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  • FIRST POST
    • mayflyjules
    • By mayflyjules 18th Mar 17, 1:36 PM
    • 5Posts
    • 7Thanks
    mayflyjules
    PCN from Civil Enforcement Ltd - Need help with appeal email
    • #1
    • 18th Mar 17, 1:36 PM
    PCN from Civil Enforcement Ltd - Need help with appeal email 18th Mar 17 at 1:36 PM
    Hi,

    I have received a PCN/NTK from CEL well after the 14 day window to comply with POFA 2012, and I'm looking for some help wording an appeal email to them based on no keeper liability. I have read the pinned post and done a lot of searching and come up with the below email, but I have 2 outstanding questions:

    1. I feel like it would help if I cited some case law or something else regarding the fact that POPLA tend to throw out these cases where there is no keeper liability (to encourage them to accept my appeal), but I don't know what to cite. All the example appeal letters I've seen that do so using this argument are letters to POPLA, not the parking company, and the wording doesn't make sense to me or I can't tell if it's the right case law for my argument. Is it worth me adding this, and if so what should I put?

    2. I've seen people recommend saving the letter as a PDF and attaching it, but again I'm not sure if this is just for POPLA appeals or recommended for PPC appeal emails as well?

    I really want to avoid it going to POPLA if possible, as that seems to be additional hassle I don't need right now. I know it can happen that CEL accept appeals because I've seen other posts where people have reported success.

    I'm hoping you kind and knowledgeable forum members can help me Here's my email so far...

    __________________________________________________ _____________________
    "Dear Sir or Madam,

    Re. Parking Charge Notice No. XXXXXXXXXX

    I am writing to you as the registered keeper of the vehicle XXXX XXX.

    The issued notice to keeper states, "It is the driver's responsibility to pay this PCN", but you have neither named the driver nor produced any evidence as to the identity of the driver at the time of the incident. As the keeper of the vehicle, I am exercising my right not to name the driver. There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be made.

    Furthermore, the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4 Paragraph 9(5) stipulates that for keeper liability to apply, the keeper must receive a notice to keeper within 14 days of the incident. Your notice to keeper states the incident date as 4th February 2017 and shows an issue date of 3rd March 2017, with the postal franking on the envelope also proving that the notice was posted on 3rd March 2017 (see attached image). According to my calculations, to comply with POFA 2012 the notice to keeper should have arrived no later than 18th February 2017 and therefore as keeper I cannot be held liable.

    I thereby respectfully request that you cancel the charge. Should you reject my appeal, please supply a POPLA code.

    Yours faithfully,
    [name]

    [address]"
    __________________________________________________ _____________________
Page 1
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 18th Mar 17, 4:06 PM
    • 50,161 Posts
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    Coupon-mad
    • #2
    • 18th Mar 17, 4:06 PM
    • #2
    • 18th Mar 17, 4:06 PM
    That's fine to kill off a CEL charge. I would just put that in the body of the email and add the keeper's name and address at the bottom.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • mayflyjules
    • By mayflyjules 18th Mar 17, 4:44 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    mayflyjules
    • #3
    • 18th Mar 17, 4:44 PM
    • #3
    • 18th Mar 17, 4:44 PM
    Many thanks, Coupon-mad!
    • mayflyjules
    • By mayflyjules 28th Mar 17, 12:59 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    mayflyjules
    • #4
    • 28th Mar 17, 12:59 PM
    • #4
    • 28th Mar 17, 12:59 PM
    Just a quick update - I received a letter yesterday from CEL advising that my parking ticket has been cancelled!!

    Thanks for your help
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 28th Mar 17, 2:18 PM
    • 50,161 Posts
    • 63,538 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #5
    • 28th Mar 17, 2:18 PM
    • #5
    • 28th Mar 17, 2:18 PM
    Easy wasn't it?! They hate being reminded their NTKs are non-POFA.
    Last edited by Coupon-mad; 19-07-2017 at 11:51 PM.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • mayflyjules
    • By mayflyjules 28th Mar 17, 2:28 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    mayflyjules
    • #6
    • 28th Mar 17, 2:28 PM
    • #6
    • 28th Mar 17, 2:28 PM
    Well it took a few hours of research and amending my email, but it's a very nice feeling knowing I won
    • Jencoo
    • By Jencoo 19th Jul 17, 7:00 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Jencoo
    • #7
    • 19th Jul 17, 7:00 PM
    Please help
    • #7
    • 19th Jul 17, 7:00 PM
    Hi mayflyjules, so I've got a similar pcn. It's got my name and address on it, but in small print at the bottom it does say it is the drivers responsibility to pay it. Also I see they issued it over a month since the incident occurred. Ur email you sent them seems really good. Do u think what I received is a ntk and I could try the same you did. Especially as it took theme over a month to issue it? THanks!
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 19th Jul 17, 7:12 PM
    • 40,304 Posts
    • 80,504 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    • #8
    • 19th Jul 17, 7:12 PM
    • #8
    • 19th Jul 17, 7:12 PM
    Hi mayflyjules, so I've got a similar pcn. It's got my name and address on it, but in small print at the bottom it does say it is the drivers responsibility to pay it. Also I see they issued it over a month since the incident occurred. Ur email you sent them seems really good. Do u think what I received is a ntk and I could try the same you did. Especially as it took theme over a month to issue it? THanks!
    Originally posted by Jencoo
    The OP hasn't visited MSE since the end of March so is unlikely to see your post.

    Please read the Sticky thread for NEWBIES then start your own thread if you need further help.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
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    • Redx
    • By Redx 19th Jul 17, 7:25 PM
    • 15,526 Posts
    • 19,616 Thanks
    Redx
    • #9
    • 19th Jul 17, 7:25 PM
    • #9
    • 19th Jul 17, 7:25 PM
    Do u think what I received is a ntk and I could try the same you did. Especially as it took theme over a month to issue it? THanks!
    Originally posted by Jencoo
    yes , is the answer to the questions

    please start your own thread if you need further help
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • mayflyjules
    • By mayflyjules 20th Jul 17, 12:07 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    mayflyjules
    Hi Jencoo,

    Yes, it sounds like you are in the same situation, so it's worth giving the email a go. Good luck!
    • Mlliepcn
    • By Mlliepcn 11th Aug 17, 10:20 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Mlliepcn
    Hi all

    I have the same issue, but with the PCN issued at 16 days, received on day 18. Also, they have used my middle name on the PCN, not my official name, and it's spelled incorrectly. Would that make any difference? I am baffled as to how they have made this mistake/assumption as to the name I use (even if I do normally go by my middle name, lol)

    Any thoughts?

    Thanks
    • Redx
    • By Redx 11th Aug 17, 10:23 PM
    • 15,526 Posts
    • 19,616 Thanks
    Redx
    the "name" makes no difference , as long as the person is the correct person

    but failing POFA2012 on delivery dates means they cannot hold the keeper liable, so is a number one appeal point at popla (or in court)
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 11th Aug 17, 10:23 PM
    • 50,161 Posts
    • 63,538 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    They will have got your name from the V5 details stored by the DVLA for this car.

    You will get this cancelled easily, no need for a new thread, just copy the above.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

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