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  • FIRST POST
    • Gb1623
    • By Gb1623 13th Jun 17, 9:08 PM
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    Gb1623
    Can I claim mileage?
    • #1
    • 13th Jun 17, 9:08 PM
    Can I claim mileage? 13th Jun 17 at 9:08 PM
    I work as a self employed dental nurse. I have previously claimed mileage, I submitted all my paperwork to my bookkeeper in April and have been informed I can no longer claim mileage

    I was wondering if anyone could confirm that this is correct.

    Many thanks
Page 1
    • Geoff1963
    • By Geoff1963 13th Jun 17, 9:12 PM
    • 634 Posts
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    Geoff1963
    • #2
    • 13th Jun 17, 9:12 PM
    • #2
    • 13th Jun 17, 9:12 PM
    I think you can either : claim mileage ; or consider your vehicle as a capital and cost item, the total of which is split in proportion to personal / private mileage.

    However, you can't claim mileage for commuting to your normal place of work ; and that may be where the ambiguity arises.
    • Gb1623
    • By Gb1623 13th Jun 17, 9:15 PM
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    Gb1623
    • #3
    • 13th Jun 17, 9:15 PM
    • #3
    • 13th Jun 17, 9:15 PM
    Thank you. I don't have a normal place of work as I generally go to different practices every day.

    I was told because I can't do my job without being in a practice then I can't claim mileage
    • Geoff1963
    • By Geoff1963 13th Jun 17, 10:36 PM
    • 634 Posts
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    Geoff1963
    • #4
    • 13th Jun 17, 10:36 PM
    • #4
    • 13th Jun 17, 10:36 PM
    The only answer will be to bump up what you charge, all your competitors must be in the same position. A friend quit caring housecalls, because she spent more on fuel than the minimum-wage time at each place.
    • 00ec25
    • By 00ec25 14th Jun 17, 2:10 AM
    • 4,365 Posts
    • 3,721 Thanks
    00ec25
    • #5
    • 14th Jun 17, 2:10 AM
    • #5
    • 14th Jun 17, 2:10 AM
    who is your contract with?
    - the patient?
    or
    - the dentist?

    just because you visit a number of different establishments does not, in and of itself, mean each journey is a business one, they could simply be normal commuting on the basis you have several different individual places of employment.
    • Pennywise
    • By Pennywise 14th Jun 17, 10:25 AM
    • 8,955 Posts
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    Pennywise
    • #6
    • 14th Jun 17, 10:25 AM
    • #6
    • 14th Jun 17, 10:25 AM
    When you say you "go to different practices every day", is there a pattern, or is it purely random?

    Are all these practices in the same general area, i.e. town or are they spread across several towns?

    Can you confirm you're a sole trader and not a limited company?
    • Gb1623
    • By Gb1623 14th Jun 17, 12:35 PM
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    Gb1623
    • #7
    • 14th Jun 17, 12:35 PM
    • #7
    • 14th Jun 17, 12:35 PM
    I am a sole trader. I don't have a pattern to the practices I go to I travel anything from 2 miles each way to 40+ miles each way. I invoice each practice and they pay me directly.

    Thank you. I appreciate all your help
    • Aquamania
    • By Aquamania 14th Jun 17, 1:37 PM
    • 1,933 Posts
    • 771 Thanks
    Aquamania
    • #8
    • 14th Jun 17, 1:37 PM
    • #8
    • 14th Jun 17, 1:37 PM
    I work as a self employed dental nurse. I have previously claimed mileage, I submitted all my paperwork to my bookkeeper in April and have been informed I can no longer claim mileage

    I was wondering if anyone could confirm that this is correct.

    Many thanks
    Originally posted by Gb1623
    I am a sole trader. I don't have a pattern to the practices I go to I travel anything from 2 miles each way to 40+ miles each way. I invoice each practice and they pay me directly.

    Thank you. I appreciate all your help
    Originally posted by Gb1623
    Rather than any of us trying to fully understand your business, or indeed try to guess at what your bookkeeper is referring to, could I suggest you ask your bookkeeper what is is he/she thinks has changed since the beginning of this tax year that has led to him/her providing you with this advice?

    Post the reply here and then we may all be able to help you further
    • Gb1623
    • By Gb1623 14th Jun 17, 1:50 PM
    • 8 Posts
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    Gb1623
    • #9
    • 14th Jun 17, 1:50 PM
    • #9
    • 14th Jun 17, 1:50 PM
    I was told a legislator changed in April 2016 in regards to agency staff
    • Aquamania
    • By Aquamania 14th Jun 17, 1:57 PM
    • 1,933 Posts
    • 771 Thanks
    Aquamania
    Thank you. I don't have a normal place of work as I generally go to different practices every day.

    I was told because I can't do my job without being in a practice then I can't claim mileage
    Originally posted by Gb1623
    This may be a hint as to the reasoning the bookkeeper is using

    You cannot usually claim tax releief for travelling to and from work. Most people have a permanent place of work, and so can claim tax relief if for business reasons, they are required to travel from that place of work to another on a temporary basis for such business.

    Based on what you have siad, you don't appear to have a permanent place of work as you do not have permanent employment. Rather you obtain a new contract each day and are paid for the work you perform that day. So in your case, each day you essentially have a new job and a new place of work. If, having arrived at your contracted place of work that day, you need to perhaps go to another place for a couple of hours to cover staff shortage, or perhaps go out to collect supplies, then those additional journeys would be allowed tax releif, but not the jorneys to your place of work, sorry.

    However, I don't know that this has changed at all since the start of the tax year, so your bookkeeper has presumably a better understanding of what you actually do, and indeed has reasons to suspect something has recently cahnged, either in how you operate or in the appropriate law.

    Talk to your bookkeeper and do let us know the response
    Last edited by Aquamania; 14-06-2017 at 1:59 PM.
    • Aquamania
    • By Aquamania 14th Jun 17, 1:59 PM
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    Aquamania
    I was told a legislator changed in April 2016 in regards to agency staff
    Originally posted by Gb1623
    Sorry, I don't understand.

    A legislator? Or legislation?
    Either way, please provide the details of the change.

    Do you work for an agency?
    I thought you said you were self employed.

    As asked previously in post #5,
    who is your contract with?
    - the patient?
    or
    - the dentist?
    by 00ec25
    Who provides you with the order?
    Who do you invoice?
    Who pays you?

    Are you saying it is all done through an agency?
    Last edited by Aquamania; 14-06-2017 at 2:09 PM.
    • Gb1623
    • By Gb1623 14th Jun 17, 2:32 PM
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    Gb1623
    I am booked through an agency but on a self employed basis. I invoice the agency they pay me. Then they invoice the practice.


    A legislation has changed apparently.
    • Gb1623
    • By Gb1623 14th Jun 17, 2:35 PM
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    Gb1623
    Sorry I invoice the agency who invoice the practice who pays them directly
    • Aquamania
    • By Aquamania 14th Jun 17, 2:40 PM
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    • 771 Thanks
    Aquamania
    Sorry I invoice the agency who invoice the practice who pays them directly
    Originally posted by Gb1623
    That is not quite the same as you asserted previously in this thread

    I am a sole trader. I don't have a pattern to the practices I go to I travel anything from 2 miles each way to 40+ miles each way. I invoice each practice and they pay me directly.

    Thank you. I appreciate all your help
    Originally posted by Gb1623
    Anyway, moving forward.

    Are you required to attend the agency each day to receive your instructions for that day?
    Or do you travel direct from home to your place of work (i.e. the dental practise you are assigned to for that day) each day?
    • Gb1623
    • By Gb1623 14th Jun 17, 2:51 PM
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    Gb1623
    I travel direct from my home to the practice.
    • Aquamania
    • By Aquamania 14th Jun 17, 3:03 PM
    • 1,933 Posts
    • 771 Thanks
    Aquamania
    I travel direct from my home to the practice.
    Originally posted by Gb1623
    Then I'm sorry but as a person who is working through an agency, "the first trip of every day, from home to work, and the last trip of every day, from work to home, is considered a commute so cannot be a travel expense."
    Source: http://www.contractoruk.com/expenses/agency_workers_travel_expenses.html

    But I'm not sure this situation has changed recently

    What did change effective April 2016 is that the government cracked down on dodgy agencies who were abusing the tax position. It affected those employed via an agency umbrella (and indeed those using their own limited co but were caught under IR35)

    Essentially it clarified that if you are a temporary worker subject to SDC (Supervision, Direction or Control) then you cannot claim travel or subsistence tax relief.
    More info here:
    http://www.nixonwilliams.com/free-resources/2016-tax-changes/april-2016-changes-travel-and-subsistence-expenses

    That's because those subject to SDC are probably, imho, disguised employees not self employed as you assert you are, and it should be the employer that pays such expenses.
    (Commuting is never an expense in relation to tax affairs)

    If you are working through an umbrella company, then that umbrella company is your employer. i.e. you are not self employed.
    Last edited by Aquamania; 14-06-2017 at 3:12 PM.
    • Gb1623
    • By Gb1623 14th Jun 17, 3:20 PM
    • 8 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gb1623
    Thank you for all your help very much appreciated
    • Geoff1963
    • By Geoff1963 14th Jun 17, 5:51 PM
    • 634 Posts
    • 399 Thanks
    Geoff1963
    Why not get your neighbour to employ you ?

    Each day you call in ( next door ) to your place of work, and are then sent by car to the assigned job.
    When have finished, you call back at your normal place of work, then "commute" home.

    I can't see why that won't work, but I'm sure there is a law somewhere.
    • Geoff1963
    • By Geoff1963 14th Jun 17, 6:54 PM
    • 634 Posts
    • 399 Thanks
    Geoff1963
    P.S. To ensure that most of your hours are spent at your proper "place of work", your neighbour would also employ you as a house-sitter in the evenings and on weekends. You would be keeping an eye on the place, while killing the boredom by watching TV, reading books, eating meals, doing ironing etc.
    • bris
    • By bris 14th Jun 17, 7:56 PM
    • 6,656 Posts
    • 5,702 Thanks
    bris
    You can't claim to get to and from your place of work no matter how many places there is. If when you get there you were sent to different places such as people homes you could claim for those journeys, but as you work from the practice you get to then this is just a normal commute.
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