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  • FIRST POST
    • earthan7dor1
    • By earthan7dor1 14th Mar 17, 10:53 PM
    • 21Posts
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    earthan7dor1
    A camping issue - Is this right, legal or fair?
    • #1
    • 14th Mar 17, 10:53 PM
    A camping issue - Is this right, legal or fair? 14th Mar 17 at 10:53 PM
    I am new to camping, and to this official camping site. I fist came to store my caravan. But on 2nd January, having been pressured into a membership/joining fee; as a 'senior' entitles 25% discount. Having now paid, I learned 'discount' does not apply to 'high season' or 'serviced pitch'. I was offered a deal whereby I am on site for 28 days, I leave for one day (2 x half days) paying almost £6 to leave my van sited for that day. I then return and start another 28 day cycle. I was told I could keep doing this as the site is open all year. I wasn't looking to be there ad infinitum, but this deal would give me unrushed breathing space.
    So I did this for January and February. Towards the end of February when I went to pay my March fee, I was unceremoneously ordered to leave the site at the end of March as they had booked my pitch out for April (without asking, advising,warning me they will do this). Nor did they offer any alternative, storage facilities, whatever else. The attitude was 'tough'.
    They said Head Office had booked the pitch, brooking no more discussion. So I rang 'customer services' department. They said the site does all its own bookings! Conflicting information, but not offered any solution.
    4 March: I was summonsed to the site office and told to go immediately ("here and now"), because I had phoned head office. [Who issued this directive?].
    I offered to pay May, even though well in advance - this was ignored. I was expected to simply roll over and disappear without any given explanation, apology, etc.
    Also, the manageress advised, "we have thoroughly investigated you". What for, I am not a felon or a fraud - simply a normal paying customer of a caravan site. I have nothing to hide. Is their unwarranted infringement of my privacy allowed? To what depth, and/or how far have they spread their 'investigation? What damage to my credibility have they perpetrated? Where did they obtain permission to conduct this ferreting? She would not enlarge. Likewise is this Head Office or site manager instigated?
    Meanwhile, I am frozen in Coventry, there are vacancies on hard standings in April, I consider they have callously voided my membership and I want a refund. Worse, I must try and find somewhere to re-site, which is proving impossible (on my low income pension price bracket at Easter 'high season', so I'll be driving round the roads like a snail with a caravan shell on my back for the foreseeable future).
    The sick joke (!) is, others are living on site under the 28 day scheme for many months on end, and others have been 'lodging', but actually living on site for years. I lodge, have a rent book and part of my rent goes to Council Tax. All my official documents and pension have used that address for years without quibble. Why should Caravan and Camping Club make it an issue?
    Worse, I was suggested having a 'seasonal pitch' - paying a couple of £thousand now. Apparently, they hold a certain number of 'hard standings' back in case they can sell them for 'seasonal pitches’ (kerching!). But if not thus sold, they revert to touring pitches.
    I have not been treated with any modicum of fairness, but discrimination.
    Any tangible suggestions please? NO trolls thank you.
    [IMG]file:///C:\Users\User\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtmlclip1\01\c lip_image001.gif[/IMG]
    Last edited by earthan7dor1; 14-03-2017 at 11:20 PM. Reason: duplicated entry - only want the latter one - "I am new to camping...
Page 1
    • hollydays
    • By hollydays 15th Mar 17, 12:46 AM
    • 15,527 Posts
    • 11,313 Thanks
    hollydays
    • #2
    • 15th Mar 17, 12:46 AM
    • #2
    • 15th Mar 17, 12:46 AM
    It might help others if you can add some paragraphs
    Did you mean to post that last line?

    Confused!! You have been using this site address for years?
    Last edited by hollydays; 15-03-2017 at 12:57 AM.
    • pogofish
    • By pogofish 15th Mar 17, 2:11 AM
    • 7,770 Posts
    • 7,868 Thanks
    pogofish
    • #3
    • 15th Mar 17, 2:11 AM
    • #3
    • 15th Mar 17, 2:11 AM
    Camp site owners have always tended to have their clients over a barrel with all sorts of restrictive/intrusive/commercially disadvantageous clauses.

    But your asking a question does make me wonder if you have understood what the PVW board is here for - Maybe you should be asking in Consumer Rights if you actually want a resolution.
    • photome
    • By photome 15th Mar 17, 6:50 AM
    • 12,770 Posts
    • 8,248 Thanks
    photome
    • #4
    • 15th Mar 17, 6:50 AM
    • #4
    • 15th Mar 17, 6:50 AM
    Maybe you are too far off grid and didnt tick the right box
    • CIS
    • By CIS 15th Mar 17, 8:03 AM
    • 10,067 Posts
    • 5,752 Thanks
    CIS
    • #5
    • 15th Mar 17, 8:03 AM
    • #5
    • 15th Mar 17, 8:03 AM
    I lodge, have a rent book and part of my rent goes to Council Tax.
    It shouldn't be paid via the rent - whilst the caravan is occupied as a residence the resident of the is liable to pay the council tax direct to the council (it shouldn't be getting paid to the owner of the pitch).

    Craig
    I no longer work in Council Tax Recovery as I'm now a self employed Council Tax advisor and consultant with my own Council Tax consultancy business. My views are my own reading of the law and you should always check with the local authority in question.
    • Ectophile
    • By Ectophile 15th Mar 17, 10:09 AM
    • 2,788 Posts
    • 1,719 Thanks
    Ectophile
    • #6
    • 15th Mar 17, 10:09 AM
    • #6
    • 15th Mar 17, 10:09 AM
    If it's a camp site, then you're not supposed to live there permanently - it's a planning permission thing. It's not unknown for site owners to look the other way and not notice that people are doing it, but if you kick up a fuss, they may decide it's easier just to get rid of you.

    Who was the membership to? If it was the Caravan Club, then they probably don't own the site - the site owners are just affiliated to them.
    If it sticks, force it.
    If it breaks, well it wasn't working right anyway.
    • cavework
    • By cavework 15th Mar 17, 4:23 PM
    • 1,906 Posts
    • 2,765 Thanks
    cavework
    • #7
    • 15th Mar 17, 4:23 PM
    • #7
    • 15th Mar 17, 4:23 PM
    I must admit to being a bit confused...You say you are new to 'camping'. Can I ask if you are living at all at the permanent address ie your lodgings or living full time in your caravan and just using this address as a base address ?
    • lincroft1710
    • By lincroft1710 15th Mar 17, 6:26 PM
    • 9,909 Posts
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    lincroft1710
    • #8
    • 15th Mar 17, 6:26 PM
    • #8
    • 15th Mar 17, 6:26 PM
    I must admit to being a bit confused...
    Originally posted by cavework
    I'm a lot confused!

    The OP starts a thread about camping, but it appears to be about owning and siting a caravan, possibly one used for permanent or semi permanent living.
    • cavework
    • By cavework 15th Mar 17, 6:45 PM
    • 1,906 Posts
    • 2,765 Thanks
    cavework
    • #9
    • 15th Mar 17, 6:45 PM
    • #9
    • 15th Mar 17, 6:45 PM
    I hope this is allowed so here goes..
    There is a site on Facebook called 'permanent caravan dwellers' where you will get advice about this and available locations that I think you might be looking for.
    • teddysmum
    • By teddysmum 15th Mar 17, 8:53 PM
    • 8,517 Posts
    • 5,045 Thanks
    teddysmum
    We are members of the former Caravan Club (now the Caravan and Motorhome Club) and you have membership of the club, but deal individually with sites for stays (some owned by the club and some approved but privately owned, with their own rules). Pitches for hire are according to availability , with no guarantee, unless you pay for a seasonal pitch, so I'm confused, too.


    You can't just wander for weeks, parking as you please (unless you are from a certain background that the police seem to avoid) as local regulations can make sleeping overnight in a layby illegal. (There was a series of tv programmes about caravans, some years ago, and one featured a lady who had toured with her family since the 1940s was no longer able to do so, because she couldn't afford to use sites.)


    Unless a static van site is residential, owners are not allowed to stay all year round and most close around the end and beginning of the year, when you have access to your possessions, but cannot stay there. Relatives have a static on a Haven site and ,besides the winter closed season, are also restricted to the number of consecutive weeks that a stay is allowed.
    • Cakeguts
    • By Cakeguts 17th Mar 17, 1:21 AM
    • 3,058 Posts
    • 4,239 Thanks
    Cakeguts
    None of this makes sense to me. You start by saying that you were looking for somewhere to store your caravan but then you decided to live in it where you were paying to store it? Why? Then there is something about using your lodging address. I can't see where the lodging address comes into where you have stored your caravan. The site that is storing your caravan doesn't have to allow you to live in it where it is stored. A touring caravan is for holidays not permanent living. If you want to live in a caravan you have to find a static one on a park estate you can't just live on touring caravan sites used for holidays. You can't decide to live in a caravan that is being stored for you.
    • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    • By ScorpiondeRooftrouser 17th Mar 17, 8:21 AM
    • 2,030 Posts
    • 3,058 Thanks
    ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    Well my immediate impression is that they originally rented it to you thinking they would turn a blind eye to you staying there full time. However, there has turned out to be something about you, personally, that they don't like and they no longer want you there. If they are letting other people stay, it's because they don't dislike them the way they dislike you.
    • cavework
    • By cavework 17th Mar 17, 7:13 PM
    • 1,906 Posts
    • 2,765 Thanks
    cavework
    'A touring caravan is for holidays not permanent living.'


    Amazing as it might be , there are more and more people choosing this lifestyle and living in their touring caravan. There are people who cannot any longer afford to rent privately...there are people who are saving for a deposit to buy their first home or have suffered a breakdown of their marriage.. and there are people who just have decided this is the lifestyle they want and enjoy. Some have done this for years ...some are retired people who take their tourer abroad for part of the year. The UK does not make it easy for the people who make this choice..it insists that they have a permanent address..holiday sites have to check Council tax registrations against bookings for people looking to book sites for a long period. Laws have been created to make sure this is not an easy way of life. The people on the FB page I added earlier are decent law abiding members of the public who have made their own choice as to the way they wish to live ..
    Last edited by cavework; 17-03-2017 at 7:16 PM.
    • lincroft1710
    • By lincroft1710 17th Mar 17, 7:43 PM
    • 9,909 Posts
    • 7,979 Thanks
    lincroft1710
    There are many "fulltimers" in the US, mostly retired people who live permanently in RVs (usually coach size motorhomes), heading to the warmer southern states in the winter.

    In the 1960s/70s there were several retired Brits who lived permanently in relatively small motorcaravans moving around Europe and crossing to North Africa for the winter.
    • earthan7dor1
    • By earthan7dor1 20th Mar 17, 10:43 PM
    • 21 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    earthan7dor1
    Thank you for responding.
    Youre comment, "the last line". The figures have nothing to do with me. But yes, I am responsible for highlighting 'trolls'. I have learned, they appear to be a negative evil on anti-social media.
    Didn't mean to confuse. I'm no good thinking on the hoof. I'd prefer typing in draft and pasting.
    To clarify: I've been at my lodge address and receivde my mail there for years, But only been on this official site (with a pressure-paid hefty membership fee; albeit not ably deriving 12 months' benefit therefrom. Particularly it was 'mis-sold' discounted.
    Heigh ho. The un-named Club site Kerching-ing all the way to the Bank.
    • earthan7dor1
    • By earthan7dor1 20th Mar 17, 10:48 PM
    • 21 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    earthan7dor1
    Thank you for responding.
    I'm new to this MSE foray too! Apparently, I've lived a cloistered life.
    So help, please. What is PVW? And where is consumer rights. I'm guessing ... on MSE forums?
    Thanks again for your time.
    • earthan7dor1
    • By earthan7dor1 20th Mar 17, 10:51 PM
    • 21 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    earthan7dor1
    Thanks for responding.
    I'm actually totally off radar a propose cheats' progress. And I have never fitted any square pigeon hole!
    • earthan7dor1
    • By earthan7dor1 20th Mar 17, 10:57 PM
    • 21 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    earthan7dor1
    Thakns for responding.
    My garbled explanation has certainly thrown a spanner in the works, for which I apologise.
    A percentage of my lodge address rent (different to the Club site address) pays the Council tax. I'm not interested in creating a residency at the Club site address. I only intended being there short term, until I was ready to move on ...not as soon as I appear to be doing. Going about the county with snail carcass (caravan) on my back! Heigh ho.
    • earthan7dor1
    • By earthan7dor1 20th Mar 17, 11:05 PM
    • 21 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    earthan7dor1
    Thanks for responding.
    I'm new to camping, and this site. But I do know 12 months residency demands Council Tax. I wasn't intending being here too long ...just a bit longer than being shoved off entails.
    I know others on site are 'under the radar'. But that is not my concern.
    It is the other 'club site' I unfortunately tossed for (and to all intents, lost). But I could not afford both. Now I can't afford C&M/h Club (or whatever their name now is - why change it? It wasn't broke).
    Needless to say this experience has shaken me to the corfe - who is to say they are not in the same slurry together?
    • earthan7dor1
    • By earthan7dor1 20th Mar 17, 11:10 PM
    • 21 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    earthan7dor1
    Thank you for replying.
    In short, I'm butterflying - I neither live 'permanently' at my lodge address, nor the caravan site. One cannot live permanently at a caravan site unless it is a residential site; where appropriate Council Tax is applicable.
    I've come to realise, I should have pre-drafted my thread; not written it on the hoof. Sorry.
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