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  • FIRST POST
    • longleggedhair
    • By longleggedhair 14th Mar 17, 12:15 PM
    • 200Posts
    • 263Thanks
    longleggedhair
    Gladstones CCJ
    • #1
    • 14th Mar 17, 12:15 PM
    Gladstones CCJ 14th Mar 17 at 12:15 PM
    A couple of years ago I received a letter from Euro Car Parks demanding £100 for parking in an unauthorised area. It was somewhere I had never been and the photographic "evidence" sent was a dark photograph with my registration on. It could have been taken anywhere. I immediately thought it was a scam.

    I called the company to advise them of the above. I never heard anything from them again.

    Then last month I had a letter from Gladstones Solicitors re the above threatening court action. I called them and advised them of the above. I said the photo evidence was nothing but a dark photo with my number pate on. They said they didn't have access to the photo! But if I didn't pay £150 they would take me to court. Then after the two week notice period a court summons duly arrived, now for £250!

    I filled it in, advising the court that again I wasn't there and that the only evidence was a dark photo with my number plate on and gave details of what had happened in the time since.

    This was a couple of weeks ago. I've heard from the court to say they have referred my defence to Gladstones which they have 28 days to reply to, which as yet they haven't done. I'm a little nervous about the whole thing but I will fight it to the end. I just can't believe a solicitor would take on a case without even having sight of any evidence.

    I'd appreciate any advice please.
Page 2
    • longleggedhair
    • By longleggedhair 14th Mar 17, 8:34 PM
    • 200 Posts
    • 263 Thanks
    longleggedhair
    Thanks all. I was out with friends at the time, parked in a dark quiet street a couple of miles away from where they have alleged, but how do I prove it?!

    I'll wait to hear further, as I said defence submitted a few weeks ago so when I hear more I'm sure I'll be back picking your brains. Thanks all.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 15th Mar 17, 2:02 PM
    • 45,089 Posts
    • 57,726 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Thanks all. I was out with friends at the time, parked in a dark quiet street a couple of miles away from where they have alleged, but how do I prove it?!

    I'll wait to hear further, as I said defence submitted a few weeks ago so when I hear more I'm sure I'll be back picking your brains. Thanks all.
    Originally posted by longleggedhair
    It's not Euro Car Parks is it, your first post is not correct. Wrong firm. Use your eye for detail, please! This is court stuff! It's Euro Parking Services, you will find Blogs by the Parking Prankster about people beating Gladstones claims re that lot. READ SOME. Learn from them.

    Sadly the fact you weren't there doesn't prove your car wasn't. Have you not heard of 'keeper liability; until now? You will need to be familiar with it because they are using the POFA Schedule 4 to hold you liable.

    You will get a chance to expend at Witness Statement stage, as you will have seen when you read post #2 of NEWBIES PLEASE READ THESE FAQS FIRST'. Even though you've shot toes off with that defence, gain your legs to stand on for Witness Statement stage. Like we told MRDOLLAR in this pepipoo thread, who had written an awful defence (his reaction has been weak despite me - posting as SchoolRunMum on pepipoo - and other regulars telling him what to write to try to rescue his case which is fairly disastrously, further down the line than yours:

    http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=112339&st=0

    Final tip, read Jack Basta's and backtobasix's threads because there is a chance you can get a Judge to chuck the case out at DQ stage (you will know what that is from the NEWBIES thread post #2 about small claims, what happens when) on the fact the Particulars of Claim are as sparse as your defence.

    DQ next but Gladstones will likely send a misleading version asking for the case to be heard 'on the papers' which you will object to, of course. To be ready for that and to seize the chance at DQ stage to ask the court in a covering letter, for a strike out, see here:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=72186926#post72186926

    Jack Basta and backtobasix* saw off their claims at DQ stage with a letter as discussed in their threads. Worth a shot, and worth repeating later if not, push and push for the case to be struck out at each stage and come back to use BEFORE writing anything each time.

    This is not just a case of waiting for your court day, you have other chances in between. You have made life more difficult for yourself by making no research efforts when getting the claim form, which is regrettable but still worth a fight.

    HTH


    *search the members list for them and click on their username to read their threads.
    Last edited by Coupon-mad; 15-03-2017 at 9:35 PM.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Guys Dad
    • By Guys Dad 15th Mar 17, 5:52 PM
    • 9,866 Posts
    • 8,831 Thanks
    Guys Dad
    Witness statements from those who can swear you were elsewhere or, even better, their attendance in court.
    • Redx
    • By Redx 15th Mar 17, 7:09 PM
    • 13,659 Posts
    • 16,766 Thanks
    Redx
    still missing the point here

    its not about where the OP was !

    its about where the vehicle bearing the VRM ABC123YZ was at that particular time on that particular day

    as CM said, they are holding THE KEEPER liable for the fact that THEIR VEHICLE was alledgedly on that waste ground at that time , on that day

    they probably dont care where the OP was , even if the OP was in Timbuctoo

    the DRIVER has not been identified
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • longleggedhair
    • By longleggedhair 15th Mar 17, 7:29 PM
    • 200 Posts
    • 263 Thanks
    longleggedhair
    Thanks all. Redx, I want you to be honest with me. I've spent the last few days doing lots of reading and research as per your recommendation (better late than never) below is the defence I submitted. Should I throw in the towel now, have I ruined my chances or do you think it's worth continuing?

    I received a letter from Euro Parking Services in November 2015, they were demanding £100 for a parking charge as they claimed I had parked at a place called city heights. As I have never been to or even heard of this place I immediately knew it was some sort of scam.

    The only evidence provided was a blackened photo with my registration number barely visible-there was no evidence to prove where the photo had been taken, nothing was visible on the photo other than my registration which could have been taken anywhere. I called them to advise that I completely refuted the invoice they had sent, unsurprisingly I never heard from them again.

    Then last week I received a letter from Gladstones Solicitors with a new demand now for £160. I again called to advise that I had never been to city heights. I explained that there had been no evidence provided to me to which they responded " they had no evidence on file" I find it quite disturbing that a solicitor would take on a case without even seeing any evidence. I was threatened with if you don't pay were taking you to court which obviously they now have done for over £250.

    This matter has caused me significant distress as I have never been to court or had any issue like this in my life however I am deeply concerned at what this firm is doing to innocent motorists.

    On a separate not how can a company even if they had a legitimate claim possibly demand £250 for a parking ticket-it is wholly disproportionate.

    I therefore completely dispute this claim.
    Last edited by longleggedhair; 16-03-2017 at 12:13 AM.
    • longleggedhair
    • By longleggedhair 15th Mar 17, 7:50 PM
    • 200 Posts
    • 263 Thanks
    longleggedhair
    Another thing is the court have written to say that Gladstones have 28 days to respond to my defence (which is rapidly approaching) and that if they don't the claim will be "set aside" I'm just wondering if they are waiting until the final day to reply or weather they sometimes pull out at this stage?
    • Redx
    • By Redx 15th Mar 17, 9:32 PM
    • 13,659 Posts
    • 16,766 Thanks
    Redx
    plenty of info on Gladstones if you do the research, including similar issues to what you have asked about (check parking pranksters blogs for starters)

    I do not give out legal advice so wont be commenting on your actual defence , others with experience in these matters may do so (I do point people at this stuff written by my peers though)

    read my signature please
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 15th Mar 17, 9:39 PM
    • 45,089 Posts
    • 57,726 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Should I throw in the towel now, have I ruined my chances or do you think it's worth continuing?
    Your defence is better than MPDOLLAR's and you get to build on it later. Stop being a wetwipe, as my DD would say!

    I told you what to do next...what did you learn from the threads by Jack Basta and backtobasix, when you looked them up in the members' list? That's your next chance to get this struck out, so are you ready for this next stage, to copy what they did?
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • longleggedhair
    • By longleggedhair 15th Mar 17, 11:52 PM
    • 200 Posts
    • 263 Thanks
    longleggedhair
    Your defence is better than MPDOLLAR's and you get to build on it later. Stop being a wetwipe, as my DD would say!

    I told you what to do next...what did you learn from the threads by Jack Basta and backtobasix, when you looked them up in the members' list? That's your next chance to get this struck out, so are you ready for this next stage, to copy what they did?
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    Thank you coupon mad. I shall wait to hear further from them and get back to you all. Thanks for the help. While my defence has been poor, i shall hopefully be able to build on it by trying to get it struck out, and don't worry while this whole thing has got me down and I did consider throwing in the towel I'm not going to allow them to get away with it.
    Last edited by longleggedhair; 16-03-2017 at 12:04 AM.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 16th Mar 17, 12:07 AM
    • 45,089 Posts
    • 57,726 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Good stuff, you have nothing to lose because even throwing in the towel now would likely cost more to settle than a Judge would order, if you lose. And we win! Your defence has aspects to build on, more than you realised.

    And their Particulars of Claim are woeful and need you to draw that to the court's attention at ALL stages form now on, with an assertive covering letter, starting with the DQ stage.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • longleggedhair
    • By longleggedhair 16th Mar 17, 12:15 AM
    • 200 Posts
    • 263 Thanks
    longleggedhair
    Good stuff, you have nothing to lose because even throwing in the towel now would likely cost more to settle than a Judge would order, if you lose. And we win! Your defence has aspects to build on, more than you realised.

    And their Particulars of Claim are woeful and need you to draw that to the court's attention at ALL stages form now on, with an assertive covering letter, starting with the DQ stage.
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    Will do! So now it's just a waiting game. Pleased that you don't think my defence is too bad!

    I just can't believe things like this happen to people, and I'm not the first and clearly won't be the last. Thanks guys. A part of me is now looking forward to the fight!
    • longleggedhair
    • By longleggedhair 30th Mar 17, 5:17 PM
    • 200 Posts
    • 263 Thanks
    longleggedhair
    Well, the 28 days for them to reply to the court re my defence has been and gone with nothing from them, what happens now?
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 30th Mar 17, 11:48 PM
    • 45,089 Posts
    • 57,726 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    They don't have to send a reply to defence. The DQ form N180 stage is next, as per the NEWBIES thread post #2, and that depends on court delays at CCBC, who deal with enormous caseloads and can take weeks.

    You are at the same stage as this person:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=72328182#post72328182

    HTH
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • longleggedhair
    • By longleggedhair 31st Mar 17, 2:09 AM
    • 200 Posts
    • 263 Thanks
    longleggedhair
    They don't have to send a reply to defence. The DQ form N180 stage is next, as per the NEWBIES thread post #2, and that depends on court delays at CCBC, who deal with enormous caseloads and can take weeks.

    You are at the same stage as this person:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=72328182#post72328182

    HTH
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    I did receive a reply from the court which states "a copy of your defence has been served on the claimant...the claimant will inform the court if he wishes to proceed...the claimant must contact the court within 28 days if he wishes to proceed, after this period has elapsed the claim will be stayed"

    I have checked on MCOL and nothing has been received since my defence in late February.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 31st Mar 17, 1:02 PM
    • 45,089 Posts
    • 57,726 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Yes but that just means CCBC haven't logged it yet, could be in the pile, we've seen this stage take longer.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • longleggedhair
    • By longleggedhair 31st Mar 17, 7:58 PM
    • 200 Posts
    • 263 Thanks
    longleggedhair
    Thanks...we'll wait and see.
    • longleggedhair
    • By longleggedhair 8th Apr 17, 1:10 AM
    • 200 Posts
    • 263 Thanks
    longleggedhair
    Hi all. Quick update. I decided to call the court today as I still hadn't heard anything since I submitted my defence in February.

    I was advised that Gladstones have not responded to the court following my defence, and as such the claim was "stayed" earlier this week. The court advised that they can reactive the claim but they would have to pay a £100 fee.

    Seems very odd to me that they would go to the length of putting in a claim and then not proceed with it, but I'm a happy bunny:-)

    Thank you to all for the help and advice.
    • Johnersh
    • By Johnersh 8th Apr 17, 1:38 AM
    • 37 Posts
    • 50 Thanks
    Johnersh
    Good result.

    Good use of courts own case management powers - recognising that the case was unlikely to succeed and requiring the Claimant to do more.

    They should do it more often as nearly all particulars of claim I see on this forum fail to comply with the court requirements, which prejudices the unrepresented defendant driver.
    • Lamilad
    • By Lamilad 8th Apr 17, 1:38 PM
    • 455 Posts
    • 889 Thanks
    Lamilad

    Good use of courts own case management powers - recognising that the case was unlikely to succeed and requiring the Claimant to do more.
    Originally posted by Johnersh
    Nothing to do with the court using it's power - claims are automatically 'stayed' if the claimant doesn't respond to the defence in time

    "which prejudices the unrepresented defendant driver."

    I was advised that Gladstones have not responded to the court following my defence, and as such the claim was "stayed" earlier this week. The court advised that they can reactive the claim but they would have to pay a £100 fee.
    Not wanting to put a 'downer' on this but courts have such a backlog of claims and paperwork to deal with that claims are often stayed, not because the claimant has responded, but because the court hasn't processed the response as yet. Once they do (in such cases) the claim proceeds as normal.


    Hopefully in this case GS genuinely haven't responded - as they won't pay to lift the stay - but just want to prepare you for all possibilities
    • longleggedhair
    • By longleggedhair 8th Apr 17, 5:16 PM
    • 200 Posts
    • 263 Thanks
    longleggedhair
    Nothing to do with the court using it's power - claims are automatically 'stayed' if the claimant doesn't respond to the defence in time

    "which prejudices the unrepresented defendant driver."

    Not wanting to put a 'downer' on this but courts have such a backlog of claims and paperwork to deal with that claims are often stayed, not because the claimant has responded, but because the court hasn't processed the response as yet. Once they do (in such cases) the claim proceeds as normal.


    Hopefully in this case GS genuinely haven't responded - as they won't pay to lift the stay - but just want to prepare you for all possibilities
    Originally posted by Lamilad
    Thanks, the court did say they have a five day back log they are working on. They said they had allowed Gladstones an extra week before the stay was applied due to this apparently, but yes I won't open the champagne just yet!

    If, as it appears, they haven't responded, does anyone have any ideas as to why and what happens now?
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