Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • misterstingy
    • By misterstingy 1st May 17, 4:42 PM
    • 37Posts
    • 2Thanks
    misterstingy
    Freeholder's sublet fee
    • #1
    • 1st May 17, 4:42 PM
    Freeholder's sublet fee 1st May 17 at 4:42 PM
    I own a leasehold flat which I rent out on Assured Shorthold Tenancies. The company that manages the freeholder's interest has written to me stating that I have to pay a fee every time I find a new tenant.

    I have owned and rented out the flat for 9 years and they want to go back to the beginning with retrospective fees.

    The only thing I can find in the lease which might allow them to charge a fee reads 'within one month after the date of every assignment death grant of probate or administrative assent transfer mortgage charge sub-lease or other event or document relating to the term hereby granted ...'

    (yes it really reads like that, i.e. no commas)

    (It goes on to say that I have to give notice to the Landlord, produce a copy of the document to their solicitor and pay a 'reasonable fee').

    My question is, what do the words 'relating to the term hereby granted' mean. Obviously my 6 month assured shorthold tenancies don't relate to the whole of the 125 year term of the lease, so does that mean I don't have to comply with this requirement?
Page 2
    • scriv
    • By scriv 2nd May 17, 1:33 PM
    • 80 Posts
    • 59 Thanks
    scriv
    Fee is £130 to register a new tenancy with a retrospective consent surcharge of £45.

    The lease doesn't say I need their consent, just that I need to provide them with a copy of the lease and pay a fee.
    Originally posted by misterstingy
    And that is what you have to argue re the consent fee. Quote your lease very clearly to them and tell them that your lease does not require you to obtain their consent.
    • Nancy Lee
    • By Nancy Lee 13th Jun 17, 8:27 AM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Nancy Lee
    Fee Reduced from £120 to £40 but..........
    I was sent a letter by e&m management asking for
    £130 To register a new tenancy
    £65 To renew an existing tenancy
    £45 Retrospective consent charge
    I wrote to them quoting the cases that went to the tribunal and they replied basically saying the tribunals decision wasn't legally binding, however as a good will gesture they will accept £40 to register the tenancy. However they will not issue a consent certificate for the reduced fee.
    I have 14 days for them to receive their requirements.
    My questions to this forum are;
    Do I need a consent certificate?
    Do I have to pay to renew an existing tenant? If so how can it be £65 when the registration fee is no £40?
    Do I have to pay a retrospective consent charge, and if so how can it be £45?
    Can they charge registration fees for tenancies before they owned the freehold?
    I have tried to phone e&m but they do not answer their phone.
    • eddddy
    • By eddddy 13th Jun 17, 8:57 AM
    • 5,136 Posts
    • 4,789 Thanks
    eddddy
    My questions to this forum are;
    Do I need a consent certificate?
    Do I have to pay to renew an existing tenant? If so how can it be £65 when the registration fee is no £40?
    Do I have to pay a retrospective consent charge, and if so how can it be £45?
    Can they charge registration fees for tenancies before they owned the freehold?
    I have tried to phone e&m but they do not answer their phone.
    Originally posted by Nancy Lee
    It depends on what your lease says and/or what is 'reasonable'.

    The freeholder and leaseholder must each do what the lease says they must do.

    So if the lease says the leaseholder must renew consent every time there is a new tenant/tenancy agreement, then that's what you have to do.

    And any fee charged by the freeholder must be 'reasonable'. Based on the Tribunal case, I imagine that a £40 fee for renewal would be reasonable.
    • sl888
    • By sl888 14th Jun 17, 2:18 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    sl888
    I was sent a letter by e&m management asking for
    £130 To register a new tenancy
    £65 To renew an existing tenancy
    £45 Retrospective consent charge
    I wrote to them quoting the cases that went to the tribunal and they replied basically saying the tribunals decision wasn't legally binding, however as a good will gesture they will accept £40 to register the tenancy. However they will not issue a consent certificate for the reduced fee.
    I have 14 days for them to receive their requirements.
    My questions to this forum are;
    Do I need a consent certificate?
    Do I have to pay to renew an existing tenant? If so how can it be £65 when the registration fee is no £40?
    Do I have to pay a retrospective consent charge, and if so how can it be £45?
    Can they charge registration fees for tenancies before they owned the freehold?
    I have tried to phone e&m but they do not answer their phone.
    Originally posted by Nancy Lee
    Hi Nancy, did you have further info from E&M as I received the same letter and not sure if I should pay, they want to charge 390 for current and 2 previous tenants. Also, any luck in finding out if a consent certificate is needed as I couldn't find any further details online, thanks.
    • Wanderingpomm
    • By Wanderingpomm 14th Jun 17, 2:30 PM
    • 31 Posts
    • 22 Thanks
    Wanderingpomm
    They are taking the !!!!. Tell them you won't pay it and then jointly get a solicitor with all the landlords they are trying to get money from. You have case precedent.
    • squasher
    • By squasher 11th Jul 17, 12:10 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    squasher
    Same request
    I've also had a letter from E&M now on behalf of Proxima GR Properties Ltd (and not Peverill who they once represented) with the same demand for £130 to register a new tenancy, £65 to renew an existing tenancy and £45 for a retrospective consent discharge. Clearly there are anomalies in these various figures in request for payment and it would be very interesting to know what they do to justify these wholly exorbitant sums. The figures they are quoting bear are not representative of the maximum figure assumed by the Tribunal. It would be good to know if many others have had similar correspondence lately.
    • willga
    • By willga 13th Jul 17, 8:57 AM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    willga
    I've received exactly the same letter from E&M - they're obviously looking to milk the cash cow this summer, probably to fund the Tchenguiz brothers' SFO legal bill.

    Is there some form of Group Action Litigation that we can all get behind to defend against this extortion?
    • eddddy
    • By eddddy 13th Jul 17, 11:47 AM
    • 5,136 Posts
    • 4,789 Thanks
    eddddy
    Is there some form of Group Action Litigation that we can all get behind to defend against this extortion?
    Originally posted by willga
    I don't think you need to do anything dramatic like that.

    As I said in post #19, there are Upper Tribunal precedents that say £40 is a reasonable fee - unless your freeholder is incurring greater costs for some reason.

    I would just refer your freeholder to those precedents, and ask them what extra work they are doing to justify the higher fee.

    If you don't think their answer is credible, you can make an 'Application for Determination' to the first tier Tribunal for a £100 fee, I believe.

    (And the Tribunal has the power to make the Freeholder pay you back the £100, if appropriate.)

    Some info: http://www.lease-advice.org/faq/what-can-i-do-if-i-disagree-with-an-administration-charge/
    • Nansen
    • By Nansen 1st Aug 17, 7:59 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Nansen
    Hi folks, I also received the same letter from e&m. Has there been any further news to report since the previous post?
    • Anna.james
    • By Anna.james 11th Aug 17, 3:43 AM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Anna.james
    Also had a letter from e&m demanding 130 for permission to sublet and asking for all previous tenants! From this thread and another one it seems
    1/ it's worth asking them where it states in the lease that you need permission to sublet.
    2/ a number of cases have been raised specifying that a 'reasonable' fee is £40.

    So I guess it's worth contesting. As for previous tenants, they can chase me for that!
    • eddddy
    • By eddddy 11th Aug 17, 9:05 AM
    • 5,136 Posts
    • 4,789 Thanks
    eddddy
    1/ it's worth asking them where it states in the lease that you need permission to sublet.
    Originally posted by Anna.james
    You could read the lease yourself, to see if you need permission to sublet. You only need to challenge the freeholder if you disagree with them.

    As for previous tenants, they can chase me for that!
    Originally posted by Anna.james
    If you mean you plan to ignore Service Charge demands, that may not be a good idea.

    You're likely to start getting things like solicitors letters, and the lease probably states that you will have to pay the solicitor's fees.

    If you have a mortgage, the freeholder might also contact your lender. Your lender might pay the charges in order to protect their investment. (And you might have broken the terms of your mortgage.)
    • scriv
    • By scriv 11th Aug 17, 9:42 AM
    • 80 Posts
    • 59 Thanks
    scriv
    Please.....

    A reminder to all leaseholders with New Build Houses and Flats built since 2005 to please complete the Leasehold Survey mentioned in the MSE Newsletter as Campaign of The Week - and linked on
    Martin's Twitter on this website viz :

    Are you a leaseholder / commonholder pls complete this survey to provide info for the All Party Parliamentary Group https://t.co/jBtZuHldnX

    or alternatively via the post on the MoneySavingExpert Surveys Board at :

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=255

    It is crucial for us leaseholders that as much information as possible about the current situation is submitted to Parliament for its review on Leasehold Reform later this year, hopefully leading to establish a much fairer and more transparent system.


    Thank You
    Last edited by scriv; 11-08-2017 at 9:46 AM.
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

2,212Posts Today

8,212Users online

Martin's Twitter
  • RT @KCMurdarasi: @MartinSLewis Only 2 fluently, but I can struggle by in another 5 or so. And ask the way to the toilet in about 10 - you d?

  • Today's twitter poll: How many languages do you speak (inc Eng) with reasonable fluency (eg can have decent phone chat solely in that lang)

  • RT @iiSteveJonesii: @MartinSLewis After watching you talk this morning about me burning £300 I got on a comparison site tonight & sure enou?

  • Follow Martin