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    • MSE Callum
    • By MSE Callum 20th Apr 17, 11:41 AM
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    MSE Callum
    MSE News: Tough new penalties for speeding to be rolled out next week
    • #1
    • 20th Apr 17, 11:41 AM
    MSE News: Tough new penalties for speeding to be rolled out next week 20th Apr 17 at 11:41 AM
    Motorists caught driving well over the speed limit will be slapped with fines of up to 175% of their weekly income...
    Read the full story:
    'Tough new penalties for speeding to be rolled out next week'

    Click reply below to discuss. If you haven’t already, join the forum to reply. If you aren’t sure how it all works, read our New to Forum? Intro Guide.
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    • esuhl
    • By esuhl 20th Apr 17, 12:10 PM
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    esuhl
    • #2
    • 20th Apr 17, 12:10 PM
    • #2
    • 20th Apr 17, 12:10 PM
    A slight improvement. I think the "heavy" fines should apply for anyone driving 10mph or more over the speed limit, with double the proposed fines for the excess speeds mentioned in the article.

    So many people drive at illegal speeds that it's almost considered normal. Hopefully the new fines and a police crackdown might improve safety on our roads.
    • Pincher
    • By Pincher 20th Apr 17, 1:07 PM
    • 6,516 Posts
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    Pincher
    • #3
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:07 PM
    • #3
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:07 PM
    There was a section of the M4 near Bristol, which had road side signs saying 50mph MAX, uneven road surface. Everybody ignored it and overtook me.

    If I drove at 70mph, like very body else, that means:

    "Those clocked at 11 to 21 mph over the limit fall into the 'band B' category and can expect to pay between 75% and 125% of their weekly income. Offenders could also face points on their licence."

    What uneven surface? Just normal motorway quality.
    • deaston
    • By deaston 20th Apr 17, 1:08 PM
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    deaston
    • #4
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:08 PM
    • #4
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:08 PM
    The penalties are pointless when there's no-one enforcing the limits.

    Most people drive the same routes day to day and quickly become familiar with the positions of the fixed (and clearly visible) speed cameras. The rest of the journey it's foot to the floor knowing the chances of a police officer actually seeing you are close to zero.
    • shaun from Africa
    • By shaun from Africa 20th Apr 17, 1:18 PM
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    shaun from Africa
    • #5
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:18 PM
    • #5
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:18 PM
    I just wish that the police would spend a little bit more time and effort targeting the increasing number of drivers who seem to thing that it's perfectly okay to drive through a red traffic light providing that it's only been red for a second or two.

    There are a couple of large roundabouts near to where I live and both of these are controlled by traffic lights.
    Almost without fail, whenever I'm at one of these roundabouts I will see a driver going through a red light often at a fair speed.
    There are no cameras there but there are a couple of areas where an unmarked police car could easily stop and have a good view of most of the lights and I'm sure they would catch a great many offenders each day.

    However, the revenue gained from speeding motorists must be more attractive, even if some of these motorists may only be a few mph over the limit but still driving perfectly safely for the conditions and traffic at the time.
    • kathrynha
    • By kathrynha 20th Apr 17, 1:28 PM
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    kathrynha
    • #6
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:28 PM
    • #6
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:28 PM
    There was a section of the M4 near Bristol, which had road side signs saying 50mph MAX, uneven road surface. Everybody ignored it and overtook me.

    If I drove at 70mph, like very body else, that means:

    "Those clocked at 11 to 21 mph over the limit fall into the 'band B' category and can expect to pay between 75% and 125% of their weekly income. Offenders could also face points on their licence."

    What uneven surface? Just normal motorway quality.
    Originally posted by Pincher

    They definitely need to sort out some speed limits that are silly. There is a stretch of road near me, dual carriageway with bus lanes, so 3 lanes each way, not a residential area, and it's a 30 zone. Really frustrating as it would be totally safe at 40 or even 60mph.

    I just wish that the police would spend a little bit more time and effort targeting the increasing number of drivers who seem to thing that it's perfectly okay to drive through a red traffic light providing that it's only been red for a second or two.

    There are a couple of large roundabouts near to where I live and both of these are controlled by traffic lights.
    Almost without fail, whenever I'm at one of these roundabouts I will see a driver going through a red light often at a fair speed.
    There are no cameras there but there are a couple of areas where an unmarked police car could easily stop and have a good view of most of the lights and I'm sure they would catch a great many offenders each day.

    However, the revenue gained from speeding motorists must be more attractive, even if some of these motorists may only be a few mph over the limit but still driving perfectly safely for the conditions and traffic at the time.
    Originally posted by shaun from Africa
    I have noticed a growing trend for people going through red lights too. Have quite a collection of dashcam footage of it.
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    • theburningcat
    • By theburningcat 20th Apr 17, 1:37 PM
    • 176 Posts
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    theburningcat
    • #7
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:37 PM
    • #7
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:37 PM
    So are the standard £100+3 points through-the-letterbox fines going and will this only apply to convictions at court?

    I'm all for more enforcement on stretches of road with sensible speed limits but I think too many stretches of road have stupidly low (and also sometimes stupidly high) limits.

    Consider the very high number of motorways that are 50mph (when the workers have gone home), dual carriageways that others have mentioned, slow movement from 30mpg to 20mph in residential areas and the fact 70mph is a very low national speed limit by international standards.
    • Car 54
    • By Car 54 20th Apr 17, 1:37 PM
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    Car 54
    • #8
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:37 PM
    • #8
    • 20th Apr 17, 1:37 PM
    There was a section of the M4 near Bristol, which had road side signs saying 50mph MAX, uneven road surface. Everybody ignored it and overtook me.

    If I drove at 70mph, like very body else, that means:

    "Those clocked at 11 to 21 mph over the limit fall into the 'band B' category and can expect to pay between 75% and 125% of their weekly income. Offenders could also face points on their licence."

    What uneven surface? Just normal motorway quality.
    Originally posted by Pincher
    Those signs are advisory only, and can't be enforced.
    • Reaper
    • By Reaper 20th Apr 17, 4:45 PM
    • 6,085 Posts
    • 4,125 Thanks
    Reaper
    • #9
    • 20th Apr 17, 4:45 PM
    • #9
    • 20th Apr 17, 4:45 PM
    The police and government are obsessed with speed and only speed. Frankly if I drive 90mph on an empty motorway I am much less of a danger than the driver doing 70mph a few feet from the car in front.

    It would be simple to make a machine that looks for such tailgating but they can't think beyond speed as the only cause of accidents.
    • phillw
    • By phillw 20th Apr 17, 5:14 PM
    • 611 Posts
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    phillw
    The penalties are pointless when there's no-one enforcing the limits.

    Most people drive the same routes day to day and quickly become familiar with the positions of the fixed (and clearly visible) speed cameras. The rest of the journey it's foot to the floor knowing the chances of a police officer actually seeing you are close to zero.
    Originally posted by deaston
    Speed on it's own rarely causes accidents and it's not even the cause in the majority of accidents that involve death. Police have more worthwhile things to do than enforce stupid speed restrictions.

    If anyone was seriously interested in getting people to slow down they wouldn't just be putting up cameras. They won't for example put up 30 mph speed limit signs, instead you have to be aware of the distance between street lights (which don't have to be visible). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Built-up_area_(Highway_Code)

    The A303 has sections where the central reservation disappears but is still multiple lanes in both directions, the money they've made from that would pay for the central reservation to be fitted all the way but it would stop their revenue stream.

    According to a survey we break on average 5 rules a week.
    Last edited by phillw; 20-04-2017 at 5:22 PM.
    • VT82
    • By VT82 21st Apr 17, 9:16 AM
    • 919 Posts
    • 734 Thanks
    VT82
    They definitely need to sort out some speed limits that are silly. There is a stretch of road near me, dual carriageway with bus lanes, so 3 lanes each way, not a residential area, and it's a 30 zone. Really frustrating as it would be totally safe at 40 or even 60mph.
    Originally posted by kathrynha
    A34 near Walsall by any chance? Ridiculous. And it's downhill in one direction too - you have to brake quite sharply just to not break the speed limit through gravity alone!
    • Car 54
    • By Car 54 21st Apr 17, 9:43 AM
    • 2,017 Posts
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    Car 54
    If anyone was seriously interested in getting people to slow down they wouldn't just be putting up cameras. They won't for example put up 30 mph speed limit signs, instead you have to be aware of the distance between street lights (which don't have to be visible).
    Originally posted by phillw
    If you mean repeater signs, these are specifically forbidden on restricted roads - the presence of street lighting is the sign.

    You don't need to judge the distance - examples of street lights more than 200 yards apart are rare if not non-existent.
    • Gettingtherequickly
    • By Gettingtherequickly 21st Apr 17, 10:54 AM
    • 3,389 Posts
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    Gettingtherequickly
    Our local council has forced 20MPH limits in my area, it went out to public consultation & vote and went through with a miniscule majority. Not a single person I know agreed with it, a) because it is virtually impossible to drive at less than 20 & b) it is going to be detrimental to health because of pollution. Apparently, it didn't matter how we voted, the council was going to put it through anyway, which probably explains the result.

    I must correct myself on being unable to drive at less than 20 MPH. I got caught behind someone one night last week who didn't exceed 15 MPH & dropped to 5 at each speed bump, which was deeply frustrating & resulted in someone overtaking both cars. As the traffic was on a diversion, this was a virtual stop 20 times before we went in different directions, that cannot be healthy!
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    • esuhl
    • By esuhl 21st Apr 17, 12:13 PM
    • 7,365 Posts
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    esuhl
    Our local council has forced 20MPH limits in my area, it went out to public consultation & vote and went through with a miniscule majority. Not a single person I know agreed with it, a) because it is virtually impossible to drive at less than 20...
    Originally posted by Gettingtherequickly
    Ha ha! Pull the other one! If you hadn't corrected yourself in the subsequent paragraph, I'd say you were desperately in need of some driving lessons.
    • Johno100
    • By Johno100 21st Apr 17, 12:31 PM
    • 2,854 Posts
    • 3,064 Thanks
    Johno100
    Our local council has forced 20MPH limits in my area, it went out to public consultation & vote and went through with a miniscule majority. Not a single person I know agreed with it, a) because it is virtually impossible to drive at less than 20 & b) it is going to be detrimental to health because of pollution. Apparently, it didn't matter how we voted, the council was going to put it through anyway, which probably explains the result.
    Originally posted by Gettingtherequickly
    Ditto around here. The 'consultation' actually went 59% against blanket 20mph limits but they carried on regardless because a) "drivers were over represented in the responses" and seemingly other 'stakeholders' views were more important b) the respondents who were against were apparently too thick to understand what was planned and why c) That was what they planned to do all along (the online consultation actually had '20 is Plenty' emblazoned at the top of each page).
    • HornetSaver
    • By HornetSaver 21st Apr 17, 1:55 PM
    • 1,865 Posts
    • 2,938 Thanks
    HornetSaver
    The police and government are obsessed with speed and only speed. Frankly if I drive 90mph on an empty motorway I am much less of a danger than the driver doing 70mph a few feet from the car in front.

    It would be simple to make a machine that looks for such tailgating but they can't think beyond speed as the only cause of accidents.
    Originally posted by Reaper
    Road safety laws have to be designed to be simple enough for morons to understand, because the majority of drivers fit said description.

    "Faster than this, you get fined" is simple enough for them to understand.

    "Drive within this distance of the car in front whilst travelling at this speed and in these conditions, and you get fined" is not.
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    • chucknorris
    • By chucknorris 21st Apr 17, 4:23 PM
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    chucknorris
    Has anyone seen a definition of 'weekly income', I googled it, but nothing came up (hands up, admittedly I didn't look particularly hard for it).
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    • EssexExile
    • By EssexExile 21st Apr 17, 5:26 PM
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    EssexExile
    Has anyone seen a definition of 'weekly income', I googled it, but nothing came up (hands up, admittedly I didn't look particularly hard for it).
    Originally posted by chucknorris
    I can't remember the details but when you go to court you fill in a form giving your income & list some outgoings. Different magistrates view different expenses as "essential" so have different views on your "available" income. It always amazed me that someone is in court for breaking the law & they are expected to be honest on the form! I've never known it be checked.
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    • Tarambor
    • By Tarambor 21st Apr 17, 5:35 PM
    • 877 Posts
    • 585 Thanks
    Tarambor
    There was a section of the M4 near Bristol, which had road side signs saying 50mph MAX, uneven road surface. Everybody ignored it and overtook me.
    Originally posted by Pincher
    Depends on what format the sign was in. The only legally enforceable one is a white round circle with a red border (no need for white background on motorway matrix but must be circle with red border) and the speed limit on it. Anything else is merely advisory and can be ignored. So if it was an overhead matrix that just said "50 Uneven road surface" then you can ignore it. However if that 50 was in a circle with a red border then that was the legal speed limit at that point.

    Legally enforceable





    Can be ignored as only advisory



    • EssexExile
    • By EssexExile 21st Apr 17, 5:48 PM
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    EssexExile
    Has anyone seen a definition of 'weekly income', I googled it, but nothing came up (hands up, admittedly I didn't look particularly hard for it).
    Originally posted by chucknorris
    Here you go:

    https://formfinder.hmctsformfinder.justice.gov.uk/mc100-eng.pdf
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