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  • FIRST POST
    • bunglebus
    • By bunglebus 11th Mar 17, 2:52 PM
    • 16Posts
    • 15Thanks
    bunglebus
    How to make up the difference between benefits and bills
    • #1
    • 11th Mar 17, 2:52 PM
    How to make up the difference between benefits and bills 11th Mar 17 at 2:52 PM
    My question is simple: How is one expected to survive off benefits when they do not pay the full amount of the expenditure they're meant to cover?

    Our rent is £750 PCM, our housing benefit is £607.64 as per the local government maximum. We are entitled to and need the three bedrooms in our house, 1 adult son who works a low paid job and gives us a bit of housekeeping, one teenaged son in full time education.
    We have a dog and two cats so moving is made difficult as few landlords will accept pets, plus if you don't have any money how do you pay for moving costs, deposit etc etc?

    Our council tax is £1419.46 P/A, of which £1102.57 is covered by Council Tax Support. This leaves approx £168.77 PCM shortfall between rent and council tax.

    We receive PIP as my wife is disabled, Standard Daily Living and Enhanced Mobility which is used for her Motability car. I receive Carer's Allowance and Income Support.

    We moved here just over four years ago, I was working full time until Dec 2015 but now I am her full time carer.

    I'm looking into a Discretionary Housing Payment but my main question is, how are we meant to make ends meet? I asked this question during a call about benefits to the powers that be, and they just said no-one gets the full amount.
Page 3
    • marliepanda
    • By marliepanda 13th Mar 17, 8:59 AM
    • 4,461 Posts
    • 8,858 Thanks
    marliepanda
    For the OP, your benefits are not there to supplement feeding three animals and an adult son who is paying you quite a small amount of lodge.

    I have two cats and they cost me around £40/50 a month with their various needs. I do not expect benefits to cover that if I was on them. I would have to cut my own personal food budget to suit, etc.

    Benefits are there to feed and clothe and shelter the person claiming and their dependant children. Not animals. Not service debts. Not continue their favourite hobbies. Not subsidise adult children.

    Therefore how you make up the deficit is up to your own budgeting.
    Survey Earnings 2017 - £163
    • NYM
    • By NYM 13th Mar 17, 9:01 AM
    • 3,352 Posts
    • 5,861 Thanks
    NYM
    Life is full of 'what if's..'

    Sometimes, no matter how well prepared you think you may be, something comes along and totally turns your world upside down.
    • Murphybear
    • By Murphybear 13th Mar 17, 9:40 AM
    • 2,963 Posts
    • 6,109 Thanks
    Murphybear
    I think it's a joke,Jesus some people have no sense of humour.
    Originally posted by bigbulldog
    OK then I withdraw my comments. My OH says the same thing to me sometimes (I don't spot a joke).
    • catz1ct
    • By catz1ct 13th Mar 17, 10:05 AM
    • 730 Posts
    • 450 Thanks
    catz1ct
    There is some very good advice on here, whether you want to hear it or not is another thing.

    • David Aston
    • By David Aston 13th Mar 17, 10:19 AM
    • 624 Posts
    • 399 Thanks
    David Aston
    It would be lovely if the Op came back with a humbled response! I won't hold my breath.
    • bigbulldog
    • By bigbulldog 13th Mar 17, 11:32 AM
    • 533 Posts
    • 580 Thanks
    bigbulldog
    It would be lovely if the Op came back with a humbled response! I won't hold my breath.
    Originally posted by David Aston
    I did in which I turned blue and fell over.
    • teddysmum
    • By teddysmum 13th Mar 17, 5:44 PM
    • 7,788 Posts
    • 4,613 Thanks
    teddysmum
    you could 'demand' all you want, but that isn't the same thing as getting it!

    first of all you would have to be eligible for social housing in the first place, and then wait, in some areas, MANY years for a property to become available.

    just because you 'need' a certain number of bedrooms doesn't mean you would get them!


    i know someone that had 7 kids in a 2 bed house.

    they youngest were 4 and the eldest had left home before a 3 bed became available
    Originally posted by nannytone
    As Savile stated, he was being sarcastic, but certain council tenants with larger families do demand more.


    I think there is a big difference, though, between older children of the same sex sharing (very inappropriate) and older children of the same sex sharing (just desirable to have your own room).


    My son has had to wait a number of years for a 3 bed house, as their daughter has had to sleep in her parents' room (again inappropriate),but this should have priority over a family where it would be desirable the 16-year -old daughter to not have to share with her 14-year-old sister.
    • Spendless
    • By Spendless 13th Mar 17, 7:30 PM
    • 19,341 Posts
    • 31,281 Thanks
    Spendless
    Life is full of 'what if's..'

    Sometimes, no matter how well prepared you think you may be, something comes along and totally turns your world upside down.
    Originally posted by NYM
    Indeed, but common sense should tell you that during the 18 years+ it takes to raise children to adulthood, you are more likely to be in for a tougher time if there's 7 kids to support rather than one or two, should something like job loss or ill-health occur.
    Last edited by Spendless; 13-03-2017 at 7:33 PM.
    • bunglebus
    • By bunglebus 14th Mar 17, 10:03 AM
    • 16 Posts
    • 15 Thanks
    bunglebus
    Hi all, thanks for the replies - it has made interesting reading. It seems that a lot of you thought I was moaning or expecting more money than we get; I wasn't, I was questioning the system and how it functions.
    The answers regarding housing benefit V rent are interesting, I could see greedy landlords exploiting that (I think £750 is a lot to pay but the house next door has just gone on the market for £850).
    I agree with some points e.g. we could move, although that has it's own cost implications, 22 year old could get his own place/increase what he pays us, I could look at part time employment (I have investigated this quite a lot actually). The Motability car may go, I was never keen on using the money that way as I have always run cheap cars and looked after them myself. Since having an accident recently my wife is questioning the value of having a Motab vehicle as opposed to buying one cheaply ourselves. Getting rid of the pets? No. They came with the wife and the pleasure they provide far outweighs a few pounds in food, plus the dog eats leftovers - recycling!
    The other son is 17 and in full time (well 4 days per week) education so I can't expect him to get a job - yet. I agree that he especially could help at home more which would free up my time to earn money.
    I would also like to point out I have worked full time since I was 17, I turn 40 on Monday and it does not sit well with me that I don't have a conventional paid job since leaving work in December 2014 - but some have said to me I am paid to be a carer so that is now my employment.

    Again thanks for the replies, apologies about any arguments that have come about as a result of this thread but I was just interested in opinions about how benefits are calculated.
    • tboo
    • By tboo 14th Mar 17, 1:14 PM
    • 456 Posts
    • 1,488 Thanks
    tboo
    My question is simple: How is one expected to survive off benefits when they do not pay the full amount of the expenditure they're meant to cover?

    Our rent is £750 PCM, our housing benefit is £607.64 as per the local government maximum. We are entitled to and need the three bedrooms in our house, 1 adult son who works a low paid job and gives us a bit of housekeeping, one teenaged son in full time education.
    We have a dog and two cats so moving is made difficult as few landlords will accept pets, plus if you don't have any money how do you pay for moving costs, deposit etc etc?

    Our council tax is £1419.46 P/A, of which £1102.57 is covered by Council Tax Support. This leaves approx £168.77 PCM shortfall between rent and council tax.

    We receive PIP as my wife is disabled, Standard Daily Living and Enhanced Mobility which is used for her Motability car. I receive Carer's Allowance and Income Support.

    We moved here just over four years ago, I was working full time until Dec 2015 but now I am her full time carer.

    I'm looking into a Discretionary Housing Payment but my main question is, how are we meant to make ends meet? I asked this question during a call about benefits to the powers that be, and they just said no-one gets the full amount.
    Originally posted by bunglebus
    Please look into this (send in the application with details of income and expensiture) as soon as possible as LA's at this time of the month are desperate to use up the money they receive, as if not they don't get the same in April for the new year
    Sorry forgot to add - that's if they have any left to award a DHP
    Last edited by tboo; 14-03-2017 at 1:17 PM. Reason: additional info


    ----------------------------------------------------------
    “Life is change. Growth is optional. Choose wisely.”
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    • Becles
    • By Becles 14th Mar 17, 3:24 PM
    • 12,845 Posts
    • 26,003 Thanks
    Becles
    The other son is 17 and in full time (well 4 days per week) education so I can't expect him to get a job - yet. I agree that he especially could help at home more which would free up my time to earn money.
    Originally posted by bunglebus
    He could get part time work. My son is at college full time but got a job last year as a Christmas temp in a shop working weekends plus occasional overtime around his college hours if they're short staffed. They're that impressed with his attitude and work ethic that they've kept him on.

    He now buys all his own clothes, toiletries and snack food. This means he's not as expensive as he used to be which would be a help to you.
    Here I go again on my own....
    • borkid
    • By borkid 14th Mar 17, 3:46 PM
    • 1,415 Posts
    • 2,593 Thanks
    borkid
    The other son is 17 and in full time (well 4 days per week) education so I can't expect him to get a job - yet. I agree that he especially could help at home more which would free up my time to earn money.

    .
    Originally posted by bunglebus
    Why? Both my two worked Saturdays and an occasional evening whilst in the 6th form as well as some temp work in the holidays. They were both in full time education and lots of extracurricular activites. They both got good A level grades and went on to do academic subjects at good universities.
    • teddysmum
    • By teddysmum 14th Mar 17, 4:17 PM
    • 7,788 Posts
    • 4,613 Thanks
    teddysmum
    When in the sixth form, five days a week and with lots of homework (grammar school which had very high expectations) a number of my friends had weekend jobs (two worked in bakery).
    • paddedjohn
    • By paddedjohn 14th Mar 17, 5:25 PM
    • 6,995 Posts
    • 7,680 Thanks
    paddedjohn
    Plenty of work in Macdonalds for young people, my lads been there since 16 and they give him shifts around his course work to suit him.
    Be Alert..........Britain needs lerts.
    • meer53
    • By meer53 14th Mar 17, 7:56 PM
    • 8,734 Posts
    • 12,680 Thanks
    meer53
    He could get part time work. My son is at college full time but got a job last year as a Christmas temp in a shop working weekends plus occasional overtime around his college hours if they're short staffed. They're that impressed with his attitude and work ethic that they've kept him on.

    He now buys all his own clothes, toiletries and snack food. This means he's not as expensive as he used to be which would be a help to you.
    Originally posted by Becles
    My 16 year old daughter is at college 3 days, work placement 2 days and also does 2 dance classes a week, she's worked since she got her NI number, currently doing 2 shifts per week at the local pub, it's a carvery type place, there's loads of teenagers work there. I don't see why the OP's 17 year old couldn't get a part time job to help out financially. It means i don't have to fund her days out/clothes/make up/music/phone etc
    • beth222
    • By beth222 14th Mar 17, 8:23 PM
    • 13 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    beth222
    If hes finding it difficult wouldn't getting a part time job make his situation worse as then he would be stripped of some of the benefits hes getting now if a wage were coming in...
    • Sleazy
    • By Sleazy 14th Mar 17, 8:26 PM
    • 5,638 Posts
    • 4,698 Thanks
    Sleazy
    Easy for me - I don't work and don't get benefits either.
    Signed Sleazy
    The Last Of The Lounge Lizards
    Right To Reply Retained
    • Spendless
    • By Spendless 14th Mar 17, 10:38 PM
    • 19,341 Posts
    • 31,281 Thanks
    Spendless
    Hi all, thanks for the replies - it has made interesting reading. It seems that a lot of you thought I was moaning or expecting more money than we get; I wasn't, I was questioning the system and how it functions.
    Originally posted by bunglebus
    I understand what you are saying. You expect the benefit called 'housing benefit' to cover all (or the huge majority) of housing costs, likewise you expect council tax benefit to cover all council tax.

    It may well be that once upon a time than these benefits once did. I remember a period of unemployment in the late 90s where I claimed for CT and didn't have to contribute a penny. Over recent years the benefits that once covered these things in full have become less likely to do so.
    • Loz01
    • By Loz01 14th Mar 17, 10:43 PM
    • 1,303 Posts
    • 2,784 Thanks
    Loz01
    Surely you're getting child benefit and tax credits aren't you if your son is at college? Your adult son needs to be paying more if you cannot survive on the money you have now. £30 a week is barely anything.
    It's not God I have a problem with... it's his fan club.
    • FBaby
    • By FBaby 15th Mar 17, 7:01 AM
    • 15,502 Posts
    • 38,860 Thanks
    FBaby
    I think the questions arose because OP used to work FT and I assumed supporting his family with his income, and never thought about life on benefits and assumed that it just took over to support them with the same lifestyle. I think a few people working who are clueless as to the ins and out of benefits assume this is the case for previous working and contributing people.

    Of course it doesn't work like that or I can imagine even more people would find reasons to stop working and claim benefits. Still, it sounds like OP is not far off it and the reason why his family have to consider some changes is because of his elder son not contributing enough, which is a luxury when there is good earner parent, not when they are on benefits.

    Saying that, I agree that teenagers working and contributing is not a concept of people on benefits only. Like many DD is in college, M-F, doing 4 A levels and now works two evenings a week and every Saturday for 10 hours and every other Sunday afternoon. She doesn't contributes towards the house bills, but now pays for her own things.
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