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  • FIRST POST
    • mdemetri2
    • By mdemetri2 16th Mar 17, 9:13 AM
    • 6Posts
    • 0Thanks
    mdemetri2
    PCN NTK - Vehicle Control Services Limited
    • #1
    • 16th Mar 17, 9:13 AM
    PCN NTK - Vehicle Control Services Limited 16th Mar 17 at 9:13 AM
    Hi all

    Wanting some advice. I've had a private parking charge a few years ago and ignored based on what I read. However a brief look on here suggests there have been some changes (IPC,BPA,PoPLA? etc etc) and I could do with some steer.

    SO parked up in Leeds, 2 machines were not accepting coins to issue ticket (i.e. feeding coins into the machine to have them drop back out). Left a note in the windscreen to that affect. Came back to the car with a card stuck on it.

    Fast forward to 15/03/17 - have received a PCN NTK.

    Do I pay the fine? £100 within 28 days, or £60 within 14 days.

    Do I appeal via myparkingcharge.co.uk...although other than the photos theyt attached to the PCN online, we have no proof of the meters not accepting the coins etc.

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks in advance!!
Page 1
    • Loadsofchildren123
    • By Loadsofchildren123 16th Mar 17, 10:20 AM
    • 858 Posts
    • 1,455 Thanks
    Loadsofchildren123
    • #2
    • 16th Mar 17, 10:20 AM
    • #2
    • 16th Mar 17, 10:20 AM
    I'm not the best person to advise on the appeals, someone will be along shortly to advise you about that.


    Regarding proof of the faulty machines - you are your proof. You can't be expected to provide independent evidence of that. When/if the time comes you will do a statement bearing a "Statement of Truth" saying that, and will be happy to be cross-examined on it under oath. And anyway, they have to prove it was working - the burden of proof is on the Claimant to prove their case (the civil burden of proof is balance of probabilities, so more likely than not).


    You say "we" have no proof - were you with someone? Even better if two people say they were standing there and the machine wouldn't accept the coins. Did you keep your note? Did you take a photo showing it was displayed in the car windscreen? Is the note shown in their photos? Was there anything on the machine telling you what to do if it wasn't working (eg pay by phone/report faulty machine)?
    • mdemetri2
    • By mdemetri2 16th Mar 17, 11:10 AM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    mdemetri2
    • #3
    • 16th Mar 17, 11:10 AM
    • #3
    • 16th Mar 17, 11:10 AM
    Thanks for the reply Loadsofchildren123

    As we, as in my wife and her friends - so several people. Don't have the note but do have the photos - the parking company also included the photo as part of the notice, and clearly shown in the windscreen.

    I wasn't actually present at the time (posting this on behalf of my wife), but no notice on the machine - there was someone else who also tried to get a ticket but was unable to do so because of the same issue, I expect they got a ticket too!
    • Loadsofchildren123
    • By Loadsofchildren123 16th Mar 17, 11:29 AM
    • 858 Posts
    • 1,455 Thanks
    Loadsofchildren123
    • #4
    • 16th Mar 17, 11:29 AM
    • #4
    • 16th Mar 17, 11:29 AM
    If this goes beyond POPLA and to proceedings (and if you choose to defend those) we can come back to this. When they threaten proceedings, they have to comply with the court rules about what potential Claimants must do by way of providing information prior to issuing proceedings. At this point I would suggest pressurising them to produce information like how many other tickets were issued at around the time yours was to cars parked without tickets. They're bound to ignore you, but you can then say you asked and it will add weight to the evidence of the driver and those with the driver that the machine was spitting out the coins.
    Have you got photos of every side of the machine and the signage showing that there was no number to call if it wasn't accepting coins? If not, go back and get photos.


    One thing you will be advised is not to identify in any of your posts who was the driver. Refer to the driver and to the keeper of the vehicle, but never say who they are. You haven't identified anyone in your first post, but have in your last one.


    I would also suggest that everyone with the driver that day writes down their recollection of what happened on the day NOW, before memories fade. Including a description of the other driver who couldn't get the machine to accept coins. The notes can be handwritten, but the people making them should date and sign them. These can be produced later. The court will often accept "contemporaneous notes" as the truth (not sure how long ago the parking event was).


    Anyway, I'm getting a bit ahead of myself here, because my advice is more geared to proceedings than appeals. So I will gracefully bow out and then reappear if this goes any further!
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 16th Mar 17, 11:35 AM
    • 39,224 Posts
    • 78,366 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    • #5
    • 16th Mar 17, 11:35 AM
    • #5
    • 16th Mar 17, 11:35 AM
    It is not a fine.

    Ignoring has not been advised since the law changed in 2012.

    Start by reading the Sticky thread for NEWBIES then appeal using the IPC template letter you will find there. You send the template by whatever method is given on the NTK.

    Do not reveal the driver's identity at any point, not even on here.

    What was the date of the alleged event please?
    Last edited by Fruitcake; 16-03-2017 at 11:39 AM.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
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    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 16th Mar 17, 12:45 PM
    • 6,578 Posts
    • 5,521 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #6
    • 16th Mar 17, 12:45 PM
    • #6
    • 16th Mar 17, 12:45 PM
    Have you got photos of every side of the machine and the signage showing that there was no number to call if it wasn't accepting coins? If not, go back and get photo


    Of course you have not. Why should you have? You were parking your car FFS, this is not a murder trial. Let us keep our sense of proportion.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Loadsofchildren123
    • By Loadsofchildren123 16th Mar 17, 12:51 PM
    • 858 Posts
    • 1,455 Thanks
    Loadsofchildren123
    • #7
    • 16th Mar 17, 12:51 PM
    • #7
    • 16th Mar 17, 12:51 PM
    But it's a simple enough thing to go back and do isn't it Deep, if it stops the PPC saying why didn't you call the number that was displayed to report the fault/pay by phone (if it wasn't clearly displayed)? It's only by having gone to the car park in my case that I can show that signage is inadequate and that the PPC is trying to rely on signs that can't have been in use at the relevant time.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 16th Mar 17, 8:49 PM
    • 46,921 Posts
    • 60,258 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #8
    • 16th Mar 17, 8:49 PM
    • #8
    • 16th Mar 17, 8:49 PM
    Hi all

    Wanting some advice. I've had a private parking charge a few years ago and ignored based on what I read. However a brief look on here suggests there have been some changes (IPC,BPA,PoPLA? etc etc) and I could do with some steer.

    SO parked up in Leeds, 2 machines were not accepting coins to issue ticket (i.e. feeding coins into the machine to have them drop back out). Left a note in the windscreen to that affect. Came back to the car with a card stuck on it.

    Fast forward to 15/03/17 - have received a PCN NTK.

    Do I pay the fine? £100 within 28 days, or £60 within 14 days.

    Do I appeal via myparkingcharge.co.uk...although other than the photos theyt attached to the PCN online, we have no proof of the meters not accepting the coins etc.

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks in advance!!
    Originally posted by mdemetri2
    It's VCS so hopefully you found all you needed in 'NEWBIES PLEASE READ THESE FAQS FIRST'.

    No POPLA as it's an IPC firm, but you will have read that by now in the sticky thread. The advice about all IPC firms is the same, except at later stages when VCS will probably try a small claim later this year, using the utterly disorganised BW Legal.

    Read umpteen other threads by searching the forum for the obvious keywords 'BW Legal VCS' when you get to that predictable stage. You will always learn far more by reading the sticky thread and similar threads, rather than asking on a single thread for stuff to be repeated. It's already here.
    Last edited by Coupon-mad; 16-03-2017 at 8:52 PM.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

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