Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • Wandering
    • By Wandering 20th Mar 17, 9:57 PM
    • 4Posts
    • 0Thanks
    Wandering
    CCJ - Tenancy
    • #1
    • 20th Mar 17, 9:57 PM
    CCJ - Tenancy 20th Mar 17 at 9:57 PM
    Good Evening All. I have a court date tomorrow for a set aside relating to a tenancy from 2 years ago. The property in question had a leaking roof in the main bedroom (3 Bed Terrace), Electrics - estate agents own electrician informed us they were not safe and gave an estimate, Bathroom had a soil pipe leaking and as a result caused bathroom wall to become saturated - more so when raining. I gave the estate agents nearly 3 months to rectify. Didn't do anything so I invoked term in tenancy that house has not habitable. A few months later he applied for CCJ for unpaid rent. I did try to defend the claim however I didn't write on the bottom of the defence ... I believe these to be a true account ..etc. as a result I was debarred from defending!! I naively thought that would be the end but no he has now applied for warrent of execution. I have contacted stepchange with regards to this matter as I simply don't have the sort of money requested. They informed me to apply for a set aside so that I can have a chance to defend. Hence tomorrow I have this hearing. Just wanted to know what happens in these hearings and also My contract was never with the estate agents it was an assured short hold tenancy between myself and the landlord with the usual estate agents taking a fee etc. I'm I write in thinking that there was never any contract between myself and the estate agent?

    THanks
Page 1
    • deannatrois
    • By deannatrois 20th Mar 17, 10:43 PM
    • 4,676 Posts
    • 6,619 Thanks
    deannatrois
    • #2
    • 20th Mar 17, 10:43 PM
    • #2
    • 20th Mar 17, 10:43 PM
    I don't mean this unkindly but there is a lesson to learn from what has been learned, get advice before you 'assume' anything relating to a tenancy.

    Mistake 1: Notify the LL in WRITING that a repair is needed, give them a time to carry out repair, informing them that if the repair is not carried out within say 14 days you will do it yourself and deduct the money from the rent (see Shelters advice on what to do when repairs aren't completed by a LL https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/repairs/what_to_do_if_your_landlord_wont_do_repairs).

    Mistake 2: Deciding that the property was uninhabitable. It may have seemed uninhabitable to you, but until someone official like environmental health declare it uninhabitable, it is still legally inhabitable. So rent is owed for the full term of the tenancy still. Did you even try to negotiate with the LL? Do you have proof of this?

    Mistake 3: Thinking that once you'd moved out, the LL would forget about you. If they left the repair issues you describe, they aren't a 'decent' LL with reasonable morals.

    Mistake 4: Not getting good advice on how to fight such a case in court. Not even phoning Shelter, not even a one hour session with a solicitor. So a simple omission ensured you had no chance of getting a judgement. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sworn_declaration for your two options to guarantee a statement will be viewed as evidence in court (like you, I learned this the hard way).

    Mistake 5: Assuming that the LL would forget about it again after he/she went to the trouble of getting a CCJ. Most unlikely. Left you very vulnerable.

    Mistake 6: Not getting legal advice once again when trying to get this judgement set aside.

    Mistake 7: Posting on here for advice, the night before your appearance in court - so there is no time at all to do anything about your lack of evidence that the court will accept.

    Mistake 8: google is your friend, use it.

    You may get lucky, you may get a 'friendly' judge, but its not overly likely. Unfortunately you signed a tenancy agreement and did not provide or possess reason that the court will accept that the property was uninhabitable. I suspect the same premise will exist now.

    The only thing you might be able to do is either see a duty solicitor when you arrive at the court tomorrow, explore what options you have, if any. On what grounds are you asking for this judgement to be set aside? Are you sure its a legally valid argument?

    Learn from this.

    Just in case, take a budget, ask for time to pay. Take evidence of income and outgoings with you.
    Last edited by deannatrois; 20-03-2017 at 10:58 PM.
    • Miss Samantha
    • By Miss Samantha 20th Mar 17, 11:14 PM
    • 1,177 Posts
    • 1,122 Thanks
    Miss Samantha
    • #3
    • 20th Mar 17, 11:14 PM
    • #3
    • 20th Mar 17, 11:14 PM
    In general the 'set aside' procedure (which has already cost you £255 to apply) is for special cases. What will be your argument?
    • G_M
    • By G_M 20th Mar 17, 11:15 PM
    • 40,516 Posts
    • 46,345 Thanks
    G_M
    • #4
    • 20th Mar 17, 11:15 PM
    • #4
    • 20th Mar 17, 11:15 PM
    What a sad list deanatrois.

    I was going to try being more positive but as I read through your list I realised how right you were. And at this late stage......?
    • Wandering
    • By Wandering 20th Mar 17, 11:23 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Wandering
    • #5
    • 20th Mar 17, 11:23 PM
    • #5
    • 20th Mar 17, 11:23 PM
    The legal advice that I had was that the argument will be that my defence should have been allowed as I was unaware that I had to write the statement of truth. The court documents have now been changed and include this on the bottom of the forms. As a side issue the reason I didn't deal with this better as I had buried my head in the sand having had some serious health issues ( serious heart condition). In reply to an earlier post, I did consult with both environmental health - still have the letters and shelter. I took shelters advice and informed the landlord that they had breeched the tenancy and subsequently wrote to them again to inform of them of this fact. I had all my evidence in chronological order with help from shelter. I followed all their instructions to the tee. I took several hundered photos tried negotiating with the LL. the problem is I'm too nice for my own good sometimes.
    • Arleen
    • By Arleen 21st Mar 17, 12:17 AM
    • 924 Posts
    • 684 Thanks
    Arleen
    • #6
    • 21st Mar 17, 12:17 AM
    • #6
    • 21st Mar 17, 12:17 AM
    In reply to an earlier post, I did consult with both environmental health - still have the letters and shelter. I took shelters advice and informed the landlord that they had breeched the tenancy and subsequently wrote to them again to inform of them of this fact. I had all my evidence in chronological order with help from shelter. I followed all their instructions to the tee. I took several hundered photos tried negotiating with the LL. the problem is I'm too nice for my own good sometimes.
    Originally posted by Wandering
    What letters? Did they come, inspect, and rule the place as unhabitable? I seriously doubt that they've told you to just vacate the place in the way you did without having someone come over, do an inspection and condemn the place.

    But now it's too late for anything anyway, so let me talk what will happen tomorrow. It will most likely take place in either some meetings room or judges chambers, very informal. You will be there, the judge and probably the landlord. He will ask for your side of the story, then for landlords, following with any questions, he feels like and finally gives a judgement. It will be relatively informal, at least for a court, but it pays to be respectful at all times and to everybody.

    When Judge rules, it will likely be a judgement against you and the previous CCJ will stand (at least given what you've told us here) so be prepared for that and try to not react in a strong way. And bring your payslip and what your expenses are, ask for payment plan.
    • deannatrois
    • By deannatrois 21st Mar 17, 6:39 AM
    • 4,676 Posts
    • 6,619 Thanks
    deannatrois
    • #7
    • 21st Mar 17, 6:39 AM
    • #7
    • 21st Mar 17, 6:39 AM
    Please don't think I am not sympathetic. I am.

    Just in case the magistrate is familiar with housing, try and have an explanation as to why you didn't write to the LL saying x needs repairing, do repair by Y date or I will do it and deduct money from rent, (not just do x repair) just in case they ask.

    Also look for specific evidence that someone official says your rented property was uninhabitable if you can find it.
    • FBaby
    • By FBaby 21st Mar 17, 6:47 AM
    • 15,703 Posts
    • 39,311 Thanks
    FBaby
    • #8
    • 21st Mar 17, 6:47 AM
    • #8
    • 21st Mar 17, 6:47 AM
    I gave the estate agents nearly 3 months to rectify.
    How did you do that? You mean you wrote to them and said that if it was sorted in the next three months, you'd withhold rent, or do you mean that you didn't take any actions for three months?
    • sheff6107
    • By sheff6107 21st Mar 17, 9:18 AM
    • 416 Posts
    • 278 Thanks
    sheff6107
    • #9
    • 21st Mar 17, 9:18 AM
    • #9
    • 21st Mar 17, 9:18 AM
    Your set aside hearing will not have anything to do with the case. It is simply a matter of why you ignored a default judgment when your defence had been struck out. Now, not adding the declaration to the bottom is not usually a case for striking out a defence so you would have to argue why this was extreme.

    Have you considered trying to make an offer to the lettings agent? If you can offer them half in full and final settlement and point out if they send round bailiffs you will just offer them £5 a week and that they will mostly go towards their own fees you might be able to do a deal.
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

4,731Posts Today

8,104Users online

Martin's Twitter