Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • Fazer
    • By Fazer 18th May 17, 2:21 PM
    • 5Posts
    • 0Thanks
    Fazer
    Parking Eye PCN Help!? McDonalds
    • #1
    • 18th May 17, 2:21 PM
    Parking Eye PCN Help!? McDonalds 18th May 17 at 2:21 PM
    Hi,

    I got a PCN the other day. My previous PCN was back in 2012 and I was advised by MSE users to ignore. However, having done a bit of reading it seems that Parking Eye seem have no issue with taking issues to court? I was just looking for some advice.

    I was a legitimate customer and stayed in the restaurant for over 1.5 hours. I was unaware of any parking enforcements. I didn't think the signage was very clear - it was already after dark (sunset 20:07) - signs were not very clearly lit?

    I have no receipt for any purchases made but I am sure there is CCTV footage is needed. The car park was not short of spaces and so there is clearly not a loss of earnings to McDonalds.

    I aim to speak to the manager of McDonalds to see if they can have the PCN retracted via them. I guess starting an appeal is also recommended?


    Thanks in advance.
Page 1
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 18th May 17, 2:31 PM
    • 39,217 Posts
    • 78,347 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    • #2
    • 18th May 17, 2:31 PM
    • #2
    • 18th May 17, 2:31 PM
    When you contact the McD's manager, remember to only refer to yourself as the keeper of the car. Do the same here. The scammers monitor these sites looking for people who say I parked or similar info that gives away the driver's identity.

    Meanwhile, send the BPA template in blue from the Sticky thread for NEWBIES. Copy and paste and send.

    Please provide us with the date of the alleged event and the date the keeper received the NTK.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 18th May 17, 2:35 PM
    • 39,217 Posts
    • 78,347 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    • #3
    • 18th May 17, 2:35 PM
    • #3
    • 18th May 17, 2:35 PM
    A photo of the PCN is below:
    image removed
    Originally posted by Fazer

    You should take that image down and redact the very precise times that will identify you on here before reposting.

    However, they have failed to meet the requirements of the POFA 2012 by sending the PCN too late to transfer liability to the keeper. This is why it is important not to give away the driver's identity.
    You will win at PoPLA on no keeper liability provided you follow the advice here.

    By the way, the advice to ignore has not been given on this site since the law changed in 2012.
    Last edited by Fruitcake; 18-05-2017 at 2:41 PM.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • Fazer
    • By Fazer 18th May 17, 3:11 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Fazer
    • #4
    • 18th May 17, 3:11 PM
    • #4
    • 18th May 17, 3:11 PM
    When you contact the McD's manager, remember to only refer to yourself as the keeper of the car. Do the same here. The scammers monitor these sites looking for people who say I parked or similar info that gives away the driver's identity.

    Meanwhile, send the BPA template in blue from the Sticky thread for NEWBIES. Copy and paste and send.

    Please provide us with the date of the alleged event and the date the keeper received the NTK.
    Originally posted by Fruitcake
    Thanks!. Am I assuming the NTK will be separate to the PCN I have already received (image now removed). Is there any point of contacting McD's if I got through the appeal process? Just to clarify, I will need appeal via the Parking Eye website (copying and pasting the below template) - this will generate a PoPLA code?



    Dear Sirs

    Re: PCN No. ....................

    I challenge this 'PCN' as keeper of the car.

    I believe that your signs fail the test of 'large lettering' and prominence, as established in ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis. Your unremarkable and obscure signs were not seen by the driver, are in very small print and the terms are not readable to drivers.

    There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. You must either rely on the POFA 2012 and offer me a POPLA code, or cancel the charge.

    Should you obtain the registered keeper's data from the DVLA without reasonable cause, please take this as formal notice that I reserve the right to sue your company and the landowner/principal, for a sum not less than £250 for any Data Protection Act breach. Your aggressive business practice and unwarranted threat of court for the ordinary matter of a driver using my car without causing any obstruction nor offence, has caused significant distress to me.

    I do not give you consent to process data relating to me or this vehicle. I deny liability for any sum at all and you must consider this letter a Section 10 Notice under the DPA. You are required to respond within 21 days. I have kept proof of submission of this appeal and look forward to your reply.

    Yours faithfully,
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 18th May 17, 3:37 PM
    • 39,217 Posts
    • 78,347 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    • #5
    • 18th May 17, 3:37 PM
    • #5
    • 18th May 17, 3:37 PM
    The PCN/NTK is normally the same thing where ANPR is used to capture the alleged event. The PCN/NTK is sent to the keeper and must arrive within 14 days from the day after the event for keeper liability to apply.
    If there was a windscreen ticket (rare for parking lie) then this is the PCN to the driver. If this is appealed (by the day to day keeper, not the driver) then hopefully a NTK will never arrive, but it might. If the windscreen ticket is not appealed then a NTK should arrive between day 28 and 56 starting the day after the alleged event.

    In your case it was ANPR so the NTK (which is also the PCN to the keeper) must arrive by day 14 for keeper liability to apply, the date of the alleged event being day zero. Since the NTK arrived late, they cannot transfer liability to the keeper so must only pursue the driver. That is why it is so important that they never find out who that is.

    You should always complain to the landowner or retail manager if the driver or an occupant was a genuine customer.

    Your appeal should generate a PoPLA code if it is rejected. Most appeals are, but if you carefully add that they are too late for the POFA 2012 to apply and transfer liability to the keeper and must only pursue the driver, who you are not obliged to name, they might cancel it. Don't hold your breath though.

    Don't miss he initial appeal deadline.

    If it is rejected you will need to start reading up on how to beat the scammers at PoPLA. All this is explained in the NEWBIES.
    Last edited by Fruitcake; 18-05-2017 at 3:44 PM.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • Fazer
    • By Fazer 18th May 17, 4:08 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Fazer
    • #6
    • 18th May 17, 4:08 PM
    • #6
    • 18th May 17, 4:08 PM

    You should always complain to the landowner or retail manager if the driver or an occupant was a genuine customer.
    Originally posted by Fruitcake
    I am approaching the landowner or retail manager as the keeper of the vehicle. What outcome am I hoping to gain in doing this? Can they call ParkingEye on my behalf and state that the reasons for the vehicle being on the carpark were genuine. Is this something that needs to be in writing?
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 18th May 17, 6:00 PM
    • 13,134 Posts
    • 20,498 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    • #7
    • 18th May 17, 6:00 PM
    • #7
    • 18th May 17, 6:00 PM
    I have no receipt for any purchases made but I am sure there is CCTV footage is needed.
    This is a parking ticket, not a murder! No one will plough through hours of archived CCTV footage, unless requested by the police.

    Is there any point of contacting McD's if I got through the appeal process?
    You should always complain to the landholder. Tell McDonald's that unless they sort this out for you, you will in future be eating much more healthily.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 19th May 17, 12:43 AM
    • 46,894 Posts
    • 60,218 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #8
    • 19th May 17, 12:43 AM
    • #8
    • 19th May 17, 12:43 AM
    Can they call ParkingEye on my behalf
    Of course they can cancel and call off their greedy agent - why would anyone think otherwise?

    You will know that when you read the NEWBIES thread. The very first link there is 'SUCCESSFUL COMPLAINTS ABOUT PPCs' with links to hundreds of threads all about landowner/retailer cancellations of fake PCNs.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

131Posts Today

2,408Users online

Martin's Twitter