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  • FIRST POST
    • bcs2015
    • By bcs2015 16th Mar 17, 9:30 PM
    • 28Posts
    • 13Thanks
    bcs2015
    stung by LondonParking Solutions
    • #1
    • 16th Mar 17, 9:30 PM
    stung by LondonParking Solutions 16th Mar 17 at 9:30 PM
    Dear Forum,

    I have been sent a parking charge notice to registered keeper from London Parking Solutions Limited, asking to pay 110 + 18 (administration charge) reason being No valid permit on display. Actually I remember parking at this place, there was a display saying 2 hours free parking for visitors and no option to pay for parking. I was late by 10 mins, but there was no PCN attached to the vehicle as claimed in the letter. I was not aware of this PCN until the receipt of this letter I haven't contacted them yet. The date on the letter is 10/03, just received it today.

    They claim the appeal period is past its date, but how could I lodge an appeal when I was not aware of it?

    Also, they don't acknowledge the fact that it was over the two hour free parking and haven't provided my entry and exit timing. How can they be so sure of it?

    Do I have a chance against them? What should be my course of action be? should I disclose the driver details?

    Thanks in advance,
    San
Page 1
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 17th Mar 17, 10:25 AM
    • 46,883 Posts
    • 60,214 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #2
    • 17th Mar 17, 10:25 AM
    • #2
    • 17th Mar 17, 10:25 AM
    Do I have a chance against them?
    Yes.

    What should be my course of action be?
    Please read 'NEWBIES PLEASE READ THESE FAQS FIRST' and send a challenge as keeper, regardless of the time. The templates are there.

    should I disclose the driver details?
    No!
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • bcs2015
    • By bcs2015 19th Mar 17, 9:34 PM
    • 28 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    bcs2015
    • #3
    • 19th Mar 17, 9:34 PM
    • #3
    • 19th Mar 17, 9:34 PM
    Thank you Coupon Mad.
    I need to send the appeal to the operator, If I say I was above 10 mins / within the free two hour period then I would be indirectly disclosing that I am the driver ! not sure if I hold any chance of getting 10 mins grace above the 2 hr period. Moreover, in the letter there is no mention of the 2 hr free parking at all.

    I will be asking them to provide evidence that the vehicle was parked there for more than 2 hours, provide photographic evidence of entry and exit on the alleged day.

    Actually the situation with this area is, visitors have a space where 2 hrs of parking is allowed, all the offices have allocated parking and few of the spaces are owned by individuals and they don't come under operators authority.

    I am not sure how to phrase the appeal am sure will reject the initial appeal and I will have to appeal to Independent Appeals Service then I can include additional points as to requesting to provide the contract to operate the car park, landlord consent, planning, pre-estimate loss etc.
    Any suggestions on how to draft the initial appeal to the operator please?

    Thanks,
    San
    • Redx
    • By Redx 19th Mar 17, 10:32 PM
    • 14,417 Posts
    • 17,985 Thanks
    Redx
    • #4
    • 19th Mar 17, 10:32 PM
    • #4
    • 19th Mar 17, 10:32 PM
    these par@sites ALMOST ALWAYS reject an appeal, no matter what the content

    you dont add anything to the relevant template , it is submitted "as is"


    the less said about what happened , the better

    the less you give away about what you know , the better

    The IAS is a kangaroo court so you have little or no chance of winning any appeal with them, hence why we say "dont bother"

    just submit the correct template, thats it , nothing more to do
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 19th Mar 17, 11:10 PM
    • 46,883 Posts
    • 60,214 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #5
    • 19th Mar 17, 11:10 PM
    • #5
    • 19th Mar 17, 11:10 PM
    If I say I was...
    ...then you will be shooting your toes off in one fell swoop. You do see why?? Driver??!

    I am not sure how to phrase the appeal
    That's why the template exists in the NEWBIES thread, the appeal for IPC members. Stop trying to write something else.

    Any suggestions on how to draft the initial appeal to the operator please?
    See, when people write that, we know they have NOT read the NEWBIES thread despite already being signposted to it.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • bcs2015
    • By bcs2015 20th Mar 17, 10:38 AM
    • 28 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    bcs2015
    • #6
    • 20th Mar 17, 10:38 AM
    • #6
    • 20th Mar 17, 10:38 AM
    Thank you Couponpmad & Redx, I have send the appeal as is after filling the blanks. Have received the below response. Why should I provide my telephone number & disclose who the driver was? there is no legal requirement of it right.

    I have included the PCN no, name and address only.
    Thank you.

    Thank you for your email.

    If your email is in relation to a Parking Charge Notice appeal ("PCN"), please be advised that if you have not included your:

    PCN Number, full name, contact telephone number, email address & full postal address, we will be unable to log your appeal. You will also need to confirm whether you were the driver of the vehicle at the relevant time, the registered keeper of the vehicle or a 3rd party representing either the driver or the keeper.

    Please forward us this information at your earliest possible convenience. In the absence of this information, your PCN will not be placed on hold and the matter may escalate.

    In the event that you have provided all of the details above, please allow up to 14 working days for a response to your appeal.

    Your appeal response will either be sent to your email address or to your provided postal address.

    PLEASE DO NOT REPLY TO THIS EMAIL - THIS IS AN UNMONITORED EMAIL ADDRESS - Please email: appeals@paymypcn.net
    • fisherjim
    • By fisherjim 20th Mar 17, 10:48 AM
    • 2,135 Posts
    • 3,147 Thanks
    fisherjim
    • #7
    • 20th Mar 17, 10:48 AM
    • #7
    • 20th Mar 17, 10:48 AM
    Thank you Couponpmad & Redx, I have send the appeal as is after filling the blanks. Have received the below response. Why should I provide my telephone number & disclose who the driver was? there is no legal requirement of it right.

    I have included the PCN no, name and address only.
    Thank you.

    Thank you for your email.

    If your email is in relation to a Parking Charge Notice appeal ("PCN"), please be advised that if you have not included your:

    PCN Number, full name, contact telephone number, email address & full postal address, we will be unable to log your appeal. You will also need to confirm whether you were the driver of the vehicle at the relevant time, the registered keeper of the vehicle or a 3rd party representing either the driver or the keeper.

    Please forward us this information at your earliest possible convenience. In the absence of this information, your PCN will not be placed on hold and the matter may escalate.

    In the event that you have provided all of the details above, please allow up to 14 working days for a response to your appeal.

    Your appeal response will either be sent to your email address or to your provided postal address.

    PLEASE DO NOT REPLY TO THIS EMAIL - THIS IS AN UNMONITORED EMAIL ADDRESS - Please email: appeals@paymypcn.net
    Originally posted by bcs2015
    It's a fishing exercise do not give them any of that information only pcn number.
    To quote the words of the great Count Arthur Strong "You Couldn't make it up"
    • DoaM
    • By DoaM 20th Mar 17, 11:18 AM
    • 2,433 Posts
    • 2,452 Thanks
    DoaM
    • #8
    • 20th Mar 17, 11:18 AM
    • #8
    • 20th Mar 17, 11:18 AM
    And if your appeal already included the PCN number then don't respond at all.

    The appeal should have included the following:

    PCN Number
    Appellant's Name
    Appellant's Postal Address
    Appellant's Email Address (if the appeal was emailed)

    Anything else is unnecessary. The DON'T need your phone number, and you DON'T need to elucidate on the driver/keeper issue - your appeal already covers that.
    Diary of a madman
    Walk the line again today
    Entries of confusion
    Dear diary, I'm here to stay
    • bcs2015
    • By bcs2015 24th Mar 17, 12:27 PM
    • 28 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    bcs2015
    • #9
    • 24th Mar 17, 12:27 PM
    • #9
    • 24th Mar 17, 12:27 PM
    Well as informed before my appeal has been turned dow, below is the link to the rejection letter
    rejection letter from London Parking Solutions

    the link to the document with the response to the questions and evidence provided by them is below
    Response to queries

    In their response they haven't provided any photographic evidence of the vehicle entering or leaving the premises, All they have provided is the photo of the parking restriction notice and 2 hours free visitor parking. This doesn't prove that my vehicle was on their premises on that day for more than 2 hours.

    What should I include in my appeal to IAS?

    Many thanks
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 24th Mar 17, 1:39 PM
    • 46,883 Posts
    • 60,214 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    What should I include in my appeal to IAS?
    Nothing because the IAS is considered a kangaroo court - a chocolate teapot. Everyone loses. See post #3 of the NEWBIES thread.

    Ignore. No-one is telling you to pay.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • bcs2015
    • By bcs2015 27th Mar 17, 11:15 AM
    • 28 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    bcs2015
    Have received a post from London Parking Solutions on Saturday with the photographs of car parked with a time stamp on the photo after 10 mins of the 2 hr period. They are saying by parking on the premises driver has agreed to the terms which is to pay penalty if the stay exceeds beyond 2 hrs.

    Should I appeal to IAS or ignore. I have seen couple of posts where in the case was taken to small claims court and the judgement was against the driver and they had to pay 350 instead of the initial amount on PCN.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 27th Mar 17, 12:32 PM
    • 46,883 Posts
    • 60,214 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Should I appeal to IAS or ignore.
    It is very clear in the NEWBIES thread and only The Deep thinks IAS should be tried. No other posters do because you WILL LOSE and then you will worry you are on the back foot.

    I have seen couple of posts where in the case was taken to small claims court and the judgement was against the driver and they had to pay 350 instead of the initial amount on PCN.
    Really? Which ones? We almost never see a loss where the forum has helped with a defence.

    photographs of car parked with a time stamp on the photo after 10 mins of the 2 hr period.
    But the IPC code requires a ten minute grace period.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Timothea
    • By Timothea 27th Mar 17, 1:27 PM
    • 129 Posts
    • 255 Thanks
    Timothea
    The latest IPC CoP does not mention a specific number of minutes.
    15. Grace Periods
    15.1 Drivers should be allowed a sufficient amount of time to park and read any signs so they may make an informed decision as to whether or not to remain on the site.
    15.2 Drivers should be allowed a sufficient amount of time to leave a site after a pre-paid or permitted period of parking has expired.
    However, ten minutes is a reasonable minimum grace period. Some car parks, where it can take significant time to find a parking space, read the terms, buy a ticket, drive away or queue to exit, would require much more than ten minutes.
    • Guys Dad
    • By Guys Dad 27th Mar 17, 3:06 PM
    • 9,880 Posts
    • 8,865 Thanks
    Guys Dad
    Dear Forum,

    I have been sent a parking charge notice to registered keeper from London Parking Solutions Limited, asking to pay 110 + 18 (administration charge) reason being No valid permit on display.
    Originally posted by bcs2015

    The others may have missed this. Have a read of the IPC Code of Practice

    https://theipc.info/resources/brandings/brandmedia_2_Code-of-Practice.pdf

    At the foot of page 33, it reads
    It is suggested the maximum parking charge should be: £100.
    Where there is a prospect of additional charges, reference should be made to this where
    appropriate on the signage.

    You say the claim is for £110 plus £18. I would quote that document , page number and reference and state that the charges exceed the IPC maximum.

    You may be the proud owner of a very rare IAS winning appeal. Do come back and tell us.
    Last edited by Guys Dad; 27-03-2017 at 3:08 PM.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 27th Mar 17, 5:30 PM
    • 46,883 Posts
    • 60,214 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Good point Guys Dad. The OP would have to actually screenshot the page and attach it plus a picture of the sign, plus both sides of the PCN/NTK, to prove everything they say, or the IAS will say: 'the pleb says this but they haven't evidenced it...so they lose...NEXT!'
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • bcs2015
    • By bcs2015 6th Apr 17, 7:24 PM
    • 28 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    bcs2015
    Thank you guys, finally received the verification email from www.theias.org site.
    However when I go to fill in the details the first question is "Who are you representing / appealing the PCN on behalf of?" options being Myself and Another Person. If I select another person then have to provide all their details, If I select myself then it is disclosing that I was the driver should I bother to appeal or wait for them to take the next action?

    Regards
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 7th Apr 17, 12:23 AM
    • 46,883 Posts
    • 60,214 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    I thought it was a question that says 'were you the driver' and you can opt for 'prefer not to say'?
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • bcs2015
    • By bcs2015 7th Apr 17, 11:02 AM
    • 28 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    bcs2015
    no this is the screen grab


    what shall I do? ignore appealing to ias and wait for the next course of action from them?

    Thanks
    Last edited by bcs2015; 07-04-2017 at 11:06 AM. Reason: link correction
    • bcs2015
    • By bcs2015 24th Apr 17, 4:28 PM
    • 28 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    bcs2015
    Hi guys,
    Thanks for your assistance so far. I have received the debt collector letter demanding a payment of £160 now, Shall I continue to ignore until they take to small claims?
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 24th Apr 17, 10:11 PM
    • 46,883 Posts
    • 60,214 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Yes, as you missed the IAS that I think was worth a try in a case trying to claim over £100.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

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