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  • FIRST POST
    • bluep
    • By bluep 10th Apr 17, 7:05 PM
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    bluep
    eBay purchase arrived damaged. How exposed am I?
    • #1
    • 10th Apr 17, 7:05 PM
    eBay purchase arrived damaged. How exposed am I? 10th Apr 17 at 7:05 PM
    Bought a high value camera from eBay, paid via Paypal (underlying from credit card). Asked the seller to package really well! He has one other recent feedback about packaging poorly.

    I came back from a work trip and it had arrived in a jiffy bag (a couple of days before) that had split open where the brown tape had come away from the jiffy bag (as it was so full it was fit to burst) and then been pushed shut back together again. My mother signed for it as it looked closed. When I opened it, it came open very easily and the camera, lens and charger were loose in the jiffy bag with some loose bubble wrap stuffed back in. I turned the camera on and low and behold, the screen had been smashed. Seller says it was fine when he dispatched. In all honesty it looks like it has come open in transit due to poor packaging and the camera fallen out of the bubble wrap and a courier gone "oops" and just stuffed it all back in and pressed the brown tape closed again.

    Have opened an eBay return and sent numerous pictures of the jiffy bag and contents and damage. Seller has essentially said "so let me get this straight, you want me to receive back a camera that no longer works and pay you to return it to me" and that he'll come back to me within a week. I've outlined eBay's process and explained the issue that it was damaged upon receipt and that's his responsibility as the seller to package adequately and send by an appropriate delivery service. I also said that if it's been damaged in transit then he is the only one that can take that up with the courier. I've said he either sends me a prepaid label or after a certain date, eBay will. I spoke to eBay and they said my case looks strong given the photos and how it was sent but that I have to wait another week until they will step in, provide a label for me to return and then make a decision about a refund.

    If in the meantime he empties his paypal account, where do I stand with eBay - will they refund me under buyer protection anyway as I've done everything by the book and then pursue him for the funds? It was over £500.

    The camera itself is broken, but the other bits seem undamaged (worth £300) so I did say to the buyer that we can work out a part refund and part return - it's up to him. I'm trying my best to be reasonable but worried that I will end up out of pocket - how exposed am I given eBay's, Paypal's and credit card protection? Anyone been in a similar situation?
    Last edited by bluep; 10-04-2017 at 7:08 PM.
Page 2
    • soolin
    • By soolin 16th Apr 17, 9:47 AM
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    soolin
    Ok, so surprise surprise no returns label has materialised. I can now ask eBay to step in and help. Here's the issue - the address on the eBay order is in one town north of London but the address the seller has asked me to return to in their last message is clearly elsewhere south of London.

    Now I know I could just say it's their problem, eBay will give me a return label for the address on their account but it's an expensive lot of kit and I don't want the hassle of it going by courier to the wrong address - especially if no one is there to sign for it.
    Originally posted by bluep
    eBay will supply the label based on the address that eBay gave them, if you use any other address your return will not be covered. If the label shows the address as different to the one eBay supply phone eBay, explain seller has a different address and ask them to confirm that you are covered immediately you can prove postage to the address on the label.

    Even do it via live chat for a 2 nd time so you get a transcript of the conversation. You do not have to prove delivery to the seller to get your refund, all you need to do is prove an attempt has been made at delivery- so to make yourself happy do an address look up, make sure the label address actually exists (this is an easy thing to do) even check what sort of premises it is. As long as the address exists and RM or the courier can annex of to deliver the problem then becomes the sellers problem.

    Lastly, as I can tell you are panicking, keep all screen conversation, keep a screen grab of label and eBay instructions telling you to return, even keep a screen grab of selling page showing sellers address. Then you have recourse via small claims, but it shouldn't come to that.

    EDUT: there is also a very good chance that eBay will refund you immediately on escalation and tell you to keep the item, especially if you report the address issues. In that case take the refund, notify your seller that they have 30 days to arrange collection of their item after which you will arrange disposal. They can then either send a tracked label or make other arrangements to collect at your convenience.
    I'm the Board Guide for the Ebay Board , Charities Board , Dosh & Disability , Up Your Income and the Local MoneySaving-England board which means I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move posts there. However, do remember, board guides don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this). Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com
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    • bluep
    • By bluep 16th Apr 17, 10:13 AM
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    bluep
    Thanks for the reponse. It's camera gear worth £600 so I am trying to make sure nothing goes wrong. Unlikely eBay will refund and tell me to keep it!

    The address on the sellers eBay account is a flat in oxford. When he accepted the return, he sent a message via eBay messages asking me to return it to a house in Woking (presumably because the return thread wouldn't allow any more messages once the return had been accepted). I have no idea if it's because he has moved or if both addresses are still valid but I know I don't want any issues about sending to somewhere where he isn't.

    I thought if he sent a prepaid label then that would remove the problem as I could demonstrate I sent it where he wanted. The issue is if eBay generate the label then surely they'll go off of the address on the account?
    • theonlywayisup
    • By theonlywayisup 16th Apr 17, 11:00 AM
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    theonlywayisup
    Thanks for the reponse. It's camera gear worth £600 so I am trying to make sure nothing goes wrong. Unlikely eBay will refund and tell me to keep it!

    The address on the sellers eBay account is a flat in oxford. When he accepted the return, he sent a message via eBay messages asking me to return it to a house in Woking (presumably because the return thread wouldn't allow any more messages once the return had been accepted). I have no idea if it's because he has moved or if both addresses are still valid but I know I don't want any issues about sending to somewhere where he isn't.

    I thought if he sent a prepaid label then that would remove the problem as I could demonstrate I sent it where he wanted. The issue is if eBay generate the label then surely they'll go off of the address on the account?
    Originally posted by bluep
    If he sent a prepaid label, he would have full control. As he hasn't, then the Ebay label will take priority.

    You could reply to his message along those lines. He can still provide you a label.
    • bluep
    • By bluep 16th Apr 17, 1:43 PM
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    bluep
    I've sent him a message stating the issue with the discrepancy around the eBay address and the address he has provided. I also said that as he hasn't provided a pre-paid postage label I am going to ask eBay to step in therefore he needs to make sure that his ebay account reflects the appropriate address for the return as that is the one they will use.

    He's been a bit rubbish at responding to messages though so I'm kind of stuck at the moment. I REALLY don't want to send it (even with eBay's label) to an old address as it's worth so much money and it could go missing or the couriers return it.
    • bluep
    • By bluep 18th Apr 17, 5:19 PM
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    bluep
    So still no response from the seller. I escalated to eBay and they are sending me a prepaid label. They will not do this for any other address than registered to his account and according to them he apparently is unable to change it now. So they said return it to that address and it's his responsibility to go get it. They will refund me as soon as it's delivered. If it gets returned to me by the courier as undelivered then they said I'd get a refund anyway. I'm nervous about doing this but the seller has not been cooperative at all and I can't see what else I can do. If I were him I'd be might cheesed about such a valuable item being sent like 3 hours away. I'm going to write on the parcel DO NOt LEAVE WITH NEIGHBOUR. ADDRESSEE ONLY.
    • soolin
    • By soolin 18th Apr 17, 5:28 PM
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    soolin
    So still no response from the seller. I escalated to eBay and they are sending me a prepaid label. They will not do this for any other address than registered to his account and according to them he apparently is unable to change it now. So they said return it to that address and it's his responsibility to go get it. They will refund me as soon as it's delivered. If it gets returned to me by the courier as undelivered then they said I'd get a refund anyway. I'm nervous about doing this but the seller has not been cooperative at all and I can't see what else I can do. If I were him I'd be might cheesed about such a valuable item being sent like 3 hours away. I'm going to write on the parcel DO NOt LEAVE WITH NEIGHBOUR. ADDRESSEE ONLY.
    Originally posted by bluep
    I can only carry on saying what I have said before, you do not need to prove delivery, only an attempt at delivery. So if a neighbour takes it in that is the sellers problem not yours.

    However, if you prefer not to follow the advice of random people on the Internet , and I don't blame you, then read the rules on eBay yourself or use Live chat and get them to confirm that you will get a refund as soon as any attempt at delivery is made.
    I'm the Board Guide for the Ebay Board , Charities Board , Dosh & Disability , Up Your Income and the Local MoneySaving-England board which means I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move posts there. However, do remember, board guides don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this). Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com
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    • bluep
    • By bluep 18th Apr 17, 6:41 PM
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    bluep
    As I said in my post, I am following eBay's advice that is the same as ours. And I wouldn't do anything else - the seller has just messaged me to insist I return it to his other address and he will take it for testin and repair and then refund me. I have very firmly said no and either he provides me with a prepaid label today for his other address or I will be sending it with eBay's label to his registered account address. He just isn't understanding how this works so my sympathy for his £600 camera set ending up with some stranger is starting to wane.
    • iammumtoone
    • By iammumtoone 18th Apr 17, 6:46 PM
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    iammumtoone
    As I said in my post, I am following eBay's advice that is the same as ours. And I wouldn't do anything else - the seller has just messaged me to insist I return it to his other address and he will take it for testin and repair and then refund me. I have very firmly said no and either he provides me with a prepaid label today for his other address or I will be sending it with eBay's label to his registered account address. He just isn't understanding how this works so my sympathy for his £600 camera set ending up with some stranger is starting to wane.
    Originally posted by bluep
    DO NOT send it to any other address than the one on the ebay records.

    If he has moved any didn't update his details that is his fault not yours.
    Sealed pot challenge ~ 10 #017
    Declutter 2017 items in 2017 - 78/2017

    • soolin
    • By soolin 18th Apr 17, 6:46 PM
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    soolin
    As I said in my post, I am following eBay's advice that is the same as ours. And I wouldn't do anything else - the seller has just messaged me to insist I return it to his other address and he will take it for testin and repair and then refund me. I have very firmly said no and either he provides me with a prepaid label today for his other address or I will be sending it with eBay's label to his registered account address. He just isn't understanding how this works so my sympathy for his £600 camera set ending up with some stranger is starting to wane.
    Originally posted by bluep
    Why are you asking seller to send you a label with a different address? The ebay label is the one you need to have the tracking show as an attempted delivery, if seller sends you another one now what are you going to do then, just risk it and post and gamble he will suddenly turn nice and refund you?
    I'm the Board Guide for the Ebay Board , Charities Board , Dosh & Disability , Up Your Income and the Local MoneySaving-England board which means I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move posts there. However, do remember, board guides don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this). Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com
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    • jpsartre
    • By jpsartre 18th Apr 17, 7:18 PM
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    jpsartre
    You're greatly overthinking this. Follow Ebay's instructions and return the item using the label they have provided.
    • theonlywayisup
    • By theonlywayisup 18th Apr 17, 10:01 PM
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    theonlywayisup
    As I said in my post, I am following eBay's advice that is the same as ours. And I wouldn't do anything else - the seller has just messaged me to insist I return it to his other address and he will take it for testin and repair and then refund me. I have very firmly said no and either he provides me with a prepaid label today for his other address or I will be sending it with eBay's label to his registered account address. He just isn't understanding how this works so my sympathy for his £600 camera set ending up with some stranger is starting to wane.
    Originally posted by bluep
    If you now use his label you may find that eBay don't refund you. If they have supplied a label you should use it and there will be NO dispute about the delivery address as it's tough luck on him.

    Ask yourself this. If he was so adamant he wanted it to his abc address, why didn't he supply a label when he had the opportunity, all 8 days of opportunity.

    If you ignore ebay's label now that it has been escalated then do so at your peril. You will not be guaranteed to get your money back. Any of it.
    • I have spoken
    • By I have spoken 18th Apr 17, 10:41 PM
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    I have spoken
    >Follow Ebay's instructions and return the item using the label they have provided.>

    This. Ebay's system are now well integrated into the carrier's and their systems will pick-up the item has been handed to the courier IF you use the label they provided.
    Last edited by I have spoken; 18-04-2017 at 10:47 PM.
    • bluep
    • By bluep 19th Apr 17, 4:08 AM
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    bluep
    Thanks guys. This was eBay's instructions - they said that the seller can now not update his address and the only way to send it to the addressing for me to still be covered is that he wants is for him to provide a prepaid label. eBay haven't sent me the label yet so I'm not subverting their process and even if he did send through his own label now I would triple check with eBay that I was still covered before using that.

    He is in the legal business from his Facebook profile so IF the camera goes missing and he ends up £600 down then I want to have a lovely paper trail that shows I have been reasonable and followed the right process incase I end up in small claims court.

    Hopefully eBay's label will arrive soon - they said today but nothing has come through.
    • theonlywayisup
    • By theonlywayisup 19th Apr 17, 6:55 AM
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    theonlywayisup
    Just be mindful that eBay reps will tell you all sorts of things just to get you off the phone/chat.

    You should use the eBay label if they issue one.

    This is all far much easier than small claims, which won't guarantee your money back even if you win.
    • bluep
    • By bluep 19th Apr 17, 7:52 AM
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    bluep
    Ok thanks - I hadn't realised eBay reps weren't reliable. I will chase a label from them today. I fully intend to get my refund from eBay not go to small claims court but I suspect that if eBay were to give me a refund AND the seller didn't get his camera back due to the address issue (someone else signing for it etc...), that he wouldnt leave the matter there.
    • Enterprise 1701C
    • By Enterprise 1701C 19th Apr 17, 8:32 AM
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    Enterprise 1701C
    I am not an ebayer, I avoid selling on ebay but I do buy from there.

    I just thought I would say that if I tried to return something to someone and it was undelivered and returned to me, AFTER getting the refund I would do as someone said previously and send them a message, more likely a recorded delivery letter, possibly to both addresses in this instance, stating that they had 30 days to either have it picked up or to provide an appropriate pre-paid label for delivery, and state in the letter that if it neither is done then the item will be disposed of.

    At that point it will then be yours to dispose of as you will, or otherwise.
    What is this life if, full of care, we have no time to stand and stare
    • theonlywayisup
    • By theonlywayisup 19th Apr 17, 9:25 AM
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    theonlywayisup
    Ok thanks - I hadn't realised eBay reps weren't reliable. I will chase a label from them today. I fully intend to get my refund from eBay not go to small claims court but I suspect that if eBay were to give me a refund AND the seller didn't get his camera back due to the address issue (someone else signing for it etc...), that he wouldnt leave the matter there.
    Originally posted by bluep
    The address issue was caused by him.
    • bluep
    • By bluep 1st May 17, 9:09 AM
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    bluep
    I'm still struggling to get this one resolved.

    eBay suspended the case for 5 days (in order to contact the seller and clarify the address issue). He did not send a prepaid label. eBay won't issue a prepaid label either due to the address issue. This was a week ago.

    I've spoken to customer services twice over the last three days -first agent said the case was being closed in my favour and a refund within 48 hours and then I can liaise independently with the seller to arrange return. Second agent (2 days later) says it's not closed but is likely to be closed in my favour and a refund within 3-5 days. Feels like I can't believe what any of them say!

    Meanwhile, seller is sending increasingly strong emails saying the delay in return means he is unable to claim from the courier and I have therefore caused him financial loss. I've not responded at the moment but as I've said before, the way they are worded sounds like a noddy attempt to "record" things in case he wanted to go to small claims court.
    • jpsartre
    • By jpsartre 1st May 17, 11:00 AM
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    jpsartre

    Meanwhile, seller is sending increasingly strong emails saying the delay in return means he is unable to claim from the courier and I have therefore caused him financial loss.
    Originally posted by bluep
    If the case is dragging out because the seller didn't have the correct address on file with Ebay that's hardly your fault.
    • bluep
    • By bluep 1st May 17, 1:29 PM
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    bluep
    None of it is my fault - I'm following eBay's protocol exactly. As it happens, the refund has just come through. Going to now give him 30 days to arrange collection or prepaid return delivery if he wants it back.
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