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    • Bezm
    • By Bezm 19th Mar 17, 1:22 PM
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    Bezm
    Civil service pension
    • #1
    • 19th Mar 17, 1:22 PM
    Civil service pension 19th Mar 17 at 1:22 PM
    Between the ages of 18 and 24 I worked for the Civil Service and paid into a pension. I went on Maternity leave and did not return to work, receiving the minimum maternity pay.
    After I resigned, I remember getting a letter asking me if I wanted to receive some payments which had been paid into my pension, and being financially in great need, I said yes. I received a small lump sum.
    I believe this may have been my pension contribution and have a significant affect on my future pension provision. I did not receive any advice on what impact taking this money would have on my pension when I retire. I am currently a teacher and have paid into the teachers pension since the age of 30.
    Could anyone advise me of what actions I could take, or who to contact to find out more?
Page 1
    • AnotherJoe
    • By AnotherJoe 19th Mar 17, 2:03 PM
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    AnotherJoe
    • #2
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:03 PM
    • #2
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:03 PM
    Ah, you'd like a one way bet? If that turned out to be a good decision, because the lump sum was needed then, thats OK, now that time is passed,you also like to have the pension benefits as well?



    But if it was, in retrospect, a bad decision, "someone else" is responsible, rather than your careless younger self.

    The fact you didn't take any advice means you have no comeback. You could have invested that money in a pension. You chose not to. Have a stern word with your younger self.

    Hopefully you teach more personal responsibility to your students than you are willing to take yourself.
    • Silvertabby
    • By Silvertabby 19th Mar 17, 2:16 PM
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    Silvertabby
    • #3
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:16 PM
    • #3
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:16 PM
    Could anyone advise me of what actions I could take, or who to contact to find out more?
    I'm sorry, but what's done is done. The letter you referred to would have set out all your options, which probably included a transfer to another pension fund. However, you opted for the cash because you were in 'great financial need'. If your need was really that great, would you have done anything else if someone had bashed you over the head and told you that taking the money then would have a detrimental affect on your pension in 40 years time?
    • motherofstudents
    • By motherofstudents 19th Mar 17, 2:18 PM
    • 1,291 Posts
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    motherofstudents
    • #4
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:18 PM
    • #4
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:18 PM
    Bezm I did the same as you. Didn't really have a clue at the time. There are very knowledgeable people on here but I would start by getting a pension forecast to see exactly what you have paid since then and take it from there.
    • Flugelhorn
    • By Flugelhorn 19th Mar 17, 2:19 PM
    • 575 Posts
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    Flugelhorn
    • #5
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:19 PM
    • #5
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:19 PM
    I don't think that aged 18-24 you have any clue about pensions and what it could mean in the future, just looks like someone taking more money away from you. Letter may have told you to seek advice - they often do.
    • MoneySavingUser
    • By MoneySavingUser 19th Mar 17, 2:31 PM
    • 1,602 Posts
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    MoneySavingUser
    • #6
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:31 PM
    • #6
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:31 PM
    Between the ages of 18 and 24 I worked for the Civil Service and paid into a pension. I went on Maternity leave and did not return to work, receiving the minimum maternity pay.
    After I resigned, I remember getting a letter asking me if I wanted to receive some payments which had been paid into my pension, and being financially in great need, I said yes. I received a small lump sum.
    Originally posted by Bezm
    Do you still have any of the correspondence?
    The reason I ask is that you normally have the option a short service lump sum refund if you have only been in the scheme for 2 years or less. As you worked there for 6 years, it could be that you were a member of multiple schemes and still have some of that entitlement?
    • AnotherJoe
    • By AnotherJoe 19th Mar 17, 2:43 PM
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    AnotherJoe
    • #7
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:43 PM
    • #7
    • 19th Mar 17, 2:43 PM
    Do you still have any of the correspondence?
    The reason I ask is that you normally have the option a short service lump sum refund if you have only been in the scheme for 2 years or less. As you worked there for 6 years, it could be that you were a member of multiple schemes and still have some of that entitlement?
    Originally posted by MoneySavingUser
    ISTR reading here that CSP pension entitlement didn't start until you were a certain age, perhaps 21. If so OP could easily have contributed for less than 2 years especially if they didn't start until over 21.

    Its easy enough to contact CSP and find out if there is anything there but it seems very unlikely.
    • Kynthia
    • By Kynthia 19th Mar 17, 3:24 PM
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    Kynthia
    • #8
    • 19th Mar 17, 3:24 PM
    • #8
    • 19th Mar 17, 3:24 PM
    Many years ago you needed 5 years of service to qualify for a deferred pension after leaving. If the OP didn't have this, perhaps because they didn't work there for 5 years, they were too young to join the scheme when first starting employment or because the maternity leave didn't count for pension membership (things change over time compared to how it works now), then there was no option to have a pension. They would need to check with MyCSP but their options may have been a short service payment or the opportunity to transfer the funds to another pension scheme and if they wanted advice it was their responsibility to get some.

    OP you should call MyCSP if you want more information but you couldn't have gotten the money you did if you had qualified to keep your civil service pension after leaving, so you weren't conned out of a civil service pension.
    Last edited by Kynthia; 19-03-2017 at 3:27 PM.
    Don't listen to me, I'm no expert!
    • msb1234
    • By msb1234 19th Mar 17, 6:45 PM
    • 8 Posts
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    msb1234
    • #9
    • 19th Mar 17, 6:45 PM
    • #9
    • 19th Mar 17, 6:45 PM
    AnotherJoe, thank you so much for your advice, it was received with the same vitriol in which you posted it.
    FYI, at that time I my life, I was a new single mum wig post natal depression, jobless, almost homeless and certainly penniless none of which was my fault. I had no family to support me, and there was not the benefit of the internet as today, from whence myriad details can be gleaned at the touch of a button to ensure financial decisions can be taken in full knowledge that it is in ones best interest. So yes, when I was informed about this payment, giving me enough money for a deposit on a home for me and my baby, then I took it in good faith.
    It most certainly isn't the case that I wanted my cake then and to eat it now. And yes, should I find myself in the same situation now, I may well make the same choice. However, I was not advised of any future implication for my pension, why should I be? After all, I would no doubt find a generous husband to keep me in diamonds thus negating the need for financial security in my own right!
    I asked for advice, not a scathing diatribe on my foolishly ignorant decision making over thirty five years ago. If you're incapable of offering such advice, then swipe on!
    • bigadaj
    • By bigadaj 19th Mar 17, 6:47 PM
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    bigadaj
    Well the silver lining is that the OP will potentially have twenty or thirty years of teachers pension for retirement, so far better provision than the vast majority of the population.
    • msb1234
    • By msb1234 19th Mar 17, 6:55 PM
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    msb1234
    Well the silver lining is that the OP will potentially have twenty or thirty years of teachers pension for retirement, so far better provision than the vast majority of the population.
    Originally posted by bigadaj
    Yes, I do indeed have a teachers pension to look forward to, having decided to improve my lot, get a degree and make sure I never have to rely in anyone financially again. I won't get a full one as I didn't start teaching until I was 31. As a result, I won't need to claim any benefits when I eventually retire, therefore not being a drain on resources. My pension, however, will not be the fortune people seem to think teachers pensions are, and as I no where won't get my state pension for another four years later than expected, I will still need to do some work to supplement it.
    And who says the vast majority of the population don't have something similar? Where's your evidence?
    • mgdavid
    • By mgdavid 19th Mar 17, 7:34 PM
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    mgdavid
    .......
    And who says the vast majority of the population don't have something similar? Where's your evidence?
    Originally posted by msb1234
    This is common knowledge, I'm sure you are capable of doing your own research and reading up on the subject of DB vs DC pensions.
    A salary slave no more.....
    • AlanP
    • By AlanP 19th Mar 17, 7:35 PM
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    AlanP
    The vast majority of the population have very little pension saving unfortunately and the number, like you and I, who have a very good DB scheme backed by Local / Central Government are in a fortunate position.

    You could contact the CS pension admin section and check what their records show but it sounds like you took the refund and used it at a time of need.

    As to the future, you don't say how old you are or how long you plan on working for, salary / savings / mortgage / debt situation so what follows is fairly generic (assuming you want to consider options for increasing your retirement income):

    1) Get a State Pension statement
    2) Consider increasing your pension, either by adding to the Teachers scheme or opening a separate Personal Pension of some kind
    • hugheskevi
    • By hugheskevi 19th Mar 17, 8:14 PM
    • 1,892 Posts
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    hugheskevi
    My pension, however, will not be the fortune people seem to think teachers pensions are
    Using International Accounting Standard 19 basis, the value of the employer contribution in the Teacher's pension scheme is 24.2% of pensionable earnings (2015/16 Resource Accounts, page 21)

    And who says the vast majority of the population don't have something similar? Where's your evidence?
    Of private sector employees with workplace pension provision, 13.9% have employer contributions in excess of 12% (2016 Annual Survey of Hours and Earnings, pensions Table 10).
    Last edited by hugheskevi; 19-03-2017 at 9:30 PM. Reason: Referenced employee contribution rate rather than employer
    • JoeCrystal
    • By JoeCrystal 19th Mar 17, 9:16 PM
    • 1,239 Posts
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    JoeCrystal
    Yeah, especially that the average total (member plus employer) contribution rate is 4.0% for private sector defined contribution schemes in 2015.

    (Occupational Pension Schemes Survey, UK: 2015)
    • AnotherJoe
    • By AnotherJoe 19th Mar 17, 9:27 PM
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    AnotherJoe
    AnotherJoe, thank you so much for your advice, it was received with the same vitriol in which you posted it.
    No vitriol, just exasperation with people who do want to have their cake and eat it.like you.
    FYI, at that time I my life, I was a new single mum wig post natal depression, jobless, almost homeless and certainly penniless none of which was my fault.

    So, it seems like a good idea to have taken the money. Yet now, despite having had the money, you also want the pension?

    I had no family to support me, and there was not the benefit of the internet as today, from whence myriad details can be gleaned at the touch of a button to ensure financial decisions can be taken in full knowledge that it is in ones best interest. So yes, when I was informed about this payment, giving me enough money for a deposit on a home for me and my baby, then I took it in good faith.
    It most certainly isn't the case that I wanted my cake then and to eat it now.

    It certainly sounds like it, you took the money (you needed it so it was most likely the right decision), yet you do want the pension as well do you not?

    And yes, should I find myself in the same situation now, I may well make the same choice. However, I was not advised of any future implication for my pension, why should I be? After all, I would no doubt find a generous husband to keep me in diamonds thus negating the need for financial security in my own right!
    I asked for advice, not a scathing diatribe on my foolishly ignorant decision making over thirty five years ago. If you're incapable of offering such advice, then swipe on!
    Originally posted by msb1234
    I dont know if it was a bad decision. You seemed to think it was. (Yet you also think that you had no choice and needed the money, so are also conflicted. Who am I to disagree?

    The advice from me was, you were offered no advice and thus have no comeback. As said by others, at the time there was either no choice anyway or you would have been told to take advice.

    If you don't expect to have your cake and eat it, what exactly is your request ? What do you want if it's not that pension as well as the cash you already had ?
    • msb1234
    • By msb1234 19th Mar 17, 9:56 PM
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    msb1234
    I must have missed your 'advice', the tone of your reply was more of an opinion, and a harsh one at that.
    My whole point is that I am unsure exactly what the money I was refunded was from. Believe it or not, this was at a time when financial advice was only deemed necessary for wealthy or high earning individuals. Us mere mortals on minimum wage were considered lacking in the necessary intelligence to make informed decisions. Ha! That certainly seems the case!
    I purely want to know if anyone else found themselves in a similar situation. It's more likely that they would be women who had children in their very early 20s and did not return to work. The self same women who now find that their state pension will be paid many years later than they expected, with very little time to do anything about this.
    I don't expect my cake and eat it, I just want to know how I can find out if I have any civil service pension entitlement or did I sign away that.
    I assumed that posters in a forum on pensions might point me in the right direction, rather than castigate me for making a potentially costly mistake 35 years ago.
    • msb1234
    • By msb1234 19th Mar 17, 9:59 PM
    • 8 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    msb1234
    Using International Accounting Standard 19 basis, the value of the employer contribution in the Teacher's pension scheme is 24.2% of pensionable earnings

    Of private sector employees with workplace pension provision, 13.9% have employer contributions in excess of 12%
    Originally posted by hugheskevi
    Sorry, but I've no idea what point you're trying to make!
    • p00hsticks
    • By p00hsticks 19th Mar 17, 10:25 PM
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    p00hsticks
    Sorry, but I've no idea what point you're trying to make!
    Originally posted by msb1234
    hugheskevi is posting evidence (as you requested) to contradict your suggestion in post #11 that the 'vast majority of the population' might have a pension similar in generosity to that available to teachers.

    lncidentally - are you the OP ? as if so you are now posting under a different user name ......
    • mgdavid
    • By mgdavid 20th Mar 17, 2:26 AM
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    mgdavid
    ....... The self same women who now find that their state pension will be paid many years later than they expected, with very little time to do anything about this.
    .........
    Originally posted by msb1234
    you had 20 years to do something about it.
    A salary slave no more.....
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