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    • debstheleo
    • By debstheleo 15th Mar 17, 5:26 PM
    • 1Posts
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    debstheleo
    Money rec'd from a job I never started - advice please
    • #1
    • 15th Mar 17, 5:26 PM
    Money rec'd from a job I never started - advice please 15th Mar 17 at 5:26 PM
    I am looking for some legal advice please:

    In Dec 2016 I applied for a temp role with M & S for 30+ hours. At the interview they offered me the role, but only 19 hours. I accepted as I was unemployed. At home on reflection of my travel costs, I declined the role.

    My husband worked for M & S (different branch) in a temp xmas role. They sent him a P45 while he was still working there. When 2 small payments were credited to our a/c in January we didn't think anything of it.

    Turns out M & S paid ME £146!!!! I never worked there, never had a contract, an employee number, clocked in or anything,

    Now they are demanding I pay this money back or they will instruct a debt collection agency.

    Does anyone know where I stand legally on this matter?

    Thanks in advance
Page 2
    • GDB2222
    • By GDB2222 16th Mar 17, 10:27 AM
    • 13,847 Posts
    • 74,106 Thanks
    GDB2222
    Would be interested to see how consumer law relates in a matter which surely is employment law?
    Originally posted by Oakdene
    That's why I added:
    This is a statement of the general position under law that you may not need to return (all) the money if you acted honestly and your position changed as a result of the mistake.

    Please do feel free to research the law yourself.
    No reliance should be placed on the above! Absolutely none, do you hear?
    • GDB2222
    • By GDB2222 16th Mar 17, 10:28 AM
    • 13,847 Posts
    • 74,106 Thanks
    GDB2222
    Oh yes it is!

    What you have quoted would be of some (limited) relevance if the OP was in pocket as a result of an error by a bank or other organisation over which the FOS has jurisdiction.

    In an employment situation (which this would seem to be) there are incredibly few situations where somebody who is overpaid has a right to keep the money. This certainly wouldn't be one of them.
    Originally posted by Undervalued
    And, of course, you have a reference for that?
    No reliance should be placed on the above! Absolutely none, do you hear?
    • Undervalued
    • By Undervalued 16th Mar 17, 10:55 AM
    • 2,937 Posts
    • 2,737 Thanks
    Undervalued
    And, of course, you have a reference for that?
    Originally posted by GDB2222
    You can research the very few high court (or above) decisions that have gone in favour of an employee keeping an overpayment of salary yourself. Anything below high court level (or the Employment Appeal Tribunal) does not set a precedent.

    A case won by an employee against Barclays Bank is a good example but they are few and far between.
    • Manxman in exile
    • By Manxman in exile 16th Mar 17, 4:44 PM
    • 629 Posts
    • 408 Thanks
    Manxman in exile
    How did they get your bank details? did you complete forms with your bank information on? normally that is done once you commence work? (or at least in my experience it is).

    Anyway, as everyone else has said, you owe them it, simple as that
    Originally posted by catflap11

    Yes, I don't understand how M&S got the bank details. I'm also surprised they would pay someone who never even turned up for their first day at work. No timesheets no nothing!
    • marliepanda
    • By marliepanda 16th Mar 17, 4:56 PM
    • 4,560 Posts
    • 9,182 Thanks
    marliepanda
    Yes, I don't understand how M&S got the bank details. I'm also surprised they would pay someone who never even turned up for their first day at work. No timesheets no nothing!
    Originally posted by Manxman in exile
    Marks and spencer take bank details during the interview stage. Op accepted the offer a role.

    They also pay temps every 2 weeks so once a position is offered the payroll data is input and started to ensure they are paid on time. It used to be that the first wage was cash but that ended. They do this so no one missed the first wage.

    Op accepted the role, so the ball will have started rolling. There are also no time sheets, you are paid your contractedhours. I'm imagining the 146 is two weeks pay st her contracted hours.
    Survey Earnings 2017 - £163
    • daytona0
    • By daytona0 16th Mar 17, 7:32 PM
    • 2,237 Posts
    • 2,654 Thanks
    daytona0
    My wife and I have had a joint account for everything ever since we married. No problem of any sort. All payments into the account are itemised so where's the problem?
    To me, not having a joint account suggests a lack of trust between the parties.
    Originally posted by TELLIT01
    How can they be itemised if you incorrectly assumed that a wage payment was for your wife ? Not saying you are to blame like, just that you have found out one of the limitations of sharing a bank account...

    Each to their own about trust like. Not my cup of tea as you can guess
    • Manxman in exile
    • By Manxman in exile 17th Mar 17, 12:02 PM
    • 629 Posts
    • 408 Thanks
    Manxman in exile
    Marks and spencer take bank details during the interview stage. Op accepted the offer a role.

    They also pay temps every 2 weeks so once a position is offered the payroll data is input and started to ensure they are paid on time. It used to be that the first wage was cash but that ended. They do this so no one missed the first wage.

    Op accepted the role, so the ball will have started rolling. There are also no time sheets, you are paid your contractedhours. I'm imagining the 146 is two weeks pay st her contracted hours.
    Originally posted by marliepanda

    Ok - that's interesting.


    But I'm curious to know how M&S Payroll know whether a new starter has (or more importantly has not) turned up for work as expected? Unless temp staff are paid in advance and the Op's start date either was pay day or just before, I don't see how the salary payment couldn't be stopped in time(*) once it was clear they weren't going to turn up for work?


    (*) I know! I used to work in the NHS and know of many overpayments where staff weren't terminated properly. But I've never come across one where the "employee" never even turned up for work!
    • marliepanda
    • By marliepanda 17th Mar 17, 12:07 PM
    • 4,560 Posts
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    marliepanda
    Ok - that's interesting.


    But I'm curious to know how M&S Payroll know whether a new starter has (or more importantly has not) turned up for work as expected? Unless temp staff are paid in advance and the Op's start date either was pay day or just before, I don't see how the salary payment couldn't be stopped in time(*) once it was clear they weren't going to turn up for work?


    (*) I know! I used to work in the NHS and know of many overpayments where staff weren't terminated properly. But I've never come across one where the "employee" never even turned up for work!
    Originally posted by Manxman in exile
    I would imagine there has been some miscommunication due to the OP accepting and then declining the role. (I'm assuming she called when she got home rather than not turning up)

    It's come about due to them attempting to make sure no one goes
    Months waiting for pay. It absolutely does not mean you get to keep it

    Marks and spencer would also never pay 'twice' in a week, for any reason. The fact the OP didn't check what they were paid is on her. Both made mistakes clearly, but none make it so the OP can keep the money.

    M&S do accept payment plans. I had an overpayment myself when I left due to holiday taken but not accrued. The options they offered very pretty low and over a long term so someone who needed that would be able to find one to suit.
    Survey Earnings 2017 - £163
    • sammyjammy
    • By sammyjammy 17th Mar 17, 5:36 PM
    • 4,129 Posts
    • 4,472 Thanks
    sammyjammy
    My wife and I have had a joint account for everything ever since we married. No problem of any sort. All payments into the account are itemised so where's the problem?
    To me, not having a joint account suggests a lack of trust between the parties.
    Originally posted by TELLIT01
    I always thought you were a lady
    "You've been reading SOS when it's just your clock reading 5:05 "
    • jobbingmusician
    • By jobbingmusician 17th Mar 17, 6:30 PM
    • 18,596 Posts
    • 18,852 Thanks
    jobbingmusician
    S/he could be.... women can have a wife, nowadays....
    I'm the Board Guide on the Matched Betting; Referrers and Jobseeking & Training boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge posts there. Board guides are not moderators and don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this). Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com.

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    • burnoutbabe
    • By burnoutbabe 18th Mar 17, 11:22 AM
    • 1,289 Posts
    • 1,855 Thanks
    burnoutbabe
    I;d want to be very sure what the payment was for - does it take into account tax and NI? in which case they need to seriously sort that out before you refund the payment, as you will be taxed at year end on this "income"
    So they need to give more details and ensure they fix your records.
    • marliepanda
    • By marliepanda 18th Mar 17, 11:30 AM
    • 4,560 Posts
    • 9,182 Thanks
    marliepanda
    I;d want to be very sure what the payment was for - does it take into account tax and NI? in which case they need to seriously sort that out before you refund the payment, as you will be taxed at year end on this "income"
    So they need to give more details and ensure they fix your records.
    Originally posted by burnoutbabe

    From my limited experience of an M&S overpayment, it will be correct and they will undo the tax and NI appropriately.
    Survey Earnings 2017 - £163
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