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  • FIRST POST
    • cwt
    • By cwt 10th Mar 17, 11:12 PM
    • 2Posts
    • 0Thanks
    cwt
    Advice please! Already own one property as buy to let but trying to buy second
    • #1
    • 10th Mar 17, 11:12 PM
    Advice please! Already own one property as buy to let but trying to buy second 10th Mar 17 at 11:12 PM
    Hey everyone

    I would be grateful for any advice on stamp duty that I could get. I currently am an accidental landlord, I bought an apartment in 2006 (shared ownership 50/50 with a sibling) and the market crashed. I relocated to another part of the country to retain in a different profession and the original property has been on a buy to let since 2008. I wanted to sell originally but the property was in negative equity.

    I'm now trying to buy a second property as my main residence as I still live in my parents house currently. I still have a buy to let mortgage on the first property. My question is would I be charged the extra stamp duty for the second property?
Page 1
    • G_M
    • By G_M 10th Mar 17, 11:14 PM
    • 39,276 Posts
    • 44,637 Thanks
    G_M
    • #2
    • 10th Mar 17, 11:14 PM
    • #2
    • 10th Mar 17, 11:14 PM
    Of course.

    Additional SDLT is charged on puchase of a 2nd (or additional)property unless

    a) it is your main residence and
    b) you are selling your current main residence

    You are doing neither of the above.
    • cwt
    • By cwt 10th Mar 17, 11:21 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    cwt
    • #3
    • 10th Mar 17, 11:21 PM
    • #3
    • 10th Mar 17, 11:21 PM
    Thanks for the advice. it all seems a little unfair given I'm effectively stuck with the original property. If I sold it within the completion date then I wouldn't be charged I presume.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 10th Mar 17, 11:37 PM
    • 39,276 Posts
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    G_M
    • #4
    • 10th Mar 17, 11:37 PM
    • #4
    • 10th Mar 17, 11:37 PM
    If it's your only property, and you sell it first, then you'll not be buying an additional property as you'll end up owning just one property.

    Therefore the additional SDLT will not apply.

    The tax is to dissuade peopke from owning 2 or more properties. This is because, as you may have heard, there is a shortage of housing in the country.

    (OK - it's to raise money for the government too, from people who are either rich enough to afford 2 homes, or who are earning rent from a BTL business).
    • AFF8879
    • By AFF8879 10th Mar 17, 11:40 PM
    • 205 Posts
    • 488 Thanks
    AFF8879
    • #5
    • 10th Mar 17, 11:40 PM
    • #5
    • 10th Mar 17, 11:40 PM
    Is the property still in negative equity? Doesn't affect your SDLT liability but sounds odd that it hasn't recovered in 9 years including the booms of 2015 etc.
    • dinkylink
    • By dinkylink 10th Mar 17, 11:52 PM
    • 141 Posts
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    dinkylink
    • #6
    • 10th Mar 17, 11:52 PM
    • #6
    • 10th Mar 17, 11:52 PM
    Brace yourself; they don't like the term accidental landlord round here!
    • cjdavies
    • By cjdavies 11th Mar 17, 12:20 AM
    • 2,212 Posts
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    cjdavies
    • #7
    • 11th Mar 17, 12:20 AM
    • #7
    • 11th Mar 17, 12:20 AM
    Is the property still in negative equity? Doesn't affect your SDLT liability but sounds odd that it hasn't recovered in 9 years including the booms of 2015 etc.
    Originally posted by AFF8879
    Depends on areas, i'm probably the same since 2007.
    • hazyjo
    • By hazyjo 11th Mar 17, 12:23 AM
    • 8,997 Posts
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    hazyjo
    • #8
    • 11th Mar 17, 12:23 AM
    • #8
    • 11th Mar 17, 12:23 AM
    Thanks for the advice. it all seems a little unfair given I'm effectively stuck with the original property. If I sold it within the completion date then I wouldn't be charged I presume.
    Originally posted by cwt
    Why is it unfair? Who told you that property prices only go one way? I don't get why people are so shocked when prices fall. In all that time surely you're not still in negative equity - you must have paid a chunk off by now, and, as above, prices have risen or reached what they were in 2009 in most areas. It's not in the least bit unfair - just sell the old property and buy another one.

    It was perhaps unfortunate for you that you (presumably) had to leave your current job and move so far away to get another job. Obviously in a falling market, it's advisable to stay put - or, if not actually owing more than you can sell for - ie negative equity - then you move to something bigger/pricier which you might not otherwise have afforded.

    If you sold it before the completion date, you would not be charged. If you sell within 3 years - you can claim it back.

    Jx
    2017 wins: Opera tickets; film preview; lipstick; Ideal Home Show tickets + afternoon tea & bottle of Champagne; 2 cases of NKD; notebook; bath rack; book; film Premiere; Broadchurch DVDs
    • AnotherJoe
    • By AnotherJoe 11th Mar 17, 8:25 AM
    • 6,295 Posts
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    AnotherJoe
    • #9
    • 11th Mar 17, 8:25 AM
    • #9
    • 11th Mar 17, 8:25 AM
    Why is it unfair? Who told you that property prices only go one way? I don't get why people are so shocked when prices fall. In all that time surely you're not still in negative equity - you must have paid a chunk off by now, and, as above, prices have risen or reached what they were in 2009 in most areas. It's not in the least bit unfair - just sell the old property and buy another one.

    It was perhaps unfortunate for you that you (presumably) had to leave your current job and move so far away to get another job. Obviously in a falling market, it's advisable to stay put - or, if not actually owing more than you can sell for - ie negative equity - then you move to something bigger/pricier which you might not otherwise have afforded.

    If you sold it before the completion date, you would not be charged. If you sell within 3 years - you can claim it back.

    Jx
    Originally posted by hazyjo
    I believe that's incorrect, although a common misunderstanding.

    From what I've read here, the 3 year concession only applies if it's your main residence you sell later. E.g. you live in A, buy B, then sell A it applies . AIUI that doesn't apply if you live in C , then buy B and then sell A)
    • sparky130a
    • By sparky130a 11th Mar 17, 8:58 AM
    • 530 Posts
    • 669 Thanks
    sparky130a
    Brace yourself; they don't like the term accidental landlord round here!
    Originally posted by dinkylink
    Probably because in most cases it's a disingenuous claim and not at all accurate...
    • sheramber
    • By sheramber 11th Mar 17, 11:31 AM
    • 3,164 Posts
    • 2,426 Thanks
    sheramber
    I believe that's incorrect, although a common misunderstanding.

    From what I've read here, the 3 year concession only applies if it's your main residence you sell later. E.g. you live in A, buy B, then sell A it applies . AIUI that doesn't apply if you live in C , then buy B and then sell A)
    Originally posted by AnotherJoe
    yES, IT IS only of you sell your main residence that you can claim it back.

    As your main residence is now your parents' home that doe not apply to you.
    • Penitent
    • By Penitent 11th Mar 17, 11:50 AM
    • 949 Posts
    • 2,562 Thanks
    Penitent
    Brace yourself; they don't like the term accidental landlord round here!
    Originally posted by dinkylink
    Every time I see it, it reminds me of this scene from The West Wing:

    Sam Seaborn: About a week ago I accidentally slept with a prostitute.
    Toby Ziegler: [pause] Really?
    Sam Seaborn: Yes.
    Toby Ziegler: You accidentally slept with a prostitute?
    Sam Seaborn: A call girl.
    Toby Ziegler: Accidentally?
    Sam Seaborn: Yes.
    Toby Ziegler: I don't understand. Did you trip over something?
    • kinger101
    • By kinger101 11th Mar 17, 1:39 PM
    • 3,586 Posts
    • 4,915 Thanks
    kinger101
    yES, IT IS only of you sell your main residence that you can claim it back.

    As your main residence is now your parents' home that doe not apply to you.
    Originally posted by sheramber
    Still technically incorrect. If you purchase house B and later sell house A that was at any time in the three years prior to the purchase of B your main residence, then the additional SDLT can be reclaimed.

    http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2016/24/section/128/enacted

    Provided of course, they haven't purchased a new main residence in that period.
    Last edited by kinger101; 11-03-2017 at 1:44 PM.
    • G_M
    • By G_M 11th Mar 17, 1:42 PM
    • 39,276 Posts
    • 44,637 Thanks
    G_M
    or the Big Bang Theory:

    Sheldon: Excuse me. I'm uncomfortable with you recommending that Leonard pursue having intercourse with Dr. Plimpton, who I assure you has better things to do.
    Penny: I'm not recommending it. I'm saying it already happened.
    Sheldon: That's preposterous. Tell her, Leonard.
    Leonard: Well...
    Sheldon: No.
    Leonard: Come on. It wasn't my fault.
    Sheldon: The implication being that you somehow tripped and fell into her lady parts?
    • agrinnall
    • By agrinnall 11th Mar 17, 2:01 PM
    • 17,478 Posts
    • 13,122 Thanks
    agrinnall
    or the Big Bang Theory:

    Sheldon: Excuse me. I'm uncomfortable with you recommending that Leonard pursue having intercourse with Dr. Plimpton, who I assure you has better things to do.
    Penny: I'm not recommending it. I'm saying it already happened.
    Sheldon: That's preposterous. Tell her, Leonard.
    Leonard: Well...
    Sheldon: No.
    Leonard: Come on. It wasn't my fault.
    Sheldon: The implication being that you somehow tripped and fell into her lady parts?
    Originally posted by G_M
    One of my favourite episodes .
    • kinger101
    • By kinger101 11th Mar 17, 2:38 PM
    • 3,586 Posts
    • 4,915 Thanks
    kinger101
    I've never watched it myself. But in A&E departments, you do get the odd patent who's managed to "accidentally" fall and get some strange implement stuck up their bottom. In one way, it's unfortunate that they happened to be naked when they've fallen, but on the other, lucky that they somehow managed to lubricate their back passage just before they fell.
    Last edited by kinger101; 11-03-2017 at 2:59 PM.
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