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  • FIRST POST
    • Bellyson
    • By Bellyson 19th Apr 17, 8:32 PM
    • 7Posts
    • 0Thanks
    Bellyson
    Property plan question
    • #1
    • 19th Apr 17, 8:32 PM
    Property plan question 19th Apr 17 at 8:32 PM
    Hello, this is my first post here, and I am sorry if this has been asked before.
    We are selling our flat and there have been a couple of issues with items and areas not being included in the lease document. Therefore, our conveyancer has said we need to have a Plan drawn up to show our floor plan and inclusions (ie. rear courtyard) to allow a Deed of Variation to be done. It is a first floor flat over a shop.

    Can anyone advise if a surveyor does this plan? And if so, what is the approximate cost? Should it take very long? We have been waiting so long to sell the property, and things are going so slowly.
    Thanks so much for any info!
Page 1
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 19th Apr 17, 8:48 PM
    • 3,261 Posts
    • 4,528 Thanks
    Cakeguts
    • #2
    • 19th Apr 17, 8:48 PM
    • #2
    • 19th Apr 17, 8:48 PM
    Who owns the rear courtyard now? You don't because it is not in your lease.
    • Bellyson
    • By Bellyson 19th Apr 17, 9:04 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Bellyson
    • #3
    • 19th Apr 17, 9:04 PM
    • #3
    • 19th Apr 17, 9:04 PM
    It is not on any lease at the moment. When we bought the property, it was included in the sale. That is why solicitor is doing a Deed of Variation to have it added to the lease.
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 19th Apr 17, 9:08 PM
    • 3,261 Posts
    • 4,528 Thanks
    Cakeguts
    • #4
    • 19th Apr 17, 9:08 PM
    • #4
    • 19th Apr 17, 9:08 PM
    It is not on any lease at the moment. When we bought the property, it was included in the sale. That is why solicitor is doing a Deed of Variation to have it added to the lease.
    Originally posted by Bellyson
    It can't have been included in the sale because that would have meant that the person who sold it to you would have had to have a deed of variation in order to sell it to you. The person who sold you the flat can only sell you what was included in their lease. A deed of variation adds something that is not included in the lease to be included. So if there wasn't a deed of variation when you bought the property your sellers could not sell it to you because they didn't have it in their lease. Also you haven't bought it because your sellers couldn't sell you something they didn't own or wasn't included in their lease.

    So back to the original question who owns the courtyard? You don't because you couldn't buy it from someone else who didn't own it.
    Last edited by Cakeguts; 20-04-2017 at 10:30 AM.
    • Bellyson
    • By Bellyson 19th Apr 17, 9:20 PM
    • 7 Posts
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    Bellyson
    • #5
    • 19th Apr 17, 9:20 PM
    • #5
    • 19th Apr 17, 9:20 PM
    Well if we don't own it, I don't know who does! We have an external staircase which leads down to the courtyard. The area is totally fenced off from any other property.

    If we don't own it, we bought the property under false pretences then, as it was indicated that the courtyard was part of the sale. Either the agent or the solicitor for the sale surely should have known this?
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 19th Apr 17, 10:00 PM
    • 3,261 Posts
    • 4,528 Thanks
    Cakeguts
    • #6
    • 19th Apr 17, 10:00 PM
    • #6
    • 19th Apr 17, 10:00 PM
    Well if we don't own it, I don't know who does! We have an external staircase which leads down to the courtyard. The area is totally fenced off from any other property.

    If we don't own it, we bought the property under false pretences then, as it was indicated that the courtyard was part of the sale. Either the agent or the solicitor for the sale surely should have known this?
    Originally posted by Bellyson
    Was the courtyard on the plan for the lease that you bought? Because if it was included in your lease it would have been described in your lease and it would have been on the plan of your lease. You can only sell what is in your lease. Someone can only sell you what is included in their lease.

    Who owns the freehold of your building? Who owns the lease of the shop? Is there a back door for the shop that would give access onto that courtyard? The courtyard land must be either included into the lease of the shop or be freehold land owned by the freeholder if is not in your lease someone else must own it.

    When you bought the flat what did it say in the legal documents about the courtyard? Not what the estate agent said but in the legal documents that showed what you were buying?
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 19th Apr 17, 10:02 PM
    • 3,261 Posts
    • 4,528 Thanks
    Cakeguts
    • #7
    • 19th Apr 17, 10:02 PM
    • #7
    • 19th Apr 17, 10:02 PM
    When you read your lease what does it say is included in the lease? What is included in the lease from the people you bought from is what you bought.
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