Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • moneysaver12
    • By moneysaver12 18th Mar 17, 8:25 AM
    • 2,000Posts
    • 3,210Thanks
    moneysaver12
    Dispute over driveway
    • #1
    • 18th Mar 17, 8:25 AM
    Dispute over driveway 18th Mar 17 at 8:25 AM
    Hi we bought a detached house in December 2016. At the front of our house there is our drive and garden. Then in front of our house there is a drive that stops at next doors garage. Next door is in the corner. On our deeds and the plan shows it too. It says that the drive belongs to us and neighbours have access.

    A person bought the house last month to rent it. Now new tenants are moving in. We asked the letting agents to ask the ll to request thst his tenants don't park on the drive.

    We have been told that the ll thinks he owns the drive. He contacted his solicitor who said there are two different plans for his house.

    Ll is coming to see us on Monday.

    If next door park at the top of the drive it doesn't cause any problems (apart from having to see their car when we look out of living room window ) also if it got damaged we would have to pay for repairs.
    If they another car parks behind their car then it means it's a struggle to get off our drive and we wouldn't be able to get back on the drive. (We have to reverse on to our drive)

    Not sure where we stand
    Married 09/09/09
Page 3
    • cjdavies
    • By cjdavies 18th Mar 17, 11:06 AM
    • 2,312 Posts
    • 2,122 Thanks
    cjdavies
    Hang on, you don't want to let them park a car in front of their garage? To the right of that fence?

    Why ever not? That just seems petty.

    As long as nobody ever parks on the 'crossover' bit at the bottom that you both need for access there should never be a problem here. Don't create an unnecessary one!
    Originally posted by Red-Squirrel
    It's confusing as it was ok for OP to park there while waiting to be sold.
    • moneysaver12
    • By moneysaver12 18th Mar 17, 11:08 AM
    • 2,000 Posts
    • 3,210 Thanks
    moneysaver12
    At your living room window, tutting.
    Originally posted by davidmcn
    LOL I've got better things to do than stand at my window tutting.

    I think that ashould long as they just park outside their garage then it shouldn't cause a problem.

    My husband has met our new neighbour this morning and said she seems nice. I don't want to fall out with neighbour over petty things.
    Married 09/09/09
    • pinkshoes
    • By pinkshoes 18th Mar 17, 11:08 AM
    • 14,973 Posts
    • 20,340 Thanks
    pinkshoes
    Download BOTH sets of deeds and see what they say.

    I'm presuming your fence is the boundary line, and you own the driveway upto that line, but the neighbour has right of way across it.

    And the problem being is that if the neighbour parks outside their garage, their car goes beyond the boundary line onto the bit you own, as the parking space is not long enough?

    Once you have established that you DO own the driveway up to the fence (and not the neighbour), then I would put in writing to the neighbour that you appreciate that his parking space outside his garage is not long enough to fit a car on, so as a gesture of goodwill, you will allow ONE car to be parked outside the garage, overlapping onto YOUR land.

    I would then state that should you find a second car parked, this gesture of goodwill well immediately be revoked, and that you also reserve the right to withdraw this gesture of goodwill at any time.
    Should've = Should HAVE (not 'of')
    Would've = Would HAVE (not 'of')

    No, I am not perfect, but yes I do judge people on their use of basic English language. If you didn't know the above, then learn it! (If English is your second language, then you are forgiven!)
    • moneysaver12
    • By moneysaver12 18th Mar 17, 11:10 AM
    • 2,000 Posts
    • 3,210 Thanks
    moneysaver12
    I want to thank you all for your replies. It helps to get other people's views. It's made me rethink my view and I think that it would be silly to stop them parking oupside their garage.

    I have a tendency due to my mental health to just think in black and white. So it's good to hear other people's views.
    Married 09/09/09
    • Red-Squirrel
    • By Red-Squirrel 18th Mar 17, 11:11 AM
    • 1,212 Posts
    • 3,009 Thanks
    Red-Squirrel
    When the landlord has been around to the property he has been allowing people to park at the bottom of the drive . So two cars on that bit of drive. This then means that I can't get on to the drive.

    I don't want to fall out with neighbours over this and don't want to turn it in to a major thing. Ll seems to think he owns all of the drive.
    Originally posted by moneysaver12
    Even if they did own all the drive they shouldn't be parking in a way that blocks yours.

    Once its tenants in there who will presumably care about not falling out with the neighbours and will probably be nice decent people (because most people are) and the landlord isn't coming and going so much you will probably be fine.

    Until then, just ask them to move every single time.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 18th Mar 17, 11:26 AM
    • 39,705 Posts
    • 45,221 Thanks
    G_M
    OP coming round to common sense response.

    But still sems resistant to the obvious job.

    LOOK AT THE PAPERWORK. FIND OUT WHO OWNS WHAT. CHECK WHO HAS WHAT ADDITIONAL RIGHTS. AND OBLIGATIONS.
    • Leo2020
    • By Leo2020 18th Mar 17, 11:30 AM
    • 862 Posts
    • 632 Thanks
    Leo2020
    Maybe I have missed sonething but couldn't it be a shared driveway - this would make the most sense although that doesn't mean its true. If it is shared then you can both drive onto it to access your own drives/garages/parking spaces but neither of you own it outright, you both own it and are both responsible for it.
    • Norman Castle
    • By Norman Castle 18th Mar 17, 11:51 AM
    • 5,879 Posts
    • 4,624 Thanks
    Norman Castle
    free upload image

    This is the original plan
    Originally posted by moneysaver12
    Is the cross hatched area the driveway being disputed? If so this is outside your boundary.
    Is there a key on that plan explaining what the cross hatched areas are? They appear to be areas where no one should park. If so there may be room for one car parked close to the garage but not two.

    • moneysaver12
    • By moneysaver12 18th Mar 17, 12:09 PM
    • 2,000 Posts
    • 3,210 Thanks
    moneysaver12
    OP coming round to common sense response.

    But still sems resistant to the obvious job.

    LOOK AT THE PAPERWORK. FIND OUT WHO OWNS WHAT. CHECK WHO HAS WHAT ADDITIONAL RIGHTS. AND OBLIGATIONS.
    Originally posted by G_M

    I have read both deeds and all it mention is the blue areas on ours as that's where the drains are under ground. Can't see anything about the drive.
    Married 09/09/09
    • moneysaver12
    • By moneysaver12 18th Mar 17, 12:11 PM
    • 2,000 Posts
    • 3,210 Thanks
    moneysaver12
    Is the cross hatched area the driveway being disputed? If so this is outside your boundary.
    Is there a key on that plan explaining what the cross hatched areas are? They appear to be areas where no one should park. If so there may be room for one car parked close to the garage but not two.
    Originally posted by Norman Castle
    I think the crossed hatched area belongs to the house across from us. The bit on the left of the garage is part of the hoyse across from us. There is a bit at the back of their house that sticks out that is right next to the garage. The edge of their garden meets the side of the drive which one think is the hatched area.. The blue bit is about the drains.
    Last edited by moneysaver12; 18-03-2017 at 12:16 PM.
    Married 09/09/09
    • moneysaver12
    • By moneysaver12 18th Mar 17, 12:38 PM
    • 2,000 Posts
    • 3,210 Thanks
    moneysaver12
    Now im more confused, downloaded the plan and this is what it shows

    upload a picture
    Married 09/09/09
    • moneysaver12
    • By moneysaver12 18th Mar 17, 12:47 PM
    • 2,000 Posts
    • 3,210 Thanks
    moneysaver12
    Says this on the deeds for next door (when it says yellow, it is talking about the blue bit)

    (d) Not to use the yellow land except for agricultural or residential
    garden purposes or as open space or for roads and services
    (e) Not to plant trees hedges shrubs or non-boundary fences on the
    yellow land
    (f) Not to alter the original level of the surface of the yellow land
    (g) Not to cover or obscure any manhole cover or chamber or other
    access or which relates to or which lies over the sewer in the yellow
    land
    (h) Not to allow
    Married 09/09/09
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 18th Mar 17, 12:54 PM
    • 2,518 Posts
    • 3,364 Thanks
    Cakeguts
    What is on the plan does is not the same as what is on the ground. The cross hatched area lines up with the small garden down the side of the wall opposite. That garden looks to me from the plan as if it has been build on the driveway. That neighbour's front garden also doesn't match the plan there shouldn't be a bulge in the front lawn. On the plan the cross hatched area is a straight line from the road so it runs over the bulge in your opposite neigbour's front garden and down the side of the house over that side garden. The garage that is on the ground appears to be a single garage but the one on the plan is huge and appears to be a double and it is almost on the boundary between you and your next door neighbour so that there wouldn't be room to park a car there.

    I can't tell from the plan what is behind the garage building that your neighbour says is his garage. However what appears to be a driveway to his garage is on the plan part of your front garden. The problem is that your neighbour owns a house that doesn't at the moment have an access to the garage since what he has there crosses your land when it should cross the small garden opposite. The cross hatched area lines up with the extension on the back of the house opposite. Also the garage that is there is not the garage that is on the plan for his house.

    To start to solve this you need to find look at your title to find out if he has a right of access across your land it should say. If he doesn't then it appears that the drive you have is in the wrong place. The house is let is that because he can't sell it because the title plan for his house doesn't match what he has tried to sell?

    Did you buy your house from new? Someone has altered the layout of the boundaries of the house opposite it could have been the builders who then didn't amend the plan or it could be that the neighbours fancied a bit more garden? But the drive appears to have moved which is probably why you find it so difficult to get your car in and out. If you were able to drive over the cross hatched part which is now under the garden opposite you would find it much easier.
    • curls
    • By curls 18th Mar 17, 12:58 PM
    • 169 Posts
    • 159 Thanks
    curls
    Hi,

    The red boundary lines on plans is posts 48 and 51 agree. Seems your neighbour does own all the tarmac from the road to his garage but presumably the hatched part should be access only and there ought to reference to this in both your deeds.
    • stator
    • By stator 18th Mar 17, 1:02 PM
    • 5,558 Posts
    • 3,538 Thanks
    stator
    Looks clear cut to me. Your neighbour owns the driveway and you may have a right of access over it.
    The red line defines the boundary of your property. The driveway is within your neighbours red line and not within your red line. Therefore it is his.
    Changing the world, one sarcastic comment at a time.
    • moneysaver12
    • By moneysaver12 18th Mar 17, 1:03 PM
    • 2,000 Posts
    • 3,210 Thanks
    moneysaver12
    Thankyou Cakeguts.

    I have looked at both deeds and it doesn't say anything about the drive, just the blue area. I shall take a picture of the other plan we have.

    We only bought the house in december, the houses are about 17 years old. The house next door was sold in a part exchange to a builders, then the ll bought it from the builders. We too bought this house from the builders.
    Married 09/09/09
    • moneysaver12
    • By moneysaver12 18th Mar 17, 1:08 PM
    • 2,000 Posts
    • 3,210 Thanks
    moneysaver12
    free photo hosting


    This is another copy of the plan
    Married 09/09/09
    • DaftyDuck
    • By DaftyDuck 18th Mar 17, 1:12 PM
    • 3,576 Posts
    • 7,149 Thanks
    DaftyDuck
    As far as one can tell from the information you have supplied, it couldn't be more clear! You own the land up to the near side of the line extending from the neighbours garage. They own the drive in front of their garage. You do not own any of the line in front of their garage and, indeed, there's an indent in what you do own on the road edge, probably indicating you don't have the automatic right to park a car as far forward as you have.

    You may have rights to drive over parts, but it is not yours to park on, nor dictate how others park. How others park may be dictated by your and their deeds.... but, as in so many things, even this may not be clear.

    As G_M recommended a while back, tea & cake! let them park in front of their garage, on their own land. Try not to block them in. Hope they try not to block you in. If either do, a friendly light ding of the doorbell, a brief rap on the door, and a cheery "can you let me out?", accompanied with a smile.

    The alternative is tin hats and barbed wire... and regulars on these boards will know the insanity (and cost) that can ensue!

    Tea and cake. Or, my version, bottle of plonk!
    Last edited by DaftyDuck; 18-03-2017 at 1:18 PM.
    • moneyistooshorttomention
    • By moneyistooshorttomention 18th Mar 17, 1:17 PM
    • 12,564 Posts
    • 34,378 Thanks
    moneyistooshorttomention
    Personally - I looked at that diagram and came to the conclusion that I'm blowed if I could tell just who owned the driveway from that.
    ******************
    • moneysaver12
    • By moneysaver12 18th Mar 17, 1:22 PM
    • 2,000 Posts
    • 3,210 Thanks
    moneysaver12
    As far as one can tell from the information you have supplied, it couldn't be more clear! You own the land up to the near side of the line extending from the neighbours garage. They own the drive in front of their garage. You do not own any of the line in front of their garage and, indeed, there's an indent in what you do own on the road edge, probably indicating you don't have the automatic right to park a car as far forward as you have.

    You may have rights to drive over parts, but it is not yours to park on, nor dictate how others park. How others park may be dictated by your and their deeds.... but, as in so many things, even this may not be clear.

    As G_M recommended a while back, tea & cake! let them park in front of their garage, on their own land. Try not to block them in. Hope they try not to block you in. If either do, a friendly light ding of the doorbell, a brief rap on the door, and a cheery "can you let me out?", accompanied with a smile.

    The alternative is tin hats and barbed wire... and regulars on these boards will know the insanity (and cost) that can ensue!

    Tea and cake. Or, my version, bottle of plonk!
    Originally posted by DaftyDuck
    Think I prefer your version a bottle of plonk.

    You would think solicitors would give the right information. Even the people that used to live here said they owned the drive.
    Married 09/09/09
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

1,706Posts Today

7,770Users online

Martin's Twitter
  • Today's twitter poll: It's been everywhere, so why not here. Which Hogwart's house should you've been in (Ive put key traits to help)...

  • Quick favour if uv graduated within around the last year. I could do with pic of a student loan statement (no personal info) inc interest

  • RT @ValeOfLevenCU: Why not sign up to @MartinSLewis https://t.co/kxMBedCNNw weekly email for free, impartial tips? #ThriftyThursday http?

  • Follow Martin