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  • FIRST POST
    • lafferdog
    • By lafferdog 28th Apr 17, 1:50 PM
    • 61Posts
    • 38Thanks
    lafferdog
    SIP Court case help
    • #1
    • 28th Apr 17, 1:50 PM
    SIP Court case help 28th Apr 17 at 1:50 PM
    Hi There,

    I am after some advice or help with a court case I have coming up in June with SIP in manchester.

    Quick overview of the case:
    Last summer I parked at one of their car parks and parked on some cross hatch markings, the markings were worn out to the point of being barley visible, I was in no way blocking anything or anyone in and I have seen cars on them before. There are no other markings in the car park, it is just a load of baron rubble.

    I got a ticket, which on the back said I could appeal, and if the appeal was rejected I could pay £60. So appealed and explained the above. A week or so later I received a letter saying I owed £100, I replied saying I had appealed and resent the appeal. Again this was ignored and a new fine of £150 was sent. At this point I wrote to say they had ignored my appeals and so I was going to ignore them.

    In January I was contacted by Gladstones solicitors who had taken on their case and they wanted £240. Explained everything to them and we are now going to court in June.

    I have no idea what to do with preparing for a court case. I have tried to get free legal help but not had any luck with that so hoping someone here might be able to help me form my case or let me know what I need to do as it would be a nightmare to lose based on anything technical that I don't understand.

    I have applied for mediation, and willing to pay the £60 that was the original fine, but I feel I shouldn't really have to pay anything due to the hassle this is causing. Will have to take a day off work too which is an expense.

    I feel like I have followed all the instructions they offered with the appeal of the ticket, they just seem to hike up the fine at every opportunity and harass and try and scare me to pay up.

    Thanks in advance for any help people can offer.
Page 5
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 13th Jul 17, 3:41 PM
    • 47,975 Posts
    • 61,429 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Hi, I won!

    It felt like the judge was searching for something to help me out, in the end it was the fact they didnt have a map of where their signs were. I said there were none by the parking machine or the entrance and had a photo of the machine with no signs. so he used that to throw it out.

    thanks so much for the help and effort i would have been screwed without it.

    there were 2 in b4 me with sip, it was a member of their staff representing, he seemed to be way out of his depth in the courtroom and I felt pretty confident thanks to the support on here.

    thanks again, i can finally relax!!
    Originally posted by lafferdog
    Hooray! Well done to you!

    Could you tell us which Judge and court, please?

    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • lafferdog
    • By lafferdog 13th Jul 17, 4:09 PM
    • 61 Posts
    • 38 Thanks
    lafferdog
    Court was manchester, Judges name began with m, mavers maybe?

    Claimint rep was Daniel Probert.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 13th Jul 17, 4:18 PM
    • 47,975 Posts
    • 61,429 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Really pleased that other NEWBIES scan see and learn that a brief defence put in by a newbie before coming here, can still be expanded upon at WS stage, and the case can still be won. This was the defence at the start, then the WS and evidence added to it:

    On the xx xx xx I returned to my car to find a ticket issued for parking on the hatched area of the car park. When I left the car I wasn't sure if the hatched area was in use or valid as it was so worn out and parking there wouldn't have caused any obstruction. I asked a couple of other people parking if they thought it was ok to park there and they agreed it looked fine and they had seen cars park there before.

    Further to that there are no markings anywhere in the car park so I assumed they were redundant and not in use. Wrong to assume maybe, but that was the impression I had.

    The ticket offered the opportunity to appeal which I did straight away with photos of the area in question. Around 10 days later I received a letter saying I now owed £100, and there was no acknowledgement of my appeal letter, so I wrote back to say I had appealed and resent the original appeal letter.

    On the xx xx xx I received a letter from Gladstones Solicitors saying I then owed £150. I was away on holiday for 10 days after this, and then returned to find the Claim Form I am responding to now.

    From my point of view I appealed the ticket which I honestly felt was not fair, I have attached images of the hatched area, which I noticed has recently been repainted. If I was to have had my appeal rejected and offered the £60 that is part of their process I would have paid it. However, my letters were ignored and it was escalated to where it is now despite effort on my part to follow their process. The time and effort this has caused me now feels like it out weights any inconvenience I caused leaving my car where I did which is why I would like to dispute the whole amount.

    I have attached all my letters of correspondence and the photos that I took that show the worn out hatched area and that there are no other markings anywhere in the carpark which made me think it was fine to park there.

    Did the person who appeared actually come from SIP parking? An employee? Did he struggle?
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • lafferdog
    • By lafferdog 13th Jul 17, 4:41 PM
    • 61 Posts
    • 38 Thanks
    lafferdog
    I just wanted to add, my overall impression was so different to what I expected. Their representative was a joke, I was surprised how incompetent he came across, it makes me think that they don't really aim or try that hard to win cases but get all their revenue off people who either ignore and lose by default, or they get scared and pay. They must make a fortune and it is a total waste of the courts time.
    • lafferdog
    • By lafferdog 13th Jul 17, 4:44 PM
    • 61 Posts
    • 38 Thanks
    lafferdog
    Really pleased that other NEWBIES scan see and learn that a brief defence put in by a newbie before coming here, can still be expanded upon at WS stage, and the case can still be won. This was the defence at the start, then the WS and evidence added to it:




    Did the person who appeared actually come from SIP parking? An employee? Did he struggle?
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    He was a mess, he seemed a bit shaken up, maybe he had been grilled in the two previous to me. It was close for a second, and I felt he judge was really looking to throw it out, then I had the photo which I hadnt actually submitted as I thought it was irrelevant. But it turned out to be what did it.
    • lafferdog
    • By lafferdog 13th Jul 17, 4:46 PM
    • 61 Posts
    • 38 Thanks
    lafferdog
    He was a mess, he seemed a bit shaken up, maybe he had been grilled in the two previous to me. It was close for a second, and I felt he judge was really looking to throw it out, then I had the photo which I hadnt actually submitted as I thought it was irrelevant. But it turned out to be what did it.
    Originally posted by lafferdog
    sorry and yes an employee I believe, he was the guy that signed the witness statement. Maybe a fulltime in house rep? He had a big mess file thing going on.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 13th Jul 17, 4:50 PM
    • 47,975 Posts
    • 61,429 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Hilarious, I seem to recall SIP staff/reps have been reported as rubbish at hearings, before!

    Waste of your time. Did you ask for your costs for attending, missed leave/salary for a half day?
    Last edited by Coupon-mad; 13-07-2017 at 8:47 PM.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • lafferdog
    • By lafferdog 13th Jul 17, 5:43 PM
    • 61 Posts
    • 38 Thanks
    lafferdog
    Hilarious, I seem to recall SIP ones have been reported as rubbish at hearings, before!

    Waste of your time. Did you ask for your costs for attending, missed leave/salary for a half day?
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    I did ask for costs, I had it itemised out, but the judge was unsure and said it wasnt normal, i pushed and he said I would have to have had a pay check to prove my wage, so gave me travel and materials costs, so only £20 but feels like I am fining them back, so really happy with it. Might just frame the cheque rather than cash it.
    • Redx
    • By Redx 13th Jul 17, 6:03 PM
    • 14,715 Posts
    • 18,485 Thanks
    Redx
    as I have always said about S.I.P

    SIMPLE ? = yes they are , definitely !!

    INTELLIGENT ? = no chance , thick as p wotsit

    Parking ? - more like pillocks if you ask me , lol

    I never , NEVER park in a S.I.P. car park , especially not near the arena or apollo

    congratulations on your win , hope they lost all the rest too
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • Elysander
    • By Elysander 13th Jul 17, 6:25 PM
    • 69 Posts
    • 173 Thanks
    Elysander
    He was a mess, he seemed a bit shaken up, maybe he had been grilled in the two previous to me. It was close for a second, and I felt he judge was really looking to throw it out, then I had the photo which I hadnt actually submitted as I thought it was irrelevant. But it turned out to be what did it.
    Originally posted by lafferdog
    Sounds very like the SIP employee that I saw at Manchester County Court at the end of June. He seemed to be very muddled and confused. He turned up in a very shabby suit that was stained and the hems of his trousers were frayed. . His shirt was too small for him, his belly was bursting out of it!

    Congratulations on your well deserved win. Praise must also go to the regulars who provided you with expert advice!
    • lafferdog
    • By lafferdog 13th Jul 17, 6:38 PM
    • 61 Posts
    • 38 Thanks
    lafferdog
    Sounds very like the SIP employee that I saw at Manchester County Court at the end of June. He seemed to be very muddled and confused. He turned up in a very shabby suit that was stained and the hems of his trousers were frayed. . His shirt was too small for him, his belly was bursting out of it!

    Congratulations on your well deserved win. Praise must also go to the regulars who provided you with expert advice!
    Originally posted by Elysander
    Without the help of this forum I would have been in trouble. can't thank them enough. the effort they put in on here is very inspiring and admirable.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 13th Jul 17, 8:05 PM
    • 13,568 Posts
    • 21,260 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    As an aside - from the SIP website:

    Our services:

    We offer a wide range of different land and parking management services.
    We have more than a hundred different car park, where we perfected our skills.
    Our staff is ready to handle your customers, and our developer team can offer a custom solution for your every problem.
    They have a nice turn of phrase! Semi-literate drivel.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • lafferdog
    • By lafferdog 13th Jul 17, 9:31 PM
    • 61 Posts
    • 38 Thanks
    lafferdog
    As an aside - from the SIP website:


    They have a nice turn of phrase! Semi-literate drivel.
    Originally posted by Umkomaas
    hahaha
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