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  • FIRST POST
    • molly57.
    • By molly57. 20th Mar 17, 1:51 PM
    • 84Posts
    • 52Thanks
    molly57.
    Is there an IDIOTS Guide to installing CCTV myself?
    • #1
    • 20th Mar 17, 1:51 PM
    Is there an IDIOTS Guide to installing CCTV myself? 20th Mar 17 at 1:51 PM
    Good Afternoon


    And before anyone jumps on the word IDIOT I am referring to myself only!!


    I am a single mature lady who has been a persistent target for Criminals over many years including being a victim of Criminal Damage, Theft and Anti Social Behaviour committed by both adults, youths and children in this area. The Police have been involved but seem powerless to stop this as most of it is happening when I am not at home. I've done everything I can to secure my property and have come to the last straw so to speak which is to install CCTV. Yes I could employ a Security company to install this for me at great cost. I am fairly intelligent so I think if I buy the right set up I can do it myself although I do find the terminology a bit confusing.


    Anyway what I am looking for is to set up CCTV in my home that will cover the outside for example cameras that sit in the window pointing out. I will need up to an 8 camera set up to cover both the front and rear of my property. Something I can link up to a computer or buy a recorder so it records both visual images, video and sound if possible and to operate 24/7. I need a set up that captures clear visual images both day and night as I may need to present the footage in Court.


    At the front of my property the camera will capture part of the pavement and street as I want to catch the offenders entering my gate. I have looked into the Data Protection side of things. As I am doing this for my own safety and to protect my property with a view to using the evidence in Court if it comes to that then any images captured from the street are covered.


    Hope someone can help me with the correct advice.


    Regards


    P.S. What I'm looking for is someone to say you need to buy this, this and this and do this and do that and its set up!


    P.P.S It doesn't have to be 8 cameras to start with. Perhaps two and then I can add cameras as I go along.
    Last edited by molly57.; 20-03-2017 at 2:56 PM. Reason: Remembered something that will give this post clarity.
Page 1
    • bengalknights
    • By bengalknights 20th Mar 17, 3:30 PM
    • 3,945 Posts
    • 1,447 Thanks
    bengalknights
    • #2
    • 20th Mar 17, 3:30 PM
    • #2
    • 20th Mar 17, 3:30 PM
    If you have a local costco id recommend the Swann (Rebadgded Hikvision) range.

    Simple IP camera setup via your internet browser and the cameras use memory cards for local storage.

    You will need to drill some holes in the wall and possibly require long ethernet cables to route towards a plug for power
    • DoaM
    • By DoaM 20th Mar 17, 3:37 PM
    • 2,273 Posts
    • 2,265 Thanks
    DoaM
    • #3
    • 20th Mar 17, 3:37 PM
    • #3
    • 20th Mar 17, 3:37 PM
    To avoid video storage being an issue (either too much, or getting overwritten) you might want to think about cameras with PIR detection built in, perhaps also linked with security lights to help with image clarity. That way any "visitors" would be lit up, and the PIR would trigger recording to start.
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    • Strider590
    • By Strider590 20th Mar 17, 4:26 PM
    • 11,069 Posts
    • 6,155 Thanks
    Strider590
    • #4
    • 20th Mar 17, 4:26 PM
    • #4
    • 20th Mar 17, 4:26 PM
    To avoid video storage being an issue (either too much, or getting overwritten) you might want to think about cameras with PIR detection built in, perhaps also linked with security lights to help with image clarity. That way any "visitors" would be lit up, and the PIR would trigger recording to start.
    Originally posted by DoaM
    Most DVRs have motion detection, they compare the images from the cameras, look for a change and start recording. This means that if there is a security light, the light will trigger the CCTV anyway
    Having the last word isn't the same as being right.......

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    • shopbot
    • By shopbot 20th Mar 17, 6:47 PM
    • 1,000 Posts
    • 408 Thanks
    shopbot
    • #5
    • 20th Mar 17, 6:47 PM
    • #5
    • 20th Mar 17, 6:47 PM
    One thing to consider is how visible you want the camera's to be. Do you want them to be provide you with a deterrent as well as recording images? Or do you feel that very visible cameras might bring more unwanted attention?

    • molly57.
    • By molly57. 20th Mar 17, 6:56 PM
    • 84 Posts
    • 52 Thanks
    molly57.
    • #6
    • 20th Mar 17, 6:56 PM
    • #6
    • 20th Mar 17, 6:56 PM
    Hello shopbot


    Yes I think more visible cameras will bring more unwanted attention and also attract those intent on causing damage with the camera being the target. That's partly why I want to install them indoors looking outwards if possible. I can drill holes in an interior wall if the cameras have to be mounted but I would have to pay someone to put them up outside which defeats the object of DIY and MSE.


    I want the cameras as a deterrent. If I manage to have them less visible indoors do I have to put up signs to say there is CCTV on the premises?
    • shopbot
    • By shopbot 20th Mar 17, 7:16 PM
    • 1,000 Posts
    • 408 Thanks
    shopbot
    • #7
    • 20th Mar 17, 7:16 PM
    • #7
    • 20th Mar 17, 7:16 PM
    Hello shopbot


    Yes I think more visible cameras will bring more unwanted attention and also attract those intent on causing damage with the camera being the target. That's partly why I want to install them indoors looking outwards if possible. I can drill holes in an interior wall if the cameras have to be mounted but I would have to pay someone to put them up outside which defeats the object of DIY and MSE.


    I want the cameras as a deterrent. If I manage to have them less visible indoors do I have to put up signs to say there is CCTV on the premises?
    Originally posted by molly57.
    I would suggest having the cameras mounted outside. If you have them indoors looking out (i.e through your windows) then the physical security of your house is compromised if someone tries to put the camera out of action.

    I realise that this is MSE but if you have existing problems and have the financial means it might be best to get a system professionally installed. Like all trades there will be a range of prices and quality of work. A professional installer might well spot problems or give suggestions you might over look.

    Is there anything else you can do in the meantime? Security lights, CCTV stickers (even if there is none), a dog etc.

    This is a good link re the data protection angle: https://ico.org.uk/for-the-public/cctv/
    Last edited by shopbot; 20-03-2017 at 7:23 PM.

    • JP1978
    • By JP1978 20th Mar 17, 7:42 PM
    • 222 Posts
    • 182 Thanks
    JP1978
    • #8
    • 20th Mar 17, 7:42 PM
    • #8
    • 20th Mar 17, 7:42 PM
    I have just bought a Swann system - its £799 at maplins but found a refurbished set for £425 - been delivered tomorrow.

    Used rated trader to find an installer who is willing to install it for me and he has quoted £215 - that is for the 4 cameras and the cabling, been installed from a spare bedroom, into a cupboard, into the attic and down to the soffits and lower walls.

    The system I have bought, although has 4 cameras can be expanded to 8, is 4mp, 30m night vision and remote viewing.

    So dont think that the total of £650 (ish) will be too bad all in all.
    • EdwardB
    • By EdwardB 22nd Mar 17, 9:21 PM
    • 412 Posts
    • 319 Thanks
    EdwardB
    • #9
    • 22nd Mar 17, 9:21 PM
    • #9
    • 22nd Mar 17, 9:21 PM
    I have used Swann and found it terrible, the software cloud is terrible, it is what I call a "mortgage" product, they expect you to pay 29 a month for just 30 events a day.

    They are overpriced and do not seem to do all the things the Hik Vision cameras they OEM do.
    Please be nice to all MoneySavers. That’s the forum motto. Remember, the prime aim is to help provide info and resources. If you don’t like someone, their situation, their question or feel they’re intruding on ‘your board’ then please bite the bullet and think of the bigger issue.
    • EdwardB
    • By EdwardB 22nd Mar 17, 9:47 PM
    • 412 Posts
    • 319 Thanks
    EdwardB
    Hello shopbot

    Yes I think more visible cameras will bring more unwanted attention and also attract those intent on causing damage with the camera being the target. That's partly why I want to install them indoors looking outwards if possible. I can drill holes in an interior wall if the cameras have to be mounted but I would have to pay someone to put them up outside which defeats the object of DIY and MSE.

    I want the cameras as a deterrent. If I manage to have them less visible indoors do I have to put up signs to say there is CCTV on the premises?
    Originally posted by molly57.

    Good Afternoon

    And before anyone jumps on the word IDIOT I am referring to myself only!!


    I am a single mature lady who has been a persistent target for Criminals over many years including being a victim of Criminal Damage, Theft and Anti Social Behaviour committed by both adults, youths and children in this area. The Police have been involved but seem powerless to stop this as most of it is happening when I am not at home. I've done everything I can to secure my property and have come to the last straw so to speak which is to install CCTV. Yes I could employ a Security company to install this for me at great cost. I am fairly intelligent so I think if I buy the right set up I can do it myself although I do find the terminology a bit confusing.


    Anyway what I am looking for is to set up CCTV in my home that will cover the outside for example cameras that sit in the window pointing out. I will need up to an 8 camera set up to cover both the front and rear of my property. Something I can link up to a computer or buy a recorder so it records both visual images, video and sound if possible and to operate 24/7. I need a set up that captures clear visual images both day and night as I may need to present the footage in Court.


    At the front of my property the camera will capture part of the pavement and street as I want to catch the offenders entering my gate. I have looked into the Data Protection side of things. As I am doing this for my own safety and to protect my property with a view to using the evidence in Court if it comes to that then any images captured from the street are covered.


    Hope someone can help me with the correct advice.


    Regards


    P.S. What I'm looking for is someone to say you need to buy this, this and this and do this and do that and its set up!


    P.P.S It doesn't have to be 8 cameras to start with. Perhaps two and then I can add cameras as I go along.
    Originally posted by molly57.
    With the greatest of respect to others here, I would suggest that you would be better off posting to a CCTV forum, you will get a much larger group of experienced people.

    Putting a CCTV in your house will not work well, first off you lose the audio from the crime which may be crucial. Secondly you record yourself. Thirdly the quality of the picture will be inferior if it is indoors, not just the window but the light and reflection.

    Your cameras may be hacked, used to attack websites and even broadcast on the web.

    You might want to consider installing them covertly in some sort of bird box, albeit that this may impact on pan and tilt.

    I have seen some great deals on Amazon for CCTV but check the 1 star reviews.

    I saw a £10 camera in Aldi, you might want to try something like this just so you understand the issues.

    These are sites I have found to be good, the last one seems to be some sort of retailer.

    http://ipcamtalk.com
    http://www.cctvforum.com
    https://www.forum.use-ip.co.uk/
    Please be nice to all MoneySavers. That’s the forum motto. Remember, the prime aim is to help provide info and resources. If you don’t like someone, their situation, their question or feel they’re intruding on ‘your board’ then please bite the bullet and think of the bigger issue.
    • molly57.
    • By molly57. 27th Mar 17, 4:07 PM
    • 84 Posts
    • 52 Thanks
    molly57.
    Good Afternoon


    I have now purchased two cameras from Lidl at a very reasonable price. Possibly similar to EdwardB's recommendation for the Aldi camera. These will get me started.


    Can any one recommend a recording device please? As previously stated I want to end up with an 8 camera set up. If these cheap cameras are any good then I will buy more. Whilst I mentioned recording sound this is not the most important factor at present.


    I have a spare laptop I could use as a recording device but this would be onto disc so I would end up with hundreds of discs and I don't know how to set the laptop up to record what I want. Is there a hard drive recorder that activates and records only when there is movement? Or is that a feature only installed in a camera itself? I don't want to have to wade through hours, days worth of footage just to find there is nothing untoward captured.


    Regards
    • DoaM
    • By DoaM 27th Mar 17, 4:24 PM
    • 2,273 Posts
    • 2,265 Thanks
    DoaM
    Do the cameras not include their own storage? (e.g. via SD card).
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    • molly57.
    • By molly57. 27th Mar 17, 4:32 PM
    • 84 Posts
    • 52 Thanks
    molly57.
    No these cameras are for plugging into the mains and a recording device. If I have cameras with SD cards installed outside there is nothing to stop someone entering my garden and stealing the SD card from the camera.
    • Mee
    • By Mee 27th Mar 17, 5:54 PM
    • 808 Posts
    • 839 Thanks
    Mee
    Do report back
    Hi molly57,


    Hope things improve for you and you find a solution. Do let us know what you decide and what worked.
    You can click the Thanks button if you want

    • Frozen_up_north
    • By Frozen_up_north 7th Apr 17, 3:38 PM
    • 944 Posts
    • 391 Thanks
    Frozen_up_north
    Molly, you might find those Lidl cameras next to useless.

    I've just upgraded my very basic CCTV setup to a Swann system that uses 4 mega pixel ip cameras (NVR4-4700 recorder, NHD-818 cameras). Image quality is outstanding. Motion detection is easy to setup too. Although it needs a little tweaking to avoid recording too many moths and sparrows! The '818 cameras are quite large, about the size of a beaker, they are white and very visible! Cost of a two camera, 4 channel recorder kit was £449.99 from Coditech. Extra NHD-818 cameras are £99.99 each.

    You mentioned hiding cameras behind glass, unfortunately most home cctv cameras have a ring of infrared leds around the lens, these reflect off the glass rendering the image unusable at night. During mornings or evenings the sun will hit the glass giving a poor image too. It might be possible to fit outdoor ir lamps and hidden "bullet" cameras (w/o ir leds) mounted to view through knot holes in a fence or shed, for a well hidden setup, but it gets complicated very quickly.

    The Swann ip cameras use Ethernet (network) cabling, the supplied cables have a large RJ45 plug and rubber boot, needing quite a large hole through the wall, unless you can route them through vents under your roof tiles. Swann don't include cable junction boxes, one will be needed for each camera, Screwfix part 30356 costs £1.87 and is OK. Maplin stock similar ones.

    As Mee said, let us know how you get on.
    • JP1978
    • By JP1978 7th Apr 17, 10:47 PM
    • 222 Posts
    • 182 Thanks
    JP1978
    I have used Swann and found it terrible, the software cloud is terrible, it is what I call a "mortgage" product, they expect you to pay 29 a month for just 30 events a day.

    They are overpriced and do not seem to do all the things the Hik Vision cameras they OEM do.
    Originally posted by EdwardB
    Good job the one I bought isnt a cloud model then - it has a 2TB hard drive that is accessed by either the NVR itself (and a monitor), PC App, Mac App or Android/iphone app.... or, set up a DDNS and via any pc with internet connection.

    Really impressed with it so far.
    • JP1978
    • By JP1978 7th Apr 17, 10:55 PM
    • 222 Posts
    • 182 Thanks
    JP1978
    Molly, you might find those Lidl cameras next to useless.

    I've just upgraded my very basic CCTV setup to a Swann system that uses 4 mega pixel ip cameras (NVR4-4700 recorder, NHD-818 cameras). Image quality is outstanding. Motion detection is easy to setup too. Although it needs a little tweaking to avoid recording too many moths and sparrows! The '818 cameras are quite large, about the size of a beaker, they are white and very visible! Cost of a two camera, 4 channel recorder kit was £449.99 from Coditech. Extra NHD-818 cameras are £99.99 each.

    You mentioned hiding cameras behind glass, unfortunately most home cctv cameras have a ring of infrared leds around the lens, these reflect off the glass rendering the image unusable at night. During mornings or evenings the sun will hit the glass giving a poor image too. It might be possible to fit outdoor ir lamps and hidden "bullet" cameras (w/o ir leds) mounted to view through knot holes in a fence or shed, for a well hidden setup, but it gets complicated very quickly.

    The Swann ip cameras use Ethernet (network) cabling, the supplied cables have a large RJ45 plug and rubber boot, needing quite a large hole through the wall, unless you can route them through vents under your roof tiles. Swann don't include cable junction boxes, one will be needed for each camera, Screwfix part 30356 costs £1.87 and is OK. Maplin stock similar ones.

    As Mee said, let us know how you get on.
    Originally posted by Frozen_up_north
    This is the kit i have (Its NVR 7400) - 8 Channel but supplied with 4 bullet cams - i have bought an additional dome camera.

    Image quality is outstanding.

    All 5 ethernet cables run from the attic into the 1st floor soffit,

    Three of them drop down in conduits into three IP boxes - bullet cameras mounted to the IP boxes and the cables join inside.

    One drops from the 1st floor soffit and follows the downpipe, into the garage and back out again into a lower soffit for the dome camera in the porch.

    The last drops down another downpipe (tied to the rear) and onto a camera overlooking the driveway.

    All (except the dome) are high enough that needs a ladder to get to, but easy enough for me to adjust / clean as needed.

    Mind that positioning the cameras is a trade off, too high and they dont get an image of the face, too low and they can get moved or damaged - hence mine been out of reach unless a large step ladder is used.
    • forgotmyname
    • By forgotmyname 7th Apr 17, 11:06 PM
    • 24,982 Posts
    • 9,909 Thanks
    forgotmyname
    I bought a 16 channel recorder for about £60 from a local company selling them on ebay.

    Which cameras did you buy? What are they like in low light levels? If you fit them indoors the infra-red LEDS will be useless. You will just get glare from the glass. Fitting them externally would be better but they could be a target themselves and the LED range maybe short.

    I bought quality used Panasonic cameras (off ebay again) You need to keep watching to get the decent ones. The ones i bought came with fixed focus lenses but i bought motorised auto focus lenses which just screw on and plug into the cams. Excellent low light performance without the need for LEDs.

    A laptop hard drive wont stand upto being recorded on 24/7. You want a recorder with a proper CCTV hard drive like the WD Purple range.
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    • molly57.
    • By molly57. 10th Apr 17, 7:20 AM
    • 84 Posts
    • 52 Thanks
    molly57.
    Good Morning


    Thank you for all your comments and help but as I said at the beginning I am looking for an "Idiots" guide for myself. I am still very confused by the various terminology being written.


    I have learned that it would not be prudent to use cameras indoors to look through glass as this will affect the images recorded. I can't use an outdoor camera with SD card as there would be nothing to stop the "B******s" from stealing the SD card. I'm not in a position or have the knowledge or ability to mount cameras on my house walls myself. At the moment I can't afford to pay for it to be installed professionally.


    I could buy a wireless system. As someone has said the Lidl's cameras may not be any good but at least I haven't wasted much money on them.


    I still need to find a recording device for the Lidl's cameras. Any suggestions? Something that will record images 24/7 and that can either be set up for wireless(if I go down that route) or I just plug in the wired cameras I have at present.


    Thank you for your continued help.
    • Frozen_up_north
    • By Frozen_up_north 10th Apr 17, 4:03 PM
    • 944 Posts
    • 391 Thanks
    Frozen_up_north
    If you have a Maplin Store not too far away, they have cctv kit on demo and plenty of time to talk you through various options. www.maplin.co.uk
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