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  • FIRST POST
    • Kaddison16
    • By Kaddison16 11th Mar 17, 3:02 PM
    • 3Posts
    • 3Thanks
    Kaddison16
    Ticketed between parking and paying.
    • #1
    • 11th Mar 17, 3:02 PM
    Ticketed between parking and paying. 11th Mar 17 at 3:02 PM
    Hi,

    I travelled to Bristol recently for business and parked next to the station in a RingGo car park. I have never used one of these car parks before but with it being very busy I didn't want to drive around the city centre looking for somewhere else.

    You had to pay over the phone or online (no meter) so I paid online using my laptop at the hotel across the road (so I could obtain a VAT receipt for work). I walked straight over from the car park, checked in and then registered my account online and paid for parking first thing as I didn't want to leave it to chance!

    I got back to my vehicle the next day to find a ticket.

    I was given a parking ticket by "County Parking". But the website is parkingcsl and the car park RingGo, so its very confusing as to who owns what.

    It is a hire vehicle so I sent through the following appeal a few days later.

    I received a parking charge notice on 16/2/17 at 16:30:56


    PCN number ***********


    Vehicle registration ******


    White Ford Transit


    I arrived in Bristol at approximately 16:20 and parked in car park location code 2112. I text my wife at 16:22 to let her know that I had arrived in Bristol OK.


    I was staying in the Holiday Inn Express located opposite the car park for business with meetings scheduled for the following day (see attached confirmation of booking).


    As I required a VAT receipt I opted to register my details online & pay for parking using the internet on my laptop at the Holiday Inn which I did immediately after checking in. I paid online for 24 hours parking (see attached payment).


    On returning to my vehicle on Thursday 17/2/17 following my meetings at approximately 16:00 I found the PCN above.


    As there are no facilities to pay, such as a parking warden or meter at the car park, you are only able to pay either online or over the phone. I don’t feel that the time frame between arriving in the car park and being issued a ticket (approximately 10 minutes) is neither reasonable or fair.



    Now as you can imagine, they rejected my appeal.

    The site in question is subject to terms and conditions, which are stated on signs throughout the area. Those signs state that all vehicles must be parked in a specific manner.
    On the date in question, the vehicle was parked (failed to pay for parking) and a PCN was correctly and legitimately issued.
    The photographic evidence for the charge can be viewed at paypcsl Input the vehicle registration and the PCN number. The photographs will load within a few minutes.
    I also attach an example of the signage present upon the site which details why a PCN will be issued. Such signage is visible in the attached photographs.
    RingGo
    I appreciate that you have provided evidence that a payment was made on the day via the RingGo payment system; however, this shows that payment was made at 4:36pm; six minutes after the PCN was issued. I must stress that a payment must be made at the time the vehicle is left on the site. I am sure you appreciate the abuse that may be caused by permitting such lengthy retrospective payments. In light of this, the PCN will stand.
    So I emailed them back asking for photographs (as the ones on the website didn't load) to prove the offence and for the entry and exit times for the car park so that they could prove I was there.

    They provided the photos, but didn't or are unable to provide times of entry and exit.

    This is becoming very stressful with the charge being £100 now for something I have already paid for. I'm in a new job and can be doing without the hassle.

    Parking CSL said my only option now is to go to the Independent Appeals Service. Is anyone able to offer me any help or advice. I thought just replying and being honest would be enough, but obviously not.

    Thanks in advance.
Page 1
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 11th Mar 17, 3:29 PM
    • 47,020 Posts
    • 60,397 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #2
    • 11th Mar 17, 3:29 PM
    • #2
    • 11th Mar 17, 3:29 PM
    Have you read 'NEWBIES PLEASE READ THESE FAQS FIRST'?

    You are in the right but no to IAS (only POPLA is worth trying and that's only offered by BPA members). The letters to expect are explained in the NEWBIES thread, posts #3 and #4.

    Come back if they try a small claim and don't panic; it doesn't affect your credit rating for you to defend. And we see newbies here win 99% of cases defended, if a PPC tries. But if it is this lot, summarised here by the BMPA resource:

    http://www.bmpa.eu/companydata/County_Parking_Enforcement_Agency.html

    Look how ''small fry'' they are in terms of PCN numbers and zero court claims. Expect the usual debt letters to ignore, as explained here:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5035663

    HTH, relax, this is like having an annoying fly near you, not a wasp with any kind of sting! DO NOT PAY THIS LOT.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Kaddison16
    • By Kaddison16 11th Mar 17, 4:42 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Kaddison16
    • #3
    • 11th Mar 17, 4:42 PM
    • #3
    • 11th Mar 17, 4:42 PM
    I have read through the sticky threads.

    It seems that I was right to appeal quickly as it was a hire vehicle.

    The three different companies I listed above aren't a member of BPA so I can't go down the POPLA route.

    I don't know now if they will send the PCN to the hire company, or to my company.

    I don't want the issue to be increased or to get aggro from work about it.

    I just want a fair appeal process and to have the issue ended, I don't want to end up with letters being sent every week to work that will mount up and come to a head.

    Reading about the IAS it seems like that will end up in a loss almost guaranteed.
    • Redx
    • By Redx 11th Mar 17, 4:54 PM
    • 14,472 Posts
    • 18,086 Thanks
    Redx
    • #4
    • 11th Mar 17, 4:54 PM
    • #4
    • 11th Mar 17, 4:54 PM
    I am afraid to say that what YOU want is not relevant here

    the PPC is in control, not you

    it will pan out the way you said, with debt letters and threats for up to 6 years, that is the nature of this sc@m business

    either the 6 years statute barred limitation will kick in , or an MCOL will be issued , nobody is going to cancel the pcn

    it is what it is, deal with it (like CM said)
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • Kaddison16
    • By Kaddison16 11th Mar 17, 5:07 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Kaddison16
    • #5
    • 11th Mar 17, 5:07 PM
    • #5
    • 11th Mar 17, 5:07 PM
    Well that's a load of **** then isn't it. Rip off Britain.
    • Redx
    • By Redx 11th Mar 17, 5:10 PM
    • 14,472 Posts
    • 18,086 Thanks
    Redx
    • #6
    • 11th Mar 17, 5:10 PM
    • #6
    • 11th Mar 17, 5:10 PM
    agreed, which is why we have been fighting back for several years and are still waiting for the DCLG to do something about it almost 2 years after their consultation with us the general public

    its an unregulated industry where the sc@ms are desingned to get people to break the "rules" so that invoices can be issued and court cases may follow

    read parking pranksters blogs , its been going on for years and it was hoped the BEAVIS case would help but it didnt (and that ended over 16 months ago)

    this may be new to you, but its all ancient history to the regulars here

    ps:- it would be no different if a plumber sent you an invoice and you did not pay it, they could do exactly the same , because its about the small claims court, not parking

    so if your case was about plumbing or boiler work, it would be in the D.I.Y. forum, yet the same issues would apply
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 12th Mar 17, 5:11 PM
    • 47,020 Posts
    • 60,397 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #7
    • 12th Mar 17, 5:11 PM
    • #7
    • 12th Mar 17, 5:11 PM
    Well that's a load of **** then isn't it. Rip off Britain.
    Originally posted by Kaddison16
    Yes, please join us in fighting this scam. Do not pay. Make one challenge then spend time complaining to the landowners and your MP, Trading Standards, etc.

    DO NOT PAY.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • nigelbb
    • By nigelbb 12th Mar 17, 8:53 PM
    • 1,911 Posts
    • 2,658 Thanks
    nigelbb
    • #8
    • 12th Mar 17, 8:53 PM
    • #8
    • 12th Mar 17, 8:53 PM
    ps:- it would be no different if a plumber sent you an invoice and you did not pay it, they could do exactly the same , because its about the small claims court, not parking
    Originally posted by Redx
    The plumber won't 'fine' you by adding on an extra £100 for paying his invoice 10 minutes late.
    • Redx
    • By Redx 12th Mar 17, 9:49 PM
    • 14,472 Posts
    • 18,086 Thanks
    Redx
    • #9
    • 12th Mar 17, 9:49 PM
    • #9
    • 12th Mar 17, 9:49 PM
    The plumber won't 'fine' you by adding on an extra £100 for paying his invoice 10 minutes late.
    Originally posted by nigelbb
    so come up with a better analogy of your own then and I will delete mine

    my POINT is that the small claims court is not about "parking" and is not there just for "parking" matters, it can be about any invoice for anything, it was never set up for parking but has been hijacked by this unregulated "parking" industry and the sc@mmers within that industry

    the people who come here do so because of some "parking" issue , but fail to take account of the fact that the small claims court started in 1973 and I took a car dealer to court for not paying off the finance on a car I sold him, won and had to send the bailiffs in to get my money

    no "parking" issue was involved , and maybe I should have "fined" him for non-payment , lol
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • nigelbb
    • By nigelbb 13th Mar 17, 8:38 AM
    • 1,911 Posts
    • 2,658 Thanks
    nigelbb
    The plumber won't 'fine' you by adding on an extra £100 for paying his invoice 10 minutes late.
    Originally posted by nigelbb
    so come up with a better analogy of your own then and I will delete mine
    Originally posted by Redx
    I was highlighting the special nature of these parking charges that mean they are not as straightforward as 'proper' claims for unpaid invoices. If a plumber does some work for a customer there will have been a proper contract & if the customer doesn't pay then that is straightforward & there is unlikely to be any dispute that the work work was done or what the price was or that the customer is liable. With parking charges however there always a dispute as to whether the person taken to court is responsible for the sum demanded especially with all the extras added on to the original 'fine' for legal charges & debt collection fees. Far more work understanding the law etc is required by the defendant being sued by a PPC than someone being sued by their plumber.
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