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  • FIRST POST
    • Niraj
    • By Niraj 10th Mar 17, 1:09 PM
    • 4Posts
    • 2Thanks
    Niraj
    MJS Capital FI Bonds investment
    • #1
    • 10th Mar 17, 1:09 PM
    MJS Capital FI Bonds investment 10th Mar 17 at 1:09 PM
    Hello, has anyone heard of or had any experience (positive or adverse) with the FI Bonds offered by MJS Capital?
Page 1
    • masonic
    • By masonic 10th Mar 17, 1:18 PM
    • 9,126 Posts
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    masonic
    • #2
    • 10th Mar 17, 1:18 PM
    • #2
    • 10th Mar 17, 1:18 PM
    Wouldn't touch it with a bargepole. 100% loss potential and portrayed as if your capital was insured and protected against loss.

    Unless you are a high net worth individual with your first £250,000 or so invested in a diversified portfolio of assets, then you really shouldn't be considering investments like this.

    Rates like this can be achieved in certain P2P investments with greater liquidity and arguably lower risk.
    Last edited by masonic; 10-03-2017 at 1:21 PM.
    • HappyHarry
    • By HappyHarry 10th Mar 17, 1:50 PM
    • 347 Posts
    • 408 Thanks
    HappyHarry
    • #3
    • 10th Mar 17, 1:50 PM
    • #3
    • 10th Mar 17, 1:50 PM
    This would be the MJS Capital PLC who set up in 2015, and the latest accounts showed they had £194 in the bank and owed £62,893?

    https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/09487689/filing-history

    What, if anything, makes you think this company could produce returns of 12% per year?

    The security appears to be offered by NCM Services Ltd, who are run as Renaco, who set up less than a year ago with a £10,000 loan.

    https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/10257834/filing-history

    What, if anything, makes you think this could be secure?
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser. Any comments I make here are intended for information / discussion only. Nothing I post here should be construed as advice. If you are looking for individual financial advice, please contact a local Independent Financial Adviser.
    • jimjames
    • By jimjames 10th Mar 17, 1:57 PM
    • 11,906 Posts
    • 10,284 Thanks
    jimjames
    • #4
    • 10th Mar 17, 1:57 PM
    • #4
    • 10th Mar 17, 1:57 PM
    Hello, has anyone heard of or had any experience (positive or adverse) with the FI Bonds offered by MJS Capital?
    Originally posted by Niraj
    Maybe it would help if you could explain what appeals to you about this offer and how it fits into your existing investment portfolio? If we can understand your reasoning for choosing this product over ones that have FSCS protection and less risk of capital loss then it may help with replies.
    Remember the saying: if it looks too good to be true it almost certainly is.
    • Sceptic001
    • By Sceptic001 10th Mar 17, 2:42 PM
    • 1,100 Posts
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    Sceptic001
    • #5
    • 10th Mar 17, 2:42 PM
    • #5
    • 10th Mar 17, 2:42 PM
    It amazes me that in this day and age when every financial product is regulated to within an inch of its life, that it is still legal to market these highly speculative ventures to naive retail punters who have no idea of the risks.

    Perhaps OP could tell us where he heard about this "opportunity"?
    Last edited by Sceptic001; 10-03-2017 at 2:49 PM.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 10th Mar 17, 3:21 PM
    • 88,338 Posts
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    dunstonh
    • #6
    • 10th Mar 17, 3:21 PM
    • #6
    • 10th Mar 17, 3:21 PM
    It amazes me that in this day and age when every financial product is regulated to within an inch of its life, that it is still legal to market these highly speculative ventures to naive retail punters who have no idea of the risks.

    Perhaps OP could tell us where he heard about this "opportunity"?
    Originally posted by Sceptic001
    In last months FCA publication, it was listed as an "emerging" concern. So, they are on it and anyone can report sites where these are incorrectly marketed to the FCA scams website
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. Different people have different needs and what is right for one person may not be for another. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from a Financial Adviser local to you.
    • jimjames
    • By jimjames 10th Mar 17, 5:01 PM
    • 11,906 Posts
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    jimjames
    • #7
    • 10th Mar 17, 5:01 PM
    MJS Capital investment scam?
    • #7
    • 10th Mar 17, 5:01 PM
    In last months FCA publication, it was listed as an "emerging" concern. So, they are on it and anyone can report sites where these are incorrectly marketed to the FCA scams website
    Originally posted by dunstonh

    If anyone feels they have been misled by MSJ capital about this "investment" product then the FCA scam reporting form is here:


    https://www.fca.org.uk/consumers/report-scam-unauthorised-firm
    Remember the saying: if it looks too good to be true it almost certainly is.
    • Niraj
    • By Niraj 16th Mar 17, 1:14 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Niraj
    • #8
    • 16th Mar 17, 1:14 PM
    • #8
    • 16th Mar 17, 1:14 PM
    Thanks for the replies, and I too agree on the old adage of if it's too good to true...
    I was enquiring since this was pitched to me by a company called direct property investments and they send you this glossy video clip about MJS Capital. Ofcourse, I did try and do various searches on this company but wasn't coming up with any red flags. But recently, looking further i did find the same about the Monies in bank and Balance sheet. Their chairman Lord Timothy Razzle has some negative publicity in web searches and there seems to be a number of companies registered at same address 39 St James Street.
    Appreciate the fca link.
    • macca1974
    • By macca1974 16th Mar 17, 4:01 PM
    • 211 Posts
    • 184 Thanks
    macca1974
    • #9
    • 16th Mar 17, 4:01 PM
    • #9
    • 16th Mar 17, 4:01 PM
    Agree with all of the above. Have just had a quick look at the website and it is unbelievably vague. But it does seem to suggest that they can produce 12% + return (say 15% pa so they can earn a bit) using a clever arbitrage system that nobody else knows about and without risk....

    Horrible, horrible idea and I would suggest only suitable for people who want to massively reduce their net worth! Might be a good investment if you were getting divorced and wanted to make sure that the ex didn't get any money as you'd lost it all!
    • Malthusian
    • By Malthusian 16th Mar 17, 4:49 PM
    • 2,411 Posts
    • 3,351 Thanks
    Malthusian
    Ofcourse, I did try and do various searches on this company but wasn't coming up with any red flags.
    Originally posted by Niraj
    Apart from the fact that they were claiming to offer 12%+ per annum returns with no risk?
    • stranger69
    • By stranger69 17th Mar 17, 12:02 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    stranger69
    Hello i have recently come across to what is called: Protected Capital Bonds with a high % return and i made an enquiry about the products.
    Can someone please tell me if they know this mjs capital plc and if it sounds right and safe?
    What i got in response was the following:
    There are some very unique features of this product that I would particularly like to draw to your attention:
    Investor capital is 100% insured via a market-leading fully-underwritten Investment Management insurance policy that has been specifically designed for MJS Capital's business model, and is underwritten at Lloyd's of London
    The Bond has been designed with multiple layers of security to give investors further peace of mind, including:

    an independent FCA regulated Security Trustee with the authority to sell underlying investments should MJS Capital default on any payments to investors
    profits are retained by the Security Trustee in a "sinking fund" in order to meet maturity obligations
    a first fixed charge over certain investments made with proceeds from the issue
    investor funds are handled exclusively by an FCA regulated payment services provider

    early redemption by investors is possible with 30 days notice
    MJS Capital will use the proceeds of the issue to generate a high-yield fixed income from private debt trade programmes that would not normally be available to individual investors. High yield is achieved by buying debt at discounted prices and selling it simultaneously to corporate clients according to agreed criteria, a process known as arbitrage. This is a regulated activity which is part of the long-established Global Fixed Income Market worth in excess of £100 trillion.
    In order to secure a 11% fixed income in only 12 months, the minimum subscription is £20,000 and thereafter in increments of £1,000.

    The MJS Capital Fixed Income Secured Bond offers a number of different investment options that may align more closely with your personal circumstances and investment goals. These are as follows:-


    High Return 1 Year Bond - Minimum Investment Level of £20,000 - Lifetime Return of 11% - Use Promo Code - PC 1
    1 Year Bond - Minimum Investment Level of £5,000 - Lifetime Return of 8% paid on maturity
    2 Year Bond - Minimum Investment Level of £5,000 - Lifetime Return of 20% paid by Annual returns
    3 Year Bond - Minimum Investment Level of £5,000 - Lifetime Return of 36% paid by Quarterly Returns
    3 Year Bond - Compound - Minimum Investment Level of £5,000 - Lifetime Return of 42.6% paid on maturity
    3 Year Bond - Compound - Minimum Investment Level of £50,000 - Lifetime Return of 50% - Use Promo Code - 50PLUS

    Many thanks
    • Niraj
    • By Niraj 17th Mar 17, 12:08 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Niraj
    Dear Stranger69, the information that you have detailed is exactly the same info that I have received. The advice from the other very much says don't touch this.
    Last edited by Niraj; 21-03-2017 at 11:10 AM.
    • stranger69
    • By stranger69 17th Mar 17, 12:10 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    stranger69
    Hello thxs for ur reply.
    No i haven't spoken. Why?
    • Niraj
    • By Niraj 17th Mar 17, 12:43 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Niraj
    How did you come across the so called investment opportunity? When I contacted MJS directly, I was told by Shaun Prince that they only dealt with high net worth individuals, i.e. over £1M. The company that deals with lower amounts on behalf of MJS is Direct Property Investments.
    • stranger69
    • By stranger69 17th Mar 17, 1:41 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    stranger69
    No I disn't see that u mention. But as far as i understood Mjs capital is the main company and they deal with money. Am totally confused now, but they said that if u open an account all the things are written that ur capital is secured and the return is guaranteed and that its covered by FCA services.
    • jimjames
    • By jimjames 17th Mar 17, 2:00 PM
    • 11,906 Posts
    • 10,284 Thanks
    jimjames
    No I disn't see that u mention. But as far as i understood Mjs capital is the main company and they deal with money. Am totally confused now, but they said that if u open an account all the things are written that ur capital is secured and the return is guaranteed and that its covered by FCA services.
    Originally posted by stranger69
    I think you'll find that is untrue. Capital is NOT secure with that investment as their website makes absolutely clear. Hence the requirement to be a high net worth investor.

    How are they permitting you to buy if you're not one? Even their website says (in VERY small print)
    Before buying any bonds bond, you should ensure that you fully understand and accept the risks relating to an investment in the bonds
    It sounds like you don't understand those risks.
    Last edited by jimjames; 17-03-2017 at 2:02 PM.
    Remember the saying: if it looks too good to be true it almost certainly is.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 17th Mar 17, 2:09 PM
    • 88,338 Posts
    • 53,555 Thanks
    dunstonh
    No I disn't see that u mention. But as far as i understood Mjs capital is the main company and they deal with money. Am totally confused now, but they said that if u open an account all the things are written that ur capital is secured and the return is guaranteed and that its covered by FCA services.
    Originally posted by stranger69
    The FCA does not cover anything. There is the FSCS but that does not apply here.

    You are 100% loss of capital potential with this.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. Different people have different needs and what is right for one person may not be for another. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from a Financial Adviser local to you.
    • Malthusian
    • By Malthusian 17th Mar 17, 2:14 PM
    • 2,411 Posts
    • 3,351 Thanks
    Malthusian
    There are some very unique features of this product that I would particularly like to draw to your attention:
    Originally posted by stranger69
    None of the features listed change the fact that these bonds carry risk of 100% capital loss.

    Having security over an asset only covers you to the extent that you would be able to sell this asset if the debtor defaulted. You are relying on the assumption that this security exists, and that in the event of default it could be sold and that the proceeds would be sufficient to pay all of the creditors.

    The spiel refers to "a first fixed charge over certain investments". What investments? The underlying investment appears to be arbitrage in bonds. If MJS Capital has defaulted then that suggests that its bond investments have gone bad, so what is the collateral?

    Returns from arbitrage are limited both in percentage terms and time, as arbitrage opportunities eventually disappear when everyone cottons on. Why are MJS' corporate clients not simply buying discounted debt from the same place MJS buys it, instead of waiting for MJS to buy it and then buying it from them at an inflated price?

    Corporate lending of this kind should only be carried out after having professional due diligence conducted into both the underlying investments and the people responsible, to ensure that everything is above board, that the expected returns are realistic and that the charge over whatever the security is has been properly recorded. Which accountants were you planning to retain to produce the due diligence report?
  • MSJ Capital
    Hello, has anyone heard of or had any experience (positive or adverse) with the FI Bonds offered by MJS Capital?
    Originally posted by Niraj
    Hello Niraj and thank you for the being the first person to post on a forum such as this one about our Bond. The number of people that help with responses are generally very good but it is worth noting that sadly some have hidden agendas and would give negative feedback on a product such as ours and instead direct you to other opportunities that they are aligned with.
    I have taken the time to respond to each and everyone’s comments and welcome anyone to contact me directly.
    As the Managing Director, majority shareholder and visionary behind the creation of the bond it pains me to see people responding on a product they know very little about and who do not take the time to understand what we have created and why before making inaccurate comments.
    Director MJS Capital Plc
    Shaun Prince
    • jimjames
    • By jimjames 22nd Mar 17, 5:18 PM
    • 11,906 Posts
    • 10,284 Thanks
    jimjames
    As the Managing Director, majority shareholder and visionary behind the creation of the bond it pains me to see people responding on a product they know very little about and who do not take the time to understand what we have created and why before making inaccurate comments.
    Originally posted by MSJ Capital
    Maybe you can explain why you think there is no risk of capital loss with your product when it has no protection under FSCS and is entirely dependent on you being solvent to repay?
    I have no products to promote but hate seeing savers ripped off by products that are not what they purport or claim to be.
    I have taken the time to respond to each and everyone’s comments .
    Originally posted by MSJ Capital
    Have you sent private messages to respond? There are no posts here that answer the questions raised?
    I am the official company representative of Energyhelpline.
    Originally posted by MSJ Capital
    I'm also curious why you're the official rep for Energy Helpline responding to an enquiry about bonds?
    Last edited by jimjames; 22-03-2017 at 5:21 PM.
    Remember the saying: if it looks too good to be true it almost certainly is.
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