggested to ignore the PCN completely. -> Would it be unwise to do so, as the PPC is a BPA/AOC member.
    4. Alternatively, should I also contact my hospital to see if they are willing to cancel the PCN?


    TO NOTE: I just noticed that on the online appeal page, it has the standard, "All fields marked with an * are required" - however, none of the fields (especially full name & address) have an astrix.

    Finally, is worthwhile just paying the £20? Sadly at this time, that is a lot of money for me and would rather not. However, this is causing a lot of stress and anxiety (I over stress myself pointlessly anyway).


    Many thanks!
    Last edited by Adrian1999; 14-06-2017 at 10:17 AM. Reason: added more details
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 14th Jun 17, 10:16 AM
    • 14,576 Posts
    • 22,932 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #7
    • 14th Jun 17, 10:16 AM
    • #7
    • 14th Jun 17, 10:16 AM
    1. Follow our advice and you won't be paying anything. Why on earth are you thinking of paying? Just get your initial appeal off in time, get your POPLA code, then get it killed.

    2. Supply the full name and address of the registered keeper, as per the V5 (log book). They'll get it from the DVLA in any case.

    3. Did being ill-informed get him the manager's job? Ignore him rather than the parking charge.

    4. Do that in parallel. Don't miss the appeal deadline.

    Finally - your call as to whether to pay a scam charge. Most of the stuff you need is already written for you in the sticky thread to avoid you paying this. Fight or flight time. We'll help you fight it, but if it's 'flight' - sayonara!
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Adrian1999
    • By Adrian1999 14th Jun 17, 10:23 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    Adrian1999
    • #8
    • 14th Jun 17, 10:23 AM
    • #8
    • 14th Jun 17, 10:23 AM
    Is this the appropriate response found in the 'Newbies thread'?
    Dear Sirs

    Re: PCN No. ....................

    I challenge this 'PCN' as keeper of the car.

    I believe that your signs fail the test of 'large lettering' and prominence, as established in
    ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis.
    Your unremarkable and obscure signs were not seen by the driver, are in very small print and the terms are not readable to drivers.

    There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. You must either rely on the POFA 2012 and offer me a POPLA code, or cancel the charge.

    Should you obtain the registered keeper's data from the DVLA without reasonable cause, please take this as formal notice that I reserve the right to sue your company and the landowner/principal, for a sum not less than £250 for any Data Protection Act breach. Your aggressive business practice and unwarranted threat of court for the ordinary matter of a driver using my car without causing any obstruction nor offence, has caused significant distress to me.

    I do not give you consent to process data relating to me or this vehicle. I deny liability for any sum at all and you must consider this letter a Section 10 Notice under the DPA. You are required to respond within 21 days. I have kept proof of submission of this appeal and look forward to your reply.



    With the online appear as you've just said, provide my full details, but identify my self as the 'keeper', correct? Should I further provide my contact number and email?


    I will fight.


    Many thanks
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 14th Jun 17, 10:31 AM
    • 14,576 Posts
    • 22,932 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #9
    • 14th Jun 17, 10:31 AM
    • #9
    • 14th Jun 17, 10:31 AM
    Yep, that's the correct template. Do not add anything further to it (or take anything out). You do realise that you will be rejected, but that's the hoop you need to jump through to get to POPLA.

    With the online appear as you've just said, provide my full details, but identify my self as the 'keeper', correct?
    That's all you need to do.

    Should I further provide my contact number
    Nope - as you will not be speaking with them (whether them phoning you, or you phoning them). Never phone a PPC (or debt collector) as you will come off second best - remember they deal with this stuff every day of the week - they know what they're doing, you don't.

    Should I further provide my contact email?
    If you're going to provide an email address, set up a throw-away one via gmail. Don't give them any personal one.

    I will fight.
    Good - because that's what we are doing every day, for you and hundreds of other motorists caught out by this disgraceful skimdustry.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Adrian1999
    • By Adrian1999 14th Jun 17, 11:04 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    Adrian1999
    Thank you so much. Before I confirm my appeal, how does this affect my opportunity to pay the initial £20, or should I just completely scrap the entire notion of paying anything? Encase my appeal is rejected.



    Is there any point in reaching out to the health board?


    I am confused regarding accountability, as I did over stay, how is this considered?


    Looking at section #3 on Coupon-mad's thread, he talks about providing photo evidence, but what if the signs are appropriate?

    many thanks
    Last edited by Adrian1999; 14-06-2017 at 11:20 AM. Reason: additional details
    • Herzlos
    • By Herzlos 14th Jun 17, 11:09 AM
    • 5,652 Posts
    • 5,109 Thanks
    Herzlos
    Thank you so much. I do have one question before I confirm my appeal. How does this affect my opportunity to pay the initial £20? or should I just completely scrap the entire notion of paying anything?
    Originally posted by Adrian1999
    Correct, you're paying nothing. If you feel guilty about overstaying because you had to do your job, give the £20 to a charity.

    The £20 is a bribe to get you to just pay up without questioning it.
    • Adrian1999
    • By Adrian1999 14th Jun 17, 11:13 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    Adrian1999
    Correct, you're paying nothing. If you feel guilty about overstaying because you had to do your job, give the £20 to a charity.

    The £20 is a bribe to get you to just pay up without questioning it.
    Right that's helpful. I think something as simple as that would be beneficially just spelt out in layman terms. As I have no grasp of anything like this, as I am learning to deal with a lot without any support what so ever.
    • fisherjim
    • By fisherjim 14th Jun 17, 11:38 AM
    • 2,415 Posts
    • 3,641 Thanks
    fisherjim
    On no account give anyone your phone number or phone any ppc or useless debt collector, your naivety will be your downfall, sorry to be blunt.

    The estate management, or facilities department or what ever will have appointed these scammers they would be my first port of call to get them to call their dogs off.

    Please stop thinking if this as a "fine" you have been sent a speculative invoice by greedy bottom feeding useless muppets no more!
    To quote the words of the great Count Arthur Strong "You Couldn't make it up"
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 14th Jun 17, 12:06 PM
    • 14,576 Posts
    • 22,932 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    Looking at section #3 on Coupon-mad's thread, she talks about providing photo evidence, but what if the signs are appropriate?
    How would you know 'if the signs are appropriate'? It's not for you to determine - it is for the PPC to provide strict proof that they are - and on everything else for that matter. You put your marker down with this initial appeal, then you make more substantive statements, requiring strict proof from the PPC, to POPLA.

    Even if POPLA turns down your appeal, you know you still do not have to pay it. The only time you would have to pay is if ordered by a judge - if TPS initiate small claims court proceedings.

    From over 100,000 tickets issued in the past 2.5 years, they've attended the small claims court just 5 times (and they're not necessarily in respect of parking tickets, could have been related to a supplier contract or similar).

    http://www.bmpa.eu/companydata/Total_Parking_Solutions.html

    So, do you think they're going to go to all that trouble for you over £20?
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Adrian1999
    • By Adrian1999 14th Jun 17, 2:15 PM
    • 11 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    Adrian1999
    On no account give anyone your phone number or phone any ppc or useless debt collector, your naivety will be your downfall, sorry to be blunt.

    No it is fine, I am clearly aware of my naivety to this.


    A general consensus please? So I simply just put my appeal straight through, OR contact my health board (client of the PCN contractor) to call off the PCN?.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 14th Jun 17, 2:19 PM
    • 14,576 Posts
    • 22,932 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    No it is fine, I am clearly aware of my naivety to this.


    A general consensus please? So I simply just put my appeal straight through, OR contact my health board (client of the PCN contractor) to call off the PCN?.
    Originally posted by Adrian1999
    Both - simultaneously.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 14th Jun 17, 10:25 PM
    • 50,098 Posts
    • 63,482 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    does this waive my opportunity to pay the initial fine
    Opportunity?! That's not how we would describe it!

    And as Umkomaas said, I'm a she...
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Guys Dad
    • By Guys Dad 15th Jun 17, 8:07 AM
    • 10,197 Posts
    • 9,330 Thanks
    Guys Dad
    Did the NTK date exceed 14 days after event? Ie the date on the NTK. Also do you still have the envelope and is there a post mark?
    • Adrian1999
    • By Adrian1999 15th Jun 17, 6:55 PM
    • 11 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    Adrian1999
    Both - simultaneously.
    I've held of submitting my appeal to get into touch with my health board. The individuals response is they have no jurisdiction to wave appeals, and that appeal with my explanation of what had happened (see original post) .

    Furthermore, spoke to my line manager, multiple employees have NPCs, and have continuously ignored the letters. On a couple of occasions individuals (one w/ ~20 & another with 50+ separate offences) have been approached by the HB to repay a percentage to wipe the slate clean (~10% I believe).

    With this information, I will just submit my appeal now, correct?

    And as Umkomaas said, I'm a she...
    I have become aware, my apologises.

    many thanks too all that have responded.
    • Redx
    • By Redx 15th Jun 17, 7:04 PM
    • 15,516 Posts
    • 19,601 Thanks
    Redx
    I've held of submitting my appeal to get into touch with my health board. The individuals response is they have no jurisdiction to wave appeals, and that appeal with my explanation of what had happened (see original post) .

    Furthermore, spoke to my line manager, multiple employees have NPCs, and have continuously ignored the letters. On a couple of occasions individuals (one w/ ~20 & another with 50+ separate offences) have been approached by the HB to repay a percentage to wipe the slate clean (~10% I believe).

    With this information, I will just submit my appeal now, correct?

    I have become aware, my apologises.

    many thanks too all that have responded.
    Originally posted by Adrian1999
    they are lying and also not following the rules laid down by their bosses, ie:- by Jeremy Hunt and the NHS itself, never mind the government

    these rules were published a couple of years ago so they have no excuse , the government says they are jointly liable , so they cannot wriggle out of their responsibilities in this way

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles

    point them at those guidelines and watch them squirm

    Contracted-out car parking

    NHS organisations are responsible for the actions of private contractors who run car parks on their behalf.
    NHS organisations should act against rogue contractors in line with the relevant codes of practice6where applicable.
    Contracts should not be let on any basis that incentivises additional charges, eg ‘income from parking charge notices only’.
    also ask your MP to write to them asking why they are saying these lies in contravention of those guidelines ?

    and yes, put your appeal in too
    Last edited by Redx; 15-06-2017 at 7:07 PM.
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
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